I think the Giants beat some very good football teams and they did it in very tough conditions at times. They deserve all the acollades that come with a SB victory; it was no fluke. P.S. Look at Hornet's vCash - pretty good, huh.
It does make you wrong, they just won the Super Bowl against an AFC team that was unbeaten. What difference does it make if we beat the Pats in the AFC title game first and then an NFC team in the Super Bowl? The point is if you get in the playoffs you have a chance to win the Super Bowl. Completely contrary to everything you've posted on here the past few years. You want to "rebuild" and go 8-8 just to get your boy in there, completely ignoring the fact that you can't win the Super Bowl unless you first get in the playoffs, even if you won 10 games. The Giants just proved your entire theory wrong, so why don't you put a cork in it and come up with a new one?
We have a chance to win the SB in 09 right now, we have a chance to win until we are eliminated and we have a chance to win if we make the playoffs. A chance and being a serious contender are two different animals.
Would you have considered the Giants a "serious contender" until yesterday or two weeks ago? Don't lie. They needed a comeback at Buffalo in the snow just to get in the playoffs in the NFC.
I thought and said both last year and this year in TC that the Giants had one of the most talented teams in the NFL. Looking honestly at the league I think they have as much good personal as any team in the league with the possible exception of the Cowboys, Chargers and Pats. I'm not that suprised, I thought the Cowboys would beat them in a close game but once they beat the Cowboys I thought they had an excellent shot at getting to the SB. I thought they should have gone farther last year. If they didn't have all the injuries they might have.
He fails to realize that point. The concept of we have no D-line and half an offensive line is lost in his world. He thinks lightning can strike four weeks in a row and we can make the big dance with Adrian Jones at Tackle and Brad Smith as your third receiver.
I want to rebuild because we have to. Clemens may not be the answer but Chad is definitely not. It takes years to build a winner not one offseason. What Theory did they prove wrong. The Giants have the Talent to win. We do not! Please reference the WInston Bigs Serious Contender email.
They proved wrong your theory that 10 wins isn't good enough and a 10 win team has no chance to win the Super Bowl. You've said it on here about a million times in reference to Chad winning us 10 games and getting to the playoffs. Chad has proven he can get us to the playoffs with a half decent team (see 2006 as the latest example), which is exactly what we're talking about. I'm not saying don't improve the team, I'm saying don't bank on being bad to eventually be good just because you put a younger QB in. Sometimes it works out that way by pure chance, but your plan should never be to step backwards. The plan is--every year--to try to win games, make the playoffs and give yourselves a chance. You guys want to get rid of a QB who has proven he can do that for us, which is the root of the whole argument. If Clemens turns out to be the guy who can do it, fine, but until we know that you keep the guy you know can do it and have seen do it three times.
The Giants won 10 regular season games with Eli Manning for the most part playing below his potential. Could the Jets win 10 games with Chad Pennington as QB and a better team around him? Probably which would give them a shot to do what the Giants did this year, no question. But when your best case scenario is barely make the playoffs and have to win 3 games on the road to get to the Super Bowl I think you have to look into upgrading. I don't know if that's Clemens but I'm tired of saying "well if we have the potential to win 8-10 games, if we get some help, maybe a team gets an injury for the first round of the playoffs..." It's time to start building a long term team that will compete to go deep in the playoffs, not just make them.
That's obviously what every team is trying to do, people here act like that's some novel idea. But again, the point is the difference between making the playoffs and going deep in them is miniscule in today's NFL. You get in and get hot, that's what it's about. The Steelers two years ago were also a 6 seed, it happens. If you're there it happens, if you're not there you have no chance.
There are 25 Qb's who can get to the playoffs if they are surrounded by the right talent. Once you get there everyone is going to be good and the difference between the winners and losers usually has to do with what the man behind Center does at some point during the playoffs. Chad can not win a game with his arm or legs and unfortunately as Manning, Brady, Big Ben and every team in the last 20 years except the Buccaneers and Ravens the man behind the center has to make plays. Chad has proven he can get us to the playoffs. With the exception of One game against the Colts in his first season he has done nothing else to show that he can take us further than that. We have seen him fold like a deck of cards in the playoffs time and time again. To get to the next level he has to be upgraded as well as a lot of other parts on this team. What would have happend if Chad had to throw against the Pats like Eli did yesterday with 1.49 to go? We all know the answer to that now don't we. We saw what would happen this year four or five times against lesser talent. It has been six years and im sick of waiting for a miracle that is not going to come.
I think the thing that your missing when you say if you get hot you can win is the teams that have done that have had superstars who stepped up at the right time. Chad nor anyone on our team has the ability to do that. There is not one person playing below their ability either. Look at the cast on these teams then compare them to what we have and you will see a huge gap in talent.
Getting back to the main thrust of this thread: This Super Bowl showed me two things: 1. You need strong lines on both sides of the ball. I want the FO to concentrate on that this offseason in both FA and the draft. Nothing else matters till that is done. Could we use more WRs, sure; can we upgrade in the secondary, of course. Yet none of that will do any good till the OL and the Def front 7 are solid. Fix that, and other things will fall into place. 2. It takes years for a QB to get comfortable. Clements did not get a fair shot this season. Half a season behind a swiss cheese line isn't enough to evaluate a QB. He needs at least another full season before we can even just begin to have an idea of what he can do.
Going into this season the Giants had all of the following: A great defensive line and a solid linebacker corps and secondary. A good offensive line and a solid if unspectacular set of wide receivers, a good TE, several runningbacks to carry a runningback by committee and a potential franchise QB who had not proven out yet (he still hasn't BTW.) Going into next season the Jets have the runningback by committee thing down and are missing all the other checkmarks. The Giants had a legitimate shot at the Super Bowl going into last season, it just required a bunch of the checkmarks to actually get made instead of just being there on paper. The Jets have not had a legitimate shot at a Super Bowl since 1998.
How can you say 2002 and 2004 were not legitimate shots when we were right at the door? We weren't the best team those years, nor were we in 1998, but we had a shot. You guys and your hindsight, just because Doug Brien can't kick we had no shot? Whatever.
