Revis clearly did nothing to help the team prepare for this season. Mangold wanted a deal too and he knew that being in camp was important because of the new guy at LG, whoever that turned out to be. Being in camp for your teammates is part of being a leader. Revis obviously has abdicated that role in favor of getting paid. He's out on the edge now in lots of different ways and it becomes hard to argue that you're irreplaceable when you're not part of the glue holding things together, the way Mangold was.
I agree with your point but where I was going with it was that when the Jets lost, it was usually a multipick game from Sanchez and the defense didn't get the ball back. You are right though. If Sanchez is a game manager this team will win more than 9 games. He can make plays and throws a pretty deep ball, but he just needs to be consistent. When he's good, he's on fire. When he's bad its an ugly game. I just don't see that happening with more and more experience behind center. But that's just my gut feeling.
Given the number of TDs scored against our offense and ST last season, I'd say the 2.5 pts is much less significant than you're making it out to be. To be honest, I wouldn't be surprised if it makes up the difference, since I can think of at least 5 TDs coming from those two areas.
Like I said in the other thread, prior to this weekend, I had the same concerns about his missed camp time. Then I talked to some former players. They told me my concerns were overblown. Apparently, I was overestimating the impact of his absence before, just like a whole lot of people are doing here.
We lost at least two games last year because the run defense could not hold the other team in check, those being the Dolphins Wildcat stampede and the Jaguars game. You can argue pretty convincingly that we would have lost the Saints game based on our inability to stop the run but Sanchez was terrible also and so it was a joint effort. The Jets run defense was very inconsistent last year, with some strong efforts and a few weak ones and a few unfortunate late game drives against where the defense just wore down and got pushed around on the ground.
The difference between 196 pts allowed and 236 points allowed is pretty much the difference between an all-time great defense and just a great one. Those are accurate characterizations of the two defenses.
The Tampa Bay offense and special teams allowed 4 TD's in 2002. The defense scored 6 TD's. That's straight scoring, not short field setups.
Fine. I ran the numbers. The 2002 Tampa Bay Buccaneers gave up 176 points ON DEFENSE. They had two TDs scored against their offense, including an INT return for a TD in overtime, hence the 13 point discrepancy as no PAT was kicked. The 2009 New York Jets gave up 188 points ON DEFENSE. Again, a missed PAT accounts for the 48, rather than 49 points scored against our offense. Is a 12 point difference still the difference between an all-time great defense and a great one? IMO, the Bucs were an elite defense. We weren't. However, I'm at least willing to admit it's an "I know it when I see it" argument, rather than one that's backed up by the reasons you're throwing out. There's no discernible difference statistically. In fact, the Jets had one more shutout if you count the Texans game in which the only TD scored was against our offense.
I just ran through again, game by game. I had missed one TD scored against the O/ST. That makes 3, not 4. I adjusted my numbers in the previous post. They also scored 4 defensive TDs, not 6. I remember at least 2 for the Jets from Revis and Douglas.
I'm sick of talking Revis so I'm jumping in late. IMO in a blink of the eye we can become a dominant Offense. Mark has all the tools and weapons to do so, as long as he gets some time in the pocket and continues to improve his awareness the sky is the limit. As previously mentioned if we keep a top 5 defense and a top 10 offense we will be damn hard to beat. All this can be done without Revis. At this point I'm not even sure I want him back, he has no chemistry with any of the secondary. The only player he's played with is Leonhard. I'd rather just move past this Revis crap and look forward to a great Jets season.
