Yankees rate of winning World Series' = roughly one every four years. Mets rate of winning World Series' = roughly one every twenty two years.
Well, speaking for myself only, I'd say its only mildly disappointing in aggregate, since I don't believe these teams are really that good, except from a rotisserie baseball perspective. take away the collapse in '04, which hurt more because it was to the Red Sox, and I'm really not that disappointed. I don't think this is the way you build a championship team, and I think the facts, or at least the results, corroborate that. I think the last few years also bring home quite nicely just how good the Yanks were in 96-2001 and how difficult it was to win 3 in a row and 4 out of 5.
George started trying to buy championships when he first brought in Reggie Jackson and Catfish Hunter in the 70s. He has 6 since then. I don't think that is at all disappointing.
Heh, I don't think that's necessarily true, most of the Yankees fans are good baseball fans, and as far as I can tell, we don't have any 96ers lurking around here. Anyway, RM's argument reminds me of something they say in the investment business: "Past results are no guarantee of future performance." Look, here's my take. Past victories count. They always do. Do we celebrate going to war with the Redcoats every year? We do only because we won. It's not a great analogy, but it works well enough. The Yankees have won more titles than any other team in the US, in any of our sports. (I never got an answer from Rich about the Spanish soccer team, so I'll just leave it at what is undeniably factual.) The United States has won many wars. By the same token, both the US and the Yankees have lost as well. Those count too. You cannot just wholesale writeoff the historical significance of a team basically dominating a sport over the course of its own history. In all honesty, the Yankees have dominated baseball since Babe Ruth put on his first NY cap. At the same time, that is all worthless right now. Right now, the Yankees are struggling to stay afloat. Our pitching staff is being held up by opposite ends of the age spectrum, with only Wang in the middle. All the WS victories in the world don't change the fact that the Yankees are in trouble right now. Meanwhile, the Mets and Sox are performing as two of the most elite in the sport. Again though, Yankees fans fall back on the 26 titles as a knee-jerk defensive reaction. I'm starting to see more guys getting fed up on both sides of the fence with all the shit stirring, which is encouraging. It's grown out of control. From what I've seen, all of the guys on this forum of the board understand the sport fairly well. While we may disagree on many topics, and definitely on our teams, there is some really great conversation here when guys settle down and converse. I say let's keep it up.
Well then the arguement becomes how long do you celebrate a championship for? When does the Cardinals World Series win no longer matter? New season but Cardinal fans shouldn't boast about winning it all last year?
I think that they can call themselves the World Champions and celebrate that until a new team is crowned this fall.
You are comparing the Yankees to the Mets? One team is the greatest team in the history of professional sport, the other has been good like 5 years out of 45. C'mon. Feeling smug cause Michael Wuertz couldn't throw a strike and handed the Mets a gift last night, are we?
Who cares about the past. There is no denying the Yanks history but what is important is right now and there is no denying the Mets are better right now and have a brighter future.
That's fair, of course. They are the reigning champs. I think it would be fair for them to celebrate that they've got 10 titles to speak of as well, as long as it's kept within perspective. The Cardinals organization has had more success than the majority of other teams in the sport. As a matter of fact, the only team who has had more success is the Yankees. Teams like the Rangers, Mariners, Padres, and Brewers have nothing to show for their many years in the league. About a third of the league's teams have never won, and therefore, any team that has has a better history than at least a third of the rest. I think any team, in any sport, that has won a title (moreso for repeats) deserves to celebrate it forever. In the end though, the issue that needs to be the deciding factor on the celebration of a title is relevancy. It's relevant that in terms of the history of MLB, the Yankees are the most successful franchise. The Cards are the second most historically successful. It is no longer relevant when we start talking about this year. In terms of this year, the Cards are the defending champs, but will almost surely be dethroned, so even their most recent history is not relevant enough.
You're way off base. Especially since the advent of the WC the baseball playoffs have been more about being "hot" at the right time and getting lucky then the best team winning. I don't think anything highlights that better then the absolutely dreadful team we saw win the WS last year. The Yankees have been among the best teams in baseball the last 10 years or so, they just haven't won the last few years. There's no way you can tell me that the 2000 WS winning team was better then the 02-04 100+ win teams that didn't take home a title.
Eh, you're right and wrong at the same time. Yes, the Mets are better right now. It's extremely hard to argue that (though it is possible.) IMO, the Mets are a better team right now, so I won't get into a "Devil's Advocate" soapbox argument. However, there's no way you can say the Mets have a brighter future. The Yankees farm system is pretty strong. We already have guys like Cano and Cabrera in the bigs as positional players, with lots of talent elsewhere in the system. In the pitching area, we have Wang, and Hughes, plus DeSalvo, Wright, and Karstens who look like keepers. The Yankees have a lot of age on the field right now, but that is by no means a barometer for 2-5 years into the future. Mets right now: better. Mets 3 years from now: we all have to wait and see.
You make a very good point about the wild card. What a piece of crap that is. Sure, it's interesting for an extra team right on the edge to get in, like the Red Sox, but the Cards had no place in the playoffs last year. The best team does not always win, you're spot on. If it did, the Cards would not have even appeared in the World Series last year. It's all about streakiness. (Read: luck.)
The Mets aren't better now. They are playing better now but talk to me at the end of the season. Mets play in that awful NL. They don't have the Red Sox and Tigers to battle with. When the Yankees get Clemens pitching, with Pettitte, Hughes, Mussina and Wang, they are gonna turn their whole season around. Yankees have come in first 9 out of the last 10 years and made the playoffs the other season. Lets calm down with all this Metzie nonsense. All I remember about them right now is Molina going yard and Beltran taking strike 3.
I see your point but you can't rely on prospects, especially if they are from the Mets or Yanks who have a history of building up prospects reputations. The core of this Mets team is under 25, with Beltran 27 or 28. They are going to be good for years bariing injury. The Mets also have some promising prospects to look forward to but I am not counting on them when I say the Mets have a brighter future.
They weren't better last year at all. Yankees had the best record in baseball,, only reason the Mets ended up tying them with the record is cause the Yankees sat guys the last week cause finishing first overall meant nothing. Mets play in an inferior league. Mets are not better at all, even now. Playing better, sure. But are they better? No way, not even close.
A Met fan overrating his team cause they are finally pretty good. I mean it isn't my fault that Molina went yard.
The Mets were the team resting regulars, or the would have won well over 100 games. Denial is an understatement.
