Okay, so a little reflection on our offseason so far. Our "first" draft pick was our new starting nose tackle. Say what you will, but it's a very good "draft pick" in terms of value at this point. I'm a little unhappy with picking Gholston (though he was the only guy left I wanted), since I wanted to trade down. NE was able to trade down right after us, so there had to be offers on the table for us. (Though I'm hearing NE was taking Gholston if available. I don't want the Jets getting into the Yankees/Red Sox methodology of keeping players out of the hands of the enemy though. It's a waste.) I'm unhappy with the Keller pick. Not because the kid doesn't have talent, but because we ignored needs. I'm no fan of BPA. I want the BPAFTN (Best Player Available Fitting Their Needs). Our QBs aren't known for utilizing the TE, and since we're obviously committed to Penny and Clemens for the next couple years, I see this as a wasted pick. I'm disappointed we didn't put depth on the OL till very late. Also, I would have liked to pick a corner earlier. The CS/FO is putting an awful lot of faith in guys who played on a losing team last year. Overall, I gave the draft a C. I give the FA moves a B+, and I average out our offseason so far to a B. So what do you all say?
How do you know Clemens doesn't utilize the tight end? Maybe Chris Baker just couldn't get open enough last year. Or perhaps the coaching staff didn't call a lot of plays for Clemens to throw to the tight end. I think it's foolish to judge the Keller pick by both our history of drafting poor te's in the first round, and our more recent "underutilization" of the tight end. They're going to use him if they drafted him.
I agree with the grade of our FA moves being a B+ but the draft I think has the potential to be solid especially if Lowery plays up to his potential and becomes the steal I think he will be. As of now i give our draft a B because we did get Gholston a consensus top pass rusher, and we got the best offensive recieving weapon on our board in Keller. So clearly they believe he will be solid, and so far when we trade up for a guy, we really covet them, and they have turned into something special. Lowery and henry have a chance to be steals, and Garner looks to be a solid depth guy. So I agree with the Overall grade for the offseason being a B and the FA moves, but I think a C is kind of low for the draft, have some optimisim man!
they say keller is a Dallas Clark type player and can run the seam well. too bad we dont have peyton manning who throws the deep seam well.
Keller ran a 4.5 and will be used as a flanker, a big 245 pond flanker that will do one of two things.. 1) absolutely run over the little 190 pound corner or nickel (think Ray Mickens) who tries to cover him or 2) completely blow by the slower LB down the seam for an easy six points. That is why I like Keller a lot. Look at the tape of him and he is def more a WR than a TE.
I graded it a 'C' also, not excited about the Keller pick also kinda pissed we didn't address the depth issues on the lines. However lets see how this works out before we start calling it a 'bad draft' or calling players a 'bust'. I'm glad we got some competition @ the QB spot also. Can't wait for the season!
We don't know that our QBs dont like utilizing the TE because we have never had a TE that can stretch the field like this kid is going to be able to. I don't think you could say he didn't fill a need either, we have had average to bad TEs since Micky Shuler and besides that he is not going to be your traditional TE. He is going to create mismatches and be a playmaker which the O desperately needs. If he is utilized properly and one of the QBs steps up he will be a great weapon. My favorite pick of the draft, in which I also really liked the Ainge & Henry picks.
Utilize what?......when your Oline caves in in 2 seconds......and all recievers are pressed with lb blitzes......you cant do anything.....this year should be different..defenses are not gonna come in with that gameplan.....O line should give KC time .Keller should be tough on D's
I have been saying this for years and years and years. However IMO it is the coaches who don't utilize the TE. For a QB like CB, the TE could and should be a viable option a lot of the time. If the plays are not in the playbook though, you don't have that option. It was evident these past two years that when CP checks down and finds an open Baker, quality gains are made. We should have re-signed Baker, extended him to an extent, he is good not great but good, and not drafted a TE. That is my opinion.
Hey Alio, I am not particularly happy that we waited until the 7th to address the Oline. And I wanted us to trade down as well for more picks. That being said. I wasn't expecting the Keller pick, but I am happy with it. Tannenbaum was able to get a 5th back later in the draft. And I doubt he would have been there at 36. The Giants were eyeing him I think because of the Shockey fiasco, and Tannenbaum said today on "Mike and Mike" that they heard a few teams were trying to trade up to get him - IMO it was NO and Seattle. (So I highly doubt he was going to be there at 36) He can be that big playmaker on the offense we need. Perhaps Schotty didn't use the TEs because we didn't really have any good enough to stretch the field? Baker is overrated by TGG fans I think. He can be our Dallas Clark. I think Ainge was a solid pick. Even if we develop him for a while then use him as trade bait 4-5 years down the road for value. It is something GB has been doing for years. I trust Mangini when it comes to DBs, if nothing else Lowery can be our nickel ala Mickens. The WR and OL I am not too familiar with so I won't comment. Like I said I would have went OL. But I can see what they were trying to do. I would give the draft a B-. The free agency was very good. Faneca, Jenkins, Pace, Woody, Richardson, Franks, all solid players that will give leadership to what is really a young team. Add to that we were able to dump most of DRob's contract through a trade. And Vilma had a bum knee and didn't fit the system - we were able to get a fourth and a possible escalation next year to a 2nd/3rd. So I give the FA player moves an A. We also have to consider the changes on the coaching staff. Callahan was a HUGE pickup for us. He will instantly help with the OL and TEs. Westhoff was a big loss, but O'Dea was as close as we were going to get. The FA coaching moves I give a B+ just because Westhoff was a major loss. That averages out to a B+ for the offseason so far.
