I don't kow where you were but when Chad has struggle in the past I do get on him. The difference btw tse gamesandyeserday is those D's we faced played great, that wasn't the case yesterday. Clemens had all day to throw but he was indecisive an that killed us. If Chad pays yesterday we win. I gve KC a tremendous amount of credit for coming back in the 4th. He learned quickly as alot of his early mistakes were fom inexperience BUT that doesn't change the fact he played lousy for 3 qtrs which is why we didnt win. I feel alot better about KC as a backup and a starter for the future but our best chance to win remains w/ Chad.
You are the only person on the board that will claim the Ravens D put less pressure on KC than the Browns D put on Chad. You are the only person that will also claim that Clemens had all day to throw through 3 quarters. He was sacked 4 times yesterday, providing a good indication that he didn't have "all day." To me it sounds like pro-Chad bias. Chad does not do well against good defenses, there is no way he could have done what Clemens did in the 4th quarter. We probably lose even worse with Chad yesterday. That's just his track record.
What does this have to do w/ the Browns? I am talking about yesterday and KC had all day to throw all game long. You can't lok at the sack totals and tell me he didn't have time, all except maybe 1 he had 4-6 secs to throw and that is an eternity. he just didn't make his reads quick enough. He did in the 4th. If Chad plays yesterday we aren't down 20-3 in the 4th. W/ that much time he would have torn apart the Bal D. Chad's track record is that he WINS! he's beaten good D's before but like most QBs his win % goes down against better D's. That's not a surprise.
His track record against good Ds is awful, far worse than most QBs. The guy just completely shuts down. I was using the Browns for comparison in terms of how the QBs played, although I think the Ravens are a far better defense and brought far more pressure, Chad against the Browns did nothing for 3 quarters and then rallied the team and fell short. Against the Fins was similar except we pulled out the win there. Regardless, Chad has had bad games before. We need to see what Chad can do against some of the better defenses this year. I thought he did well against New England, but that doesn't erase a history of futility. He had the entire offseason to get stronger this year instead of coming off injury, and he's in the same offensive system for two years in a row. This was pretty much Chad's year to show what he has, but now he got injured again and the excuses are pouring in about talent. If KC can win with this group, then we need to ride him, if Chad can win with this group then we can follow him. But if Chad can't cut it, then we need to put KC in there and that's that.
It is clear that you just want Chad to start period. The Chad "wins" argument is really very hollow as explained in the original post. The Baltimore D was bringing every blitz in the world the entire game and Kellen had very little time to throw. Chad would have gotten sacked as much if not more than Kellen. To say Chad wins this game is absurd. No one can know what the result would have been but Chad's record against really physical teams like Baltimore really argues against us having any shot. In addition, Kellen simply played at a level in the fourth quarter that Chad is INCAPABLE of. He does not have the phsical ability to do what Kellen did. Kellen brought us back by throwing over the top of the Baltimore defense. Chad cannot do that. Period. Dinking and dunking would not have allowed us to come back. More importantly though, Kellen demonstrated many of the skills that people most value in Chad: intelligence, leadership, command of the offense, good defense recognition and changing the play at the line of scrimmage, great command of the no huddle. He made two DOG penalties due to lack of experience in a truly hostile and noisy environment, and was a little overwhelmed at the beggining of the game. But he grew so much during the game. At the end, he showed as much confidence and poise as Chad ever has. And in the fourth quarter he played a game CHad is incapable of. He is the QB who should start for us from now on. But you will continue to hide behind the "Chad wins" argument and you will argue blindly and irrationally for Chad to play no matter what. It's all that seems to matter to you.
He'd realize that if he had made the point first. Since he made the opposite point: that the Ravens defense was weak yesterday, he is forced to defend it against all comers despite the facts. Haven't you been watching the same Nyjunc I have all these years?
I get your point, but still Chad is a winner, phrasing it one way or another doesn't matter. Just because Chad can keep us in a game, and sneak away with the win doesn't make him any less of a QB. If we can find someone better, then we can go with them, but until we do Chad is our guy KC has talent, and I hope he is the answer, but benching Chad now makes no sense because Chad has proved his ability to win and KC hasn't, and neither has any QB we have on staff.
Well, it seems this issue has become even more divisive. For many, it seems to be more about emotion and dedication to a player than about rationality.
wait, let me get this straight... Junc is claiming that Baltimore's Defense was/is weak? wow, Junc, you have derailed. i'm sure had Pennington played and won, it would have been against the top D in the league; but since it was Clemens and the Jets lost, the opposing Defense was weak. riiiight.
