You're the one with issues. If that statement is true, it doesn't make the converse false. That's stupidly illogical. Pee wee, HS and college have NOTHING to do with the pros. Because he was "accurate" at lower levels of competition does not mean he will be accurate at the highest level. If he puts together a string of years of accuracy, yeah, he'll be accurate. One year of him hitting some deep balls while his overall accuracy last year was mediocre does not make him accurate. Being accurate in HS does not make him accurate in the pros. Tahj Boyd again says hi. _
Essentially I agree, but I don't. After watching the Giants game, the back to back throws he had in the endzone that were dropped were beautiful throws. I couldn't believe how accurate they were, it completely changed my perception of Geno. If he keeps that up, we have something good for once at the QB position. He is doing all the right things right now and he hasn't even come close to hitting his ceiling yet, I'm excited to see how everything plays out.
WTF do you think NFL teams look at when they evaluate college QBs before the draft? Those very same people who get paid by NFL teams to evaluate players look at that tape and say yes he is accurate. So you can stop saying that it has "NOTHING" to do with the pros, because it really does. It isn't a guarantee, but your definitely more likely to be accurate in the NFL if you were at the lower levels. Tahj Boyd has never been very accurate and neither has Tebow. Again you are only looking at completion %, which does not equal accuracy. It wasn't just one year of Geno putting the ball where he wants it when he throws deep. He's been doing it for a long time and just because he's now in the NFL doesn't mean that he can't still do it. That is like saying a race car driver can't shift as fast because he went from a dirt track to Indy car.
Seriously stop arguing about the same thing. I think what Stokes is saying is that what is considered accurate at each level is fundamentally different, primarily because of the ability and overall speed and general proximity pro pass defenders have over any lower level players. On top of this, the speed of exactly what unfolds in front of you especially in regards to pass rush often force QB's who were generally considered very accurate before the pro's to regress in terms of accuracy. All of these things can effect throwing motion and the psychological connection with muscle memory follow through and genuinely effect the actual accuracy of a passer. Also, obviously accuracy is not identical to completion percentage but they are not mutually exclusive. The idea is that even if you can hit someone on a dime deep down the field once and look like an extremely accurate passer, in this league the descriptor of accurate also comes with the reasonable expectation of consistent accuracy, consistently placing the ball exactly where you want it. Not in streaks or or most of the time, but damn near always. While this is not technically completion percentage, they are very closely related.
Pennington holds the record for highest completion % for QBs with 1500+ throws. 66%. That number doesn't seem out of reach but I guess it's harder than it looks. Accuracy is a QBs ability to drop the ball where it needs to be dropped whether it be a fade, rainbow, or missile. Someone has to look at every pass and decide if the QB put it where it needed to be put. Completion % includes the WRs ability (or lack of ability) to hold onto the pigskin once the QB hits him in the hands with it. A QB throwing to Megatron could be fairly in-accurate but have a high completion % by virtue of Megatron's huge catch radius. Compare that to Geno throwing to WRs that could never gain separation and loved to drop passes. Geno's passes had to be perfect (+/- 6 inches, even on a 20+ yard throw) for the WR to even have a chance. In other words a QB might be very accurate but his WRs have a low completion % because they could never get open and when they did, they dropped the ball. Anyway, back to league high 66% completions. Getting into the 60's % would be awesome but also require our WRs to get open AND hold onto the friken football! That might be too much to ask.
Both these guys won the Super Bowl. Completion percentage isn't that great. Accuracy questionable. Flacco 59.7% reg season, 57.9% postseason when he won a ring. Eli Manning (07) 56.1%reg season, 60% postseason when he won his first ring. If geno doesn't turnover the ball and makes a big throw when he has to (oh yeah, he can also run), we will be alright.
Right now its a reach.. but i know Geno has the potential to be a poor mans aaron rodgers.. i would consider that a compliment. It shows more in his college tape.. i know this isnt college but still... he was a true gunslinger that could make it happen on his feet even though he chose not to run most of the time, he can play that way if he develops more down the path he's headed. skys the limit for my guy GeNOOOOOOO
This thread is so out of hand. Geno will never be elite. My definition of elite is being among the top 3 or top 5 qb's in the league. He is a B grade prospect. He was drafted where he should have been, in the 2nd. It was an appropriate pick for the value. The great news is that we don't need him to be elite. We can contend for a SB in the next few years if he is just solid to good.