I would please ask all of the Dustin Keller haters to go onto youtube, and please watch some of his highlights. This guy will rarely line up at the tight end spot, and if he does, he will be 25yds down field before you know it. He is going to be in the slot most of the time, and even wide out (and have Coles in the slot)...Keller is going to take advantage of mismatches, easily burning 95% of all linebackers in the NFL. Let's have some faith, and not compare him to Kyle Brady, or Mitchell, or Becht. This is a new era, a new type of player...a FRESH START. I'd like to see some encouragement here, because I'd like to believe our FO knows more about who/what they need to get to the next level than us.
Okay, again, I don't knock Keller for his talent, and he was probably BPA for the spot we picked him. However, my point is, with the QBs we currently have, we don't utilize the TE. It's not because the playbook doesn't contain plays for the TE, since Schotty Jr. adores the TE position as an offensive weapon. Is it because the talent hasn't been there? Possibly. I agree with those that say Baker is overrated as a pass-catcher. However, Baker is still an above-average pass catching TE, so it's not like there hasn't been a weapon available. Our QBs simply ignore it. As for those who think Keller will be used in all sorts of configurations, Tannenbaum was on ESPN early yesterday morning, and stated flatly that they see Keller being a traditional TE, with a full TE skill set. He's not going to be lining up in the backfield, or on the outside. What it comes down to for me is that I never want to go BPA. I want to pick the best player who fills a need. That means taking a guy who might get drafted 10 slots down the board, if necessary, if it means he makes the position you filled in stronger. I would have gone corner with that pick, and I doubt if I would have moved up to do it. I'm not being negative here. I have optimism and I still hold out faith in this organization's goals and methods. I just simply don't agree with the picks they made this weekend.
I didn't hear Tanny say that...THEN, if that's the case, I agree with you. I wanted to see us go after Hardy from Indiana, who would have still been available at our original spot without trading up. Regardless, I'm optomistic about the 2008 season...Sorry, just tired of hearing most of the Jets fans b!tching and moaning about the draft already.
Our QB's don't ignore the TE, he just isn't downfield in a pattern very often. Watch the films from last year and you will see Chris Baker pass blocking against an edge rusher more than half the time on passing downs. The Baltimore game is a perfect example. On both of the throws to Justin McCareins (the catch and the drop) Baker is sealing off a blitzing safety or linebacker. On the TD throw Clemens gets nailed by a blitzing safety a split-second after he lets the ball go. Who catches it? Baker of course, who would otherwise have been blocking the blitzer. The Jet's protection schemes are not setup to utilize a TE as a pass-catcher and they have not been setup to utilize a TE in that role since before Becht arrived on the scene. People who think Chris Baker is not a superior pass catching TE just don't understand the constraints he's been working under for 4 years. When the job is block first and catch second if the rush allows you don't catch a ton of passes. BTW, I expect the Jets to give Baker the Pete Kendall treatment and run him out of town before camp is over. It won't matter to them that he's the best TE on the roster and that his absence will make the offense less functional. It's all about who has control with these guys and they're damn well ready to go 4-12 to prove it.
Yes, that is a more accurate description. For an offense that seems to lean to dinking and dunking, you'd think Baker would have had more than 70 recps in the last two seasons. That's a little more than 2 catches per game.
It is not the QB that utilizes the TE, it is the OC. If shotty draws up plans to highlight the TE then that is what will happen. When we picked Keller we picked the best receiver available. The fact he does not line up as a WR is mostly moot. He fills a huge need. The need for us to utilize the middle of the field. If LBs are worried about him in the seam they can't just key on the running game and it also gives the S more to worry about thus giving coles and cotch better opportunities. So if this guy does his job he has the ability to significantly improve our run and pass game. That fills need.
Again, I don't necessarily disagree. I like Baker as a pass-catcher. I wouldn't go so far as to say elite, but definitely a good pass-catcher. I still don't think he's any more than an average TE when it comes to blocking. Is that unfair? Maybe. As for running him out of camp, according to the same interview I spoke about above, Baker will be in camp with Keller and (I think he said) Pocsiak, all as rotational TEs in the starting offense. I think they'll work something out with him in the end.
Dustin Keller is a LOT faster than Chris Baker. Chris Baker does not separate from people -- only in the Red Zone can his height and pass-catching ability be taken advantage of. You need to separate, and you need to have quick deft moves to get open on the seam and over the middle 12 - 15 yards out. This lack of production from the TEs is more about the receiver and less about the quarterback.
Baker blocked last year more because the offensive line was awful and because he gets no separation in his patterns. If the Baker issue gets nasty, then we can cut or trade him and we have a replacement. If we can resolve it, we have a dangerous goalline set with the 3 TEs, Richardson, and Jones. If not, we can either put in Kowalewski or Pociask, or maybe a WR. I have to think Keller is a different animal. If there were the label WR next year, people might like the pick more, and the way I think we'll use him, he might as well. The Jets' protection schemes, with Brick, Faneca, Mangold, Moore, and Woody, should be much better, freeing up our TEs and WRs to do more. I wish we took an OL a little higher, but hopefully we can do that next year, since our starters this year should be fine.