Why are people still fighting about Chad? You morons got your wish, he didn't play, and we still lost. Can we start blaming someone else now?
This is a bit of an overstatement, but I do think there were a lot of plays in the first three quarters where KC held the ball too long. He seemed to make much quicker decisions in the fourth quarter when the pressure was on.
and you do realize Bal was blitzing alot and we were picking it up meaning there had to be someone open somewhere, right? Where did I say Chad didn't have bad games? he was awful at times last year. I don't get what your point is? and Chad had a good game against NE, it wasn't his fault our D couldn't stop NE at all and keep us in the game. Hollow? I apologize that I like my team to win and nobody has done it more consistently than Chad in the history of the Jets. This is 100% WRONG. Yep Bal blitzed alot but we picked thm up and KC had all day to throw but was indecisive. this was purely based on lack of experience and he showed us alot coming back late and learning from his earlier mistakes but the facts are he had tons of time all game long. If Chad had the amount of time KC had he would have gotten rid of the ball alot quicker and we would have scored alot earlier and never been playing from behind. We wouldn't have been down 20-3 so we woldn't have had to come back and let's not forget that Cotch turne 2 short passes into 40+ yard gains. I LIKE Kellen but Chad is BETTER right now and gives us a better chance to win and I want to win. The ravens have had a top D for years, they did not play like one on Sunday. it happens from time to time. we had a million opportunities in that game and couldn't get something done until it was too late. Can any of you guys read? I never said the Bal D was weak, I said KC had all dayto throw and that is a fact.
hmm..he got sacked 4 times so he couldn't have had all day. Not sure how many hurries there were on top of that.
You do realize tht sacks aren't just the responsibility of the OL, right? The OL gave him time to thow, he held onto the ball too long and was sacked.
You simply don't get it Junc. Payton Manning went 15 for 30 170 yards and 2INT and put up 15 points against the Ravens in Baltimore just last winter that's with a solid running attack. Against the Pats he had 349 yards and put up 38 points. The Ravens have the best D by far in the NFL they have great corners great Safties and a great line and lb. The Jets were in maximum protect and even with Baltimore blitzing we weren't sending enough guys out to have a guy open. The TE never left the LOS until the second half of the game and we didn't run 3 WR sets until we were behind in the second half. The only turnovers the Jets had were due to Coles falling down and McCariens drop. Clemens was great in that game.
As for me, personally I find it very hard to LIKE Chad. He reminds me of that annoying kiss-ass type player in highschool who had no talent yet always followed the coach around, did whatever he said to the tee, and in turn was always starting instead of someone better... I DEALT with Chad until the media incident where he said that reporters who were just DOING THEIR JOB by asking him (albeit sometimes negative sounding) questions were PRIVILEDGED to be covering the Jets - like they were the 49ers in their prime and he was Joe Montana... Another reason I don't like Chad is how he consistantly tries to play when hurt, even if thats NOT the move that puts the team in the best position to win... Even this past week he was trying to push his way in there... It's like he's more afraid that he'll lose his starting job if the backup does well than he cares about our overall chance of winning... you didn't see Steve McNair with that kind of attitude last week - he knew it wouldnt be very likely he could go, and threw his support behind Boler... In closing, is Chad a BAD QB? No, definitely not - ALTHOUGH, he DOES throw a lot of INTS in a ball control offense... All the people drawing on Trent Dilfer and the Ravens and saying that a so-so QB can win a superbowl with the right players around them need to realize that Dilfer didn't have a 60m cap number... Also, look at the last 10 superbowls... how many were won by that type of QB? You can't see that this happened once and then CLING to that hope... It's like in baseball - sure, ONCE in a while a team heavy on offense w/ no pitching can pull it off, but the MAJORITY of the time, pitching wins championships...
Trent Dilfer had a much better arm than Chad and was a pro bowl QB in the NFL something Chad has never achieved.
Trent Dilfer also had one of the Greatest Defenses of all time. Chad needs a Defense like that to have a prayer of a Sb. Unfortunately the Jets need a Qb who can put points on the board this year and he is not it! Chad will have played this week if they had to roll him out in a wheel chair. Once Kellen takes over Chad is done. That is a decision that can not be unmade so Mangini is taking his time. Im not happy because Clemens will be missing valuable reps this season and it will further slow the learning curve.
Chad put up as many points as the Chargers did against the Pats, and in my opinion, the Pats D is better than the Ravens. Just spin it how you like to fit your argument.