Not just an opinion. An accurate assessment. He put up 10 points and went into the 3rd Q against a Giants team that is a shell of itself. They have a lousy defense which means we were able to keep the ball longer due to various factors you mentioned, their pass rush is non-existent, their LB's are non-athletic, The Giants may just go 6-10. Vick easily outplayed Eugene in preseason even as meaningless as it is. He was more accurate and sustained drives longer. Eugene is a drive killer. I saw so many passes in the preseason where he overthrew receivers. Eventually, he is going to get one of his WR's really hurt with those high 'accurate' throws. Funny thing is though he will be better than last year. But so what. It will not be good enough. He sucked that bad. he is a terrible red zone QB. And sooner or later he is going to get clocked by a LB because he is not as athletic as other QB's like Kapernick, Wilson, RG III. He is running way too much for the type of QB he is. He is nowhere near as athletic as Vick and Rex will not pull him either. They are already making Vick out to be a 'sore loser' for not coming into camp to try and 'win' the starting job. What a joke. If I were Vick, I would demand a trade to the Rams now that Bradford is hurt. He would be a perfect fit there.
Ahhhhh you mean like Sanchez. That didn't get us to far now did it. I bet Chip Kelly wouldn't trade Sanchez back to the Jets for Eugene. Sanchez is rockin it in Philly. Figures.
Yea just like Sanchez. Except one problem, Sanchez was never solid or good. Btw it's funny but one of the qb's most similar to Geno when comparing their college metrics is Mark Sanchez.
The Giants may go 6-10 but it has nothing to do with their defense at all. Their pass defense last year ranked 10th and their rush defense was 14th, and this year they get a healthy JPP back and have added even more to their secondary. The garbage offense is the reason why they lost last year and will be the reason why they lose this year. So many passes overthrown in the preseason? Really now. He had 10 completions during the preseason total. 4 were clear drops. 2 were passes that he threw (such as the Sudfield TD attempt) that only his receiver could catch so it would be incomplete or a reception, 2 where throw aways, and 2 passes he just clearly missed. If Geno throws only 2 inaccurate passes a game (which is about 33 pass attempts) the entire season then that would be fucking amazing, and the Jets will be headed to playoffs. That is an extremely high expectation though. And wtf are you talking about when it comes to Vick. He's been 12/20 with a turnover and 2 TD scores, which is worse then what Geno did, and Vick was playing against the backups. He's just not that good and he never has been. He's plays exciting football that is great to watch because he runs around so much like it's a video game but it's never translated to jack shit and it never will.
If we want to contend for a Super Bowl then he needs to be elite at something. Pass Accuracy. Extending Plays. Rushing Yards for a QB. Play-Action. Deep Passing. Something. Just look at Wilson last year. He was the best in the entire league in deep pass accuracy and was one of the best in the league at extending dead plays and creating 1st downs. If he didn't have those two things in his pocket the Seahawks would not have even made it to the Super Bowl, the Saints or 49er's would have taken them out, even with the defense. Wilson overall though is not an elite QB, and most likely never will be though. He's a really good QB with a few elite qualities. That's what I think Geno can be.
I agree completely, you can win a Superbowl without a quarterback with "elite" qualities; Just go ask Trent Dilfer. Granted I would not compare our team to the '00 Ravens, thats just silly, but in '09 we honestly had a shot at riding our defense and run game all the way until a few key injuries. Geno has the physical tools that Sanchez never had. Sanchez had a pretty average arm, which became evident when he tried to throw deep outs or when he needed the velocity to squeeze the ball into a tight window. Geno has a cannon. Not a Joe Flacco/ Jay Cutler /Stafford type of supercannon, but at least far better than Sanchez. Geno throws a pretty ball, so the upside is actually there. He also has good mobility, and is a threat to get out of the pocket, but importantly running the ball is a last resort for him, which is great, as it is easier to convince a guy to run more than to try to convince a Vick type quarterback to run less. I am high on Geno, he has the luxury of working with a good OC, MM, where as Sanchez was stuck with Schotty and Sparano. The reason I am willing to be patient with Geno is that he has the tools for a good upside, whereas Sanchez has merely average physical abilities and had the ceiling of Alex Smith. Geno could be really good, like Top 8-12 good in a few years. He could also end up like Tebow. I guess we will find out.
Of course, but like you said it isn't a guarantee and continuing to harp on how accurate he was in 7th grade flipping the ball to Stedman Bailey is stupid. I bet he completed 95% of his passes out on the sandlot field with no one guarding him. But because he did it in 7th grade or against James Madison (who knew James Madison played football) does NOT mean he's going to do it over an extended period of time at the highest level of competition with 4.3 speed CBs with Clowney in is face and Dick LeBeau scheming against him. Just stop with the pee wee and HS and college none sense. Exactly. Btw, Maximus is one of the smartest posters on this board. _
Nope, not at all. There are folks here that agree or disagree with me and if they're really smart and logical and reasonable I'll acknowledge it. Nearly every post by Maximus is smart, logical and reasonable. _
