Hall of Famer Bobby Layne KING OF WEAK ARMED QB's The mother of weak arms - Bobby Layne Many of you may not be familiar with Bobby Layne who is the NFL Hall of Fame. He rarely threw a spiral and his passes flutteder, went end of end and floated for the most part. He injured his arm and could not get very much velocity on his throws, but he won championships and went to the HOF in Canton. In some was he is similiar to Penny that he played threw pain and was an outstanding leader. He differs from Penny in that is said he was an alcoholicand as a leader he alled out any team mate who screwed up. Compared to Bobby, Penny is Bret Farve.
While I see where you're coming from, no one in the 40's and 50's threw spirals. It's not until the forward pass became reinnovated in the 60's at the start of the AFL.
But Chad doesn't even have a mediocre arm. Exactly how many QBs with Chad's arm strength have been constantly good against top defenses and in the playoffs? How many QBs with an arm as weak as Chad's have succeeded in the North East, where the gusty winds take over towards the end of the year? How many weak armed QBs have won the SB? It's one thing to have a mediocre arm, it's another to have probably the worst arm among starters in the NFL.
Last time I checked, it was about 30 degrees, windy and had just snowed before Chad and the Jets beat the Colts 41-0...IN JANUARY. The wind and weather didn't seem to slow him down that day. I've said it many times and I'll say it again...you are the same idiots that would rather go to war with an empty bazooka rather than a loaded pistol.
Yup. I don't know why people continue to act like Chad has to prove he's a good QB. The only thing he has to prove is if he can stay healthy.
Sammy Baugh had a superb arm and he played from 1937-52. He played the first half of his career as a tailback in the Double Wing. He was a T-formation QB during the second half of his career.
I'll take Joe Montana. His arm was no better then Pennington's but he seemed to get by. I can make a list a page long of strong-armed QBs that have been complete busts in the NFL. I just don't get this infatuation with arm strength. If Pennington had never hurt his shoulder, this issue would never come up. If Penningon hadn' t tried to come back too early last year when he clearly struggled, this would not be an issue. All preseason long, all we heard was how healthy Culpepper was and how he was going to lead the Dolphins to the division title and how Palmer had been progressing ahead of schedule and would the Bengals past Pittsburgh. Now it is week 7 and Culpepper, with his howitzer of an arm, stinks as badly as he did last year before he got hurt and has been benched for Joey Harrington (!) and Palmer has been mediocre. Meanwhile, the two "weak armed" QBs coming off shoulder injuries, Pennington and Brees, have been great this year. Go figure.
:manning: :steelers: Man! You guys just love bashin your team! Chad is doin great big arm or not he is amongst the leagues best with out a running game to help him out
honestly, i dont see how there is even a debate here. Yes, Chad is a very good QB, and uses timing and good decision making to be effective. However, he has the least amount of throwing power out of all the NFL Starting QBs. I'm in no ways saying you need a big arm to be successful in the NFL, i'm just stating that IMO, he does indeed have the weakest arm amoungst all the starters in the NFL
Putting Joe Montana's arm and Pennington's arm in the same class is ludicrous. Montana's arm was clearly better than Chad's is. Montana isn't known for his arm, but he had above average arm strength and could zip a pass when he needed to. That is just ridiculous. Have you even watched Montana play? Why do people insist on making the same fallacy repeatedly? How can you prove the non-existance of one point by proving a completely different point? That is, how can you possibly prove weak-armed QBs can succeed by showing strong-armed QBs can fail? Where do you see people saying that having a strong arm means you're in the pro bowl? Nobody is saying that. People are saying that a weak armed QB just can't succeed in the playoffs/against top Ds/in the windy conditions. People that support weak-armed QBs refuse to bring up any evidence to support their point, probably because there isn't any. Chad's pretty much lost every time he's played a good defense in a big game in windy conditions. Actually, not only has he lost, he's been completely ineffective. I don't even know why I'm wasting my time responding. You're probably trolling to get into an argument with someone on purpose. There's no other explanation for your post.