Actually they scored 5 defensive TD's, I added in a punt return in the fog of 1am posting. The TD's were: Game 2 - 97 yard interception return by Derrick Brooks. Game 3 - 39 yard interception return by Derrick Brooks. Game 4 - 25 yard interception return by Sheldon Quarles. Game 5 - 15 yard interception return by Derrick Brooks. Game 7 - 11 yard fumble return by Derrick Brooks. They allowed 3 TD's on turnovers and special teams. Not sure what I double-visioned here. TD's were: Game 1 - James Allen interception return in overtime. Game 4 - 51 yard interception return Brian Simmons. Game 15 - 30 yard interception return Chad Scott
Apologies if already posted. Warren Sapp's take. http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-netwo...ll-Sanchez-hold-back-Jets?module=HP_headlines
to chime in on everything that has been talked about lately, If he holds out to the regular season, Revis is definately in the camp of hoping the Jets start 0-2. If you are thinking anything else, then the question becomes why the hell is he holding out? To prove the Jets need him more than he needs them, and subsequently they need to pay out the nose for him. If you want to believe Revis is thinking its win-win for him if the Jets win or lose, you are nuts. I also believe Rex is dead serious about fielding a dominant defense without Revis. He never had a revis in baltimore. Yes he had Mccalister, he was a very good cb, but he certainly wasnt the best on the planet. He has made a living with a dominant defense with studs at ILB and an above average DL with one dominant player, and a solid secondary. Shockingly enough, thats what we have now! Harris and Scott might be the best ILB tandem in the game today, and we have a good DL with a dominant Jenkins, and a damn good backup in Sione Pouha. With i think we can all agree a pretty good starting secondary. I also think that Sanchez will be a better QB this year, as somebody said (i believe it was Willie) his most important stat is the 64.5% completion percentage this preseason. I also think a lot of his forced throws are designed that way to an extent. Schotty is saying to him pre game and in his ear, "hey lets run this and get the new guys involved" and Sanchez is going in pre-snap thinking ok LTs getting this ball instead of if LT is open get him the ball, if not move on down the progressions. In the regular season, I don't think it will be as bad an issue. Schotty will stress going through the progressions, and Sanchez will be fine in the regular season. Will he make mistakes? sure, but i don't think they will be as bad as this preseason. Also what we have seen this preseason which was actually my biggest worry is that we are running the ball very well. I was hopeful that LT would find the fountain of youth at times this season, but it really looks like he can be a fantastic player for us. Greene also looks like he might be in better shape this year than last, which should scare the ever loving shit out of defenses this year. The OL appears cohesive, not anywhere near the level of last year, but they appear primed to be a top 10, maybe a top 5 OL this year, even with a young inexperienced guy in Slauson. Slauson also appears to be a pretty good pulling lineman, and appears to be at least the pass blocker Faneca was last season
Just going off past observations from watching NFL football for many years (and I have no stats to support this), I think we will see a very similar level of production from Mark Sanchez this year, as is the case with most 2nd year QBs. This is not gonna be the Rams "Best Show on Turf" team from a few years ago by any means. And with that in mind, to my point ... I see a talented "defense&run" team that has a good chance to make the playoffs as a wildcard again, with a very similar roller coaster season as last year. The defense will be consistent and special teams will win us a game or two and Sanchez will lose us a game or two (or three). BUT...THIS IS NOT "THE ALL THE CARDS ON THE TABLE" YEAR because EVERY YEAR is "ALL THE CARDS" year, and thats the same for every team...Management and Coaching Jobs are to tenuous for "team building" years. Getting closer to my point ... I would love to have Revis back this year, but if the deal cant get done I dont think it crushes all our little green and white dreams. Get the most we can for him and move on. Yes, the media will lob bags of crap at us, but we are the Jets / Jets Fans so we are used to that anyway. I've got some confidence in Tanny and Rex to do whats best for the team and if we lose Revis, then I will assume it was, in the long run, the best decision. Case in point Dbrick vs. Leinert ... hows that unpopular decison working out.
I seem to remember a certain picture that describes this........I wonder if it will rise from the Cesspool of darkness?
The Jets will only go as far as Sanchez takes them ...Well duh. All teams can only go as far as their QB takes them--I don't care if you're the '01 Ravens with Dilfer or the '07 Pats with Brady, at some point your QB will have to make a play. That said, Sanchez does not have to be great; he just needs to be good enough. I feel like the addition of Santonio Holmes and the memory of the AFC Championship Game have led some people to believe that the offense is going to be completely opened up, and I don't think that's true. Sanchez will have more autonomy, but we're still going to be relying on our running game and that's going to win us games just like it did last season. And I believe Ryan when he says we'll be fine on defense. If Revis doesn't play, it's obviously going to hurt. But at the end of the day, the impact of going from Revis and Cro to Cro and Wilson isn't going to be large enough to completely derail a strong group of 11.
I agree with the premise of this post. Last year the narrative of the Jets was running and defense. I think that as the team evolves the narrative needs to shift away from those two areas to Sanchez. They will still be the focal points of the team but I believe that Sanchez will be the difference between those areas making us good and making us a championship team. The Jets have surrounded Sanchez with a ton of help that most young quarterbacks could only dream of having... he needs to step up his game big time. More big plays, less mistakes. He needs to mature and he needs to lead the team regardless of the defense and the running game. The defense and the running game need to be the complements to Mark Sanchez to make this team dominant... not the other way around. We saw this in the playoffs... hopefully we see it on a consistent basis throughout his career.
