Naive....We need offensive line dont we? Why wouldn't we bring in Faneca? We obviously need D-line as well...Im naive? I think this is all realistic if this franchise decides that they want to put together a winning team.
Ahh..now you have it. This franchise pays for a head coach and GM that are about the lowest priced of any in football. They could care less (Johnson) if we ever win. They prove it in everything the do and don't do.
Before the season started, I was expecting 8-8, 9-7. I dont believe anyone who says they knew the Jets would be 2-9. That is way below everyone's expectations. If after two years of this reigme, the team is "COMPLETELY de-void of talent", that would indicate a piss-poor job by the FO/CS so far. That doesnt inspire too much confidence for the future.
Im not saying you dont know what your talking about i agree with your list except for Brad Smith ? He's a terrible reciever i know he's a QB turned Reciever but his talent as a reciever isnt quite there just too many dropped passes this season but then again McCareins and Cotch have dropped there fair aswell. Seems like the recievers get shy without coles there.
Kurt I have no issue with the HC right now and in fact he is looking pretty smart on waiting to put Clemens in until the season craped out with Chad before throwing Clemens out there. Brick while showing signs of improvement is hardly showing signs that he will be a top 10 LT in the NFL and KC while showing some flashes of talent is far from proving he is a quality NFL QB. Jones is basically a veteran, decent not great, running back. Harris, Revis and Rhodes are clearly superior young talent, Washington is an excellent special team player who has yet to find his nitch in the O, Cotchery has had one good year and is proving he is far from good enough to be a true No. 1 when going against the No. 1 CB of the opposition and Brad Smith while showing to be a really nice special teams player is really a practice squad WR with talent. Reality we have what looks like 3 players with the talent to create mismatches on D, Revis, Harris and Rhodes. We have not one on the O side of the ball. Besides that we are terribly weak at the point of attack on both sides of the ball. We did a nice job of masking our weaknesses against bad teams last year and Pennington was sound enough despite his limitations to run a scheme that executed perfectly all year with no mistakes and no injuries. This year a few guys are nicked up, the scheme isn't fooling anyone and when we do execute we don't have players who are good enough to create the mismatches we need to win consistently. The only thing that you can say is against the none elite teams we are in the games. The two games we played against real contenders we were mauled. I figured we go 7 & 9 this year but with Chad breaking down and Jones getting off to a bad start, maybe because of a bad preseason injury? we ended up lossing the close games against the weaker teams we won against last year. This team needs more than just beefing up the lines, we need a couple of players who can create physical mismatches with their talent on the O side of the ball. We also need Clemens to be the real deal which right now is a complete unknown. If I was an optimist I would have to say Clemens will be a great QB, we pick up a couple of FA's in the off season who change the overall chemistry on the OL and DL and we pick up 2 guys in the draft who are physically superior talents who can create mismatches on a game by game basis regardless of who we are playing. That's a lot of optimism. I see this team as being at least 2 offseasons, possibly 3 away. While I like Mangini, I think the overall staff needs to be substantially upgraded in the off season.
Well U R wrong I did & posted it over & over again over the past off season but sorry to say almost nobody was listening. I also posted way back when that it would be 2010 or beyond at the earliest before we would be SB ready tough.
I'm sure there was a championpackers96 poster on the Packers boards saying the same things last year, now a year later they are SB contenders. Point is in this NFL anything can happen in any year. Teams go from bad to good in one offseason and vise versa.
Sorry if I was U I would not hang my NYJ hat on that happening next year or the year after that or the year after that. If you choose to believe something else then U will be the one disappointed when what you expected does not come to pass
Hey I'm a Jets fan, I'm used to disappointment by now. I'd rather be dissapointed with hope than never being disappointed but never having any hope either. What gives me the least amount of hope right now is not that the Jets could become competitive again quickly but that the Patriots are just on another level altogether. The Jets don't just have to go from bad to good they have to go from bad to best team ever to truly compete for a SB. The whole NFL is facing that situation though. Happy Holidays..
Well I've been a NYJ fan far longer then U I suspect so I have been disappointed far more then U as well. Yes your post about the NEPs is a truism & everytime I think of the levels of the 2 club I wonder how MT & EM could make such as a stupid statement like they did that we are not worried about the Pats Yes thanks & Happy Holidays to you as well
No problem...it's a rough season and frustration can boil over. We all want the same thing...a SB Win.:beer:
Bill Parcells took the Jets from 1-15 to an AFC Championship game in 2 seasons. Dick Vermeil took the Rams from last place to a Super Bowl win in 3 seasons. Bill Walsh went from last place to a Super Bowl win in 3 seasons. Chuck Noll went from 1-13 to a Super Bowl win in 4 seasons. What do all of these achievements have in common? They all came in and made radical personnel changes in a very short period of time, then installed their systems and made consistent progress towards the goal. The Jets have just marked time over the last two seasons. No radical changes in personnel, an early implementation of the 3-4 and a huge step back. Is the huge step up out there? Of course it is. It's just a question of going out and finding it. Something we did successfully less than a decade ago after the last fast flame-out of an unprepared coach and front office.