I'm ripping this off from another poster in another forum, but I'm sure he doesn't care. This is Chad's record late in the season, with a focus on windy situations. It doesn't look very good. I have my doubts on Chad, and while I hope I'm wrong, as I have a rather expensive authentic NFL Jersey with Chad's name on it that would be a lot more fun to wear if Chad becomes an HOFer, I'm a realist and root for the team. I just don't think we can get anywhere with him at the helm. I don't think there were many bigger Chad fans than me, I sunk half my weekly salary into that jersey a few years ago. Anyway, here's the post: 2003: From the middle of NOV on (previous 2 weeks were road games vs Indy and at Oak, not exactly windy situations) Jags vs Jets - Pennington throws 1 TD and 1 INT Titans vs Jets - Pennington throws 2 TDs and 2 ints December 2003: even colder and windier I'm sure Jets at buffalo: 5 yards per pass attempt. O tds 1 INT, 53.1 QB rating Steelers vs Jets: 5.7 yards per pass attempt. O TDs O ints Pats vs Jets: 5.3 yards per pass attempt. O tds 5 Ints (O TDs, 6 INTs in december 2003) 2004 Week 9 Nov 7 04' - Jets at Buffalo Pennington - 1 TD 1 INT Didnt play week 10, 11 and 12 Week 13 - Houston vs Jets Pennington - 2 TDs 1 INT - 5 yards perr pass - good game. Wasnt a windy day, I remember this game. December 2004 Week 14 - Jets at Steelers Chad goes 0 TDs 3 INTs Week 16 - Jets at NE Chad goes 1 TD 1 INT 2005 Chad didnt play in after week 4. I am not an expert on when exactly the winds kick up in the meadowlands, some days its stronger than others but it seems once december hits and the winds get stronger Chad throws for fewer long passes and alot more INTs than TDs. Anybody who says he has the arm to throw the ball downfield in the winter meadowlands is kidding themselves and trying to take everybody for a fool. We have all see Chad, especially in buffalo, NE and the meadowlands throw nothing but wounded ducks once the winds get strong.
Everytime I read one of your posts, I lose more and more respect for this board. You may want to include the Seattle game in 04 and the cold weather games in 02. Oh, it hurts your argument so you didn't post it? Oh I see... By the way, he had something called a torn rotator cuff duriing half of those games you posted
Okay, fine. Now give me a list of QBs who put up better numbers in wind and cold than they do in good weather.
You left out a few things. 1) Why doesn't 2002 count? In Nov and December that year he beat Buffalo, Denver, New England (road) and Green Bay and was impressive in all of those games. Denver, New England and Green Bay had good teams and good defenses. It was very cold and windy during the New England and GB games. And I guess the Indy playoff game was a dream 2) Let's look at those 2003 games you listed - the Jacksonville and Tennesee games were WINS. And both teams had very good defenses that year. The Titans were a playoff team and won 12 games that year, I believe. The Steeler game was played in a snowstorm. Nobody could pass that day. By the way - the Jets won that game too. 3) In 2004, every game listed Pennington played with a torn rotator cuff. You left out the Seattle game, where Pennington was very good. You also fail to mention that Pittsburgh and New England combined for 3 regular season losses that year (Pittsburgh was 15-1 and New England 14-2) and one of New England's losses was to Pittsburgh. I think if you checked the stats of EVERY NFL QB, there numbers would be worse in cold windy weather than in other conditions. It kind of makes sense, doesn't it? How do Peyton Manning's numbers look in cold windy games? To say that Pennington can't lead a team to a championship is ridiculous. In 2002, he beat 3-4 very good teams and won a playoff game. In 2004, the Jets lost to clearly superior teams and, if Brien kicks a simple FG, the Jets are playing in the AFC Championship and who knows what would have happened?
Are you serious? That was a 6-10 team in 03 which chad was coming off major surgery and those games are against teams with talent far greater than what the jets had that year. In 04 it is a fact that Chad played injured with a broken rotator cuff and still played well against the Seahawks. How about 4 td's in back to back games against GB and Indy in 02 in freezing weather at the meadowlands.
