Klecko Says Jets Are Out Position: Also Cimini Article on 3-4.

Moore doesn't get much penetration if any from what I saw from the Pats game, BUT, he rarely gave up ground and the Pats runners had to go left or right. Robertson always looks like he getting bent over backwards while trying to hold his ground. Most times he's getting bowled over. I think Mangini likes his spunk but I can't see why he would like him for any more than that. Moore should be getting more downs. They won't be losing much in the pass rush anyway?!

Then again, a 4-3 mix would be nice too.

 

Well we know all that. Instead of gradually bringing it in (3-4) hes laid his stall out from the start and obviously there are going to be personnel problems.
I happen to think that Vilma will never come to terms with the 3-4 and because of his smaller size has to play in the 4-3 or 4-6 system.

 

I've been saying that since DAY 1, this defense isn't fit for the 3-4. So why the hell are we running it? We have way too many peices that don't fit into place.

 

Well the problem with the 4-3 is that we lack a pass rusher, if Moore can step it up and become a starter, we won't look nearly as bad in a 3-4 defense

 

Yes. Moore has so far done an OK job.The pats couldnt run through the middle with him there , although he wasn't penetrative enough.
Vilma is an intelligent player who will understand whats expected of him , and unless as you have said we can find the personnel around him , he will continue to be ineffective.
I just hope we start with Moore in there against the Bills. Which will mean that either DRob or Ellis missing out.

damned if we do damned if we don't

 

i like the 3-4 more, back when Herm came and we switched to the 4-3 I was angry, I think the 3-4 is more effective in the NFL. Also its easier to have 4 good linebackers on a team than 2 good defensive tackles. There are scads and scads of decent linebackers in the league, but DT's are hard to come by, thats why you always see DTs drafted early on in drafts, even if they aren't outstanding players (D-rob anyone?).

Bottom line, I dont care if the 3-4 struggles this year, and I dont think Mangini does either. In a year or 2, when D-Rob is gone and we add a decent huge guy to man the nose, our front 7 could be one hell of a force!

 

We are only 1-1 and just lost oiur first game which we had a shot at winning. I do not think there is enough evidence yet to throw the 3-4 out of the window. If we go 1-2 and then 1-3 and appears it is because of sticking to the 3-4 then there is cause for argument.

 

Five of the last six Super Bowl champions have played the 3-4. It's obvious that's what Mangini wants to run. And we're better off struggling a bit this year without the best personel and making that offseason priority 1 then playing a 4-3 this year and having to switch next year. Remember this is a long term project. And we did hold New England to 7 points in the 2nd half. Just the media feeling they've been too positive about a 1-1 team.

 

The ideal way to go is to be able to use either one and change it up to confuse the opponent, like the Pats did on Sunday.

 

WHY is everyone still harping on it??? we all knew when EM was hired that we did not have the horses to run the 3-4. but it was implemented anyway and some players will adapt and some won't - those that cannot will NOT be here next year and i do believe the jets will address the front seven of the defense heavily next offseason....

along with the RB and WR positions.

i heard that klecko spot in my car and man it brings back memories - one of the best teams in history that did not at least make it to the SB. flat out said the reason was coaching and organizational issues.

man they had talent on both sides of the ball

jil

 

My thoughts exactly. The Pats were in a 4-3 more often than not on Sunday. We need to be able to make that switch when the 3-4 is not working. I still do prefer the 3-4 though.

 

The funny thing is vilma hasnt been that bad. Hes still a ball hog. Were cool.

 

FWIW, I reran the game at the most critical part - which was when the PATS had the ball at 9:20 of the 4th Quarter and managed to run down the clock to
1:15 before the blocked FG

Jet D could not make the big play when called upon. Many were 3rd down and 5+ which Brady was able to over come with short outs and passes underneath to WRs just beyond the sticks.

Very impressed with Brady's decision making. He knew what to do and when to take control. Facing a calibre like TB, any team would have a tough time of it. Jets D couldn't step it up to make the big play, plain and simple. Absolutely no pressure on the QB!

All said and done, when R. Moore was in, an immediate improvement in the run D was very noticeable. D. Rob was constantly being pushed back or pancaked whenever a run took place.

If the Jets have no QB pressure using the 3/4, and can't stop the run w/D.Rob, whats to lose going to the 4/3?

If Mangini wants to make this season meaningfull, he has to make some adjustments, otherwise, expect more of this swiss cheese D.

 

Thats exactley it! Adapt. I have visions of Belichick with his note pad and pencil quietley pondering before a game with his game plan set , then just before the game changing his mind and going with something else. This is what makes the Pats D so good , you don't know what your going to get and as said previous its 2 games in lets wait and see. Personaly if it doesn't work this season just put it down to teething problems.

 

Uhm, three of those teams happen to be the patriots, So I don't think that arguement really goes far. (The other one was Pitts, and ravens, and tampa being 4-3).

 

and by hall hog, do you mean ball hawk?

but anyways, i agree with klecko, i feel like vilma needs better protection up front to use his speed, cause lets face it, he is undersized

 

Size isn't necessarily what makes players suited for one system or the other, it just so happens that the bigger players have traditionally been better in the 3-4, but they've also traditionally been better in the 4-3 as well. As mentioned by someone else in this thread, San Diego runs the 3-4 with a small LB as well. We need a true NT. Look at how even Ray Lewis suffered without having a true NT last year, and look at how he's upped his level already again this year. It's not the system that makes the player, great players will succeed in any system. You're going to see Vilma really excel in the 3-4 once we get a better NT in front of him (*cough get rid of DFat cough*). The 3-4 generally allows an MLB greater freedom and lets them take over games more. Personally, I'm really eagerly anticipating what Vilma can do in the 3-4. I have a hunch that he's going to turn into an absolute monster. I have a real good feeling on Vilma. I honestly think that next year, if we can get a true NT in, if Vilma can grow enough, he could just be that one player on D that takes us to the elite level.