With the exception of Parcells none of the coaches you mention saw immediate success in their second year. Vermil's turnaround with the Rams came out of nowehere. If I remember right they went from 3-13 to 13-3. Sometimes it takes time to implement the changes needed (especially with the cap). In the case of the Jets two of the biggest required changes (Pennington and Vilma) could not be made immediately because they are team captains and have the support of their teammates. You can say many things about Mangini...but unprepaired is not one of them. He is exceedingly smart. Its not translating to big success yet...but it will.
None of the coaches lost as badly as the Jets are now in their second year either. There's a difference between going 6-10 and going potentially 3-13. The difference is that by your second year you should have some things functioning at a high enough level to avoid being terrible. For the Jets the only part of the team functioning at that level right now are the special teams and that is Westhoff, not Mangini. Only a very unprepared coach would have gone into the season with the players the Jets are now playing on the offensive and defensive lines. Mangini had an entire season to recognize that those two units were not good enough and yet they are both worse in his second season on the job. No NFL coach worth his salt would have allowed the lines to deteriorate the way they have over the last two seasons. You can gameplan and watch film and brainstorm as much as you want, if you don't have the horses you're going to be stuck in the gate which is where the Jets are right now.
So a coach is unprepared because his lines aren't good enough? Yet with the exception of the Dallas and New England game the Jets could have won every game if it wasn't for some bizarre play like a wr dropping a ball or Pennington having a brain fart? In my eyes the fact that they could have won all of those games speaks volumes to the quality of coaching job Mangini has done since he had such crap lines. If you want to come down on the front office for not doing more to fix the lines that's fine. If you can find any front office that hasn't make mistakes in the past whether it's through signing the wrong player, drafting the wrong player, overrating a position I'd like to hear it. Your argument of bashing a coach because his lines aren't good enough is idiotic.
I'm bashing Mangini because he knew, based on last season, that his lines weren't good enough and he allowed them to deterioriate beyond the level they were at last season. If you want to make the argument that he had no input on who the Jets would have on the lines this season then I'll bash him for having so little influence in the organization that he allowed himself to be sent out onto the field with a losing hand this season. The head coach of a team is the person most responsible for the results they produce. When the results are 2-9 the head coach has just not done his job unless he was handed a collection of sad sack losers by the prior regime and has not had the opportunity to upgrade them yet. Bill Parcells had a completely new defensive line by the beginning of his second season. He traded his all-pro defensive end Hugh Douglas because Douglas just did not fit his scheme. He signed a free agent center, Kevin Mawae, paying what the market forced him too, because he knew his offensive line needed the upgrade to get over the top. Mangini has stubbornly held on to several players on defense who just do not fit the scheme he wants to play. As a result his defense, unlike Parcells, has gotten worse season over season than what he took over. He has failed to import free agent talent to solidify his offensive line despite talent (Steinbach, Dockery) being readily available in the offseason. Guards cost top dollar in free agency, that's just how it works. And countering the argument that they are not worth it is the fact that many NFL teams pay to support that price level. The teams that signed Steinbach and Dockery are both having surprise seasons right now. The teams that lost them are having poor seasons. That's just what it is. The Jets didn't make a play for either of them and are in the worst shape of all 5 teams involved.
Cotchery is a #2 WR and that is fine. Smith needs more time before we throw him under the bus. Most WRs don't breakout till their third year in the NFL. Smith might take four years because he did not play the position in college.
The argument can be made that two of the most impactful free agents were guards- Eric Steinbach to the Browns and Leonard Davis to the Cowboys. The only other offensive players who had as much of a positive impact would be Wes Welker and Jeff Garcia.
I'm not throwing him under the bus but the fact is he is a terrible route runner and doesn't show great technique catching the ball. The guy is a project at WR and right now he is basically our No. 2 or 3 and he simply isn't ready. Most really good WR are solid in year 2 Smith is bad in year 2. Take a look at the Jets good WR, Sauer, Toon, Walker, Chrebet, Moore, Coles all had very solid second years. Smith will need more time but to throw him in when he is clearly a project and needs more time isn't really helping the O and it may not be helping him. Fortunately he is going to be on the team as a specials player anyway, why put the O in a hole by force feeding him the position that he clearly isn't ready for? He should get some work but he doesn't belong on the field full time even with Coles hurt.
