The Ukrainian situation

Discussion in 'BS Forum' started by typeOnegative13NY, Feb 14, 2022.

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  1. bicketybam

    bicketybam Well-Known Member

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    It's Milley.
     
  2. stinkyB

    stinkyB 2009 Best Avatar Award Winner

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  3. Petrozza

    Petrozza Administrator

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    The more I read about this and look at the pictures the more it seems like "Russian warship f*ck off" 2.0. The building was indeed a maternity ward but who/what was inside at the time of bombing is a big question. I'd imagine scores of wounded and killed if the building indeed was housing pregnant women and newborns but I've seen only 1-2 pregnant women supposedly rescued from that building. I haven't seen even a single doctor in any of those pictures.
     
  4. barfolomew

    barfolomew Well-Known Member

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    For akkkad it's not a question
     
  5. barfolomew

    barfolomew Well-Known Member

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    Yeah when i first read this, the article was very vague. I thought it was interesting the writer didn't mention any occupants.
     
  6. typeOnegative13NY

    typeOnegative13NY Well-Known Member

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    I heard “19 injured”, and that was it
     
  7. BrowningNagle

    BrowningNagle Well-Known Member

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    Just read about this woman who worked for an American company in the Ukraine. She was killed by a Russian tank while driving to get her mother some medicine. She was killed along with the driver of the vehicle and her mother who was in the back seat
     
  8. BrowningNagle

    BrowningNagle Well-Known Member

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    I guess it doesn't really matter to me if everyone evacuated the place or not. The building was a hospital and now it is gone.
     
  9. Br4d

    Br4d 2018 Weeb Ewbank Award

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    The vote in the Senate for expanding NATO the first time to Poland, Czech Republic and Hungary was 80-19 in favor.

    The vote the second go-round, which got 7 countries added including the Baltic Republics was unanimous.

    Unanimous.

    Bad idea? Most likely but one that everybody agreed upon.
     
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  10. Petrozza

    Petrozza Administrator

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    It does to me. This situation reminds of Palestinians showing injured children when Israel bombs a house/building full of terrorists firing rockets. Once you have armed people actively participating in combat, it becomes a fair target.
     
  11. BrowningNagle

    BrowningNagle Well-Known Member

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    so if someone invaded New York, our hospitals become fair targets because it’s a war? that we didn’t start...

    Ill always disagree
     
  12. Jonathan_Vilma

    Jonathan_Vilma Well-Known Member

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    There’s no defending this. That’s a disgusting answer to an extremely serious and important question.


     
  13. typeOnegative13NY

    typeOnegative13NY Well-Known Member

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    She was a shit choice. Period.
     
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  14. GREG

    GREG Well-Known Member

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    This is what happens when you only get the job because you are black and a woman. She is in way over her head and everyone knows it.
     
  15. joelip

    joelip Well-Known Member

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    If it was a bad idea, it was a bad idea on the part of countries who wanted to join Nato and who actively petitioned to join.

    Why did they do this?

    1) They had some reason to fear that their giant neighbor would invade them, as it had invaded the past (see Czechoslovakia and Hungary):

    "But many former Warsaw Pact countries wanted a greater level of assurance of their security after the collapse of the Soviet Union, especially Poland, Hungary and Czechoslovakia. These countries duly signed the Visegrad Declaration in February 1991, with the objective of “full involvement in the European … system of security”.

    2) Such invasions were clearly not just an historical relic but a contemporary option:

    "The relative security of the eastern European states was challenged during the 1990s due to the attempted October coup in Moscow in 1993, the first Chechen war in 1994 and Russian assistance to the breakaway Republic of Abkhazia in the south Caucasus. The combination of these events increased the perception of vulnerability, particularly in the Baltic states, indicating that Moscow was prepared to act militarily to pursue its security objectives."

    3) According to Gorbachev, there was NO explicit agreement that any countries should be excluded from Nato:

    "In 2014, the former Soviet leader Mikhail Gorbachev marked the 25th anniversary of the fall of the Berlin wall by noting in an interview that that Nato’s enlargement “was not discussed at all” at the time:

    Not a single Eastern European country raised the issue, not even after the Warsaw Pact ceased to exist in 1991. Western leaders didn’t bring it up, either.

    There was, he said, no promise not to enlarge the alliance, though in the same interview Gorbachev also stated that he thinks that enlargement was a “big mistake” and “a violation of the spirit of the statements and assurances made” in 1990."

    4) Russia did NOT at the time object to Nato enlargement:

    "Alongside the increasing security concerns of former Warsaw Pact countries, there was significant debate in the early 1990s about the merits of enlargement. Rather than jump straight into enlarging Nato, the Partnership For Peace (PfP) was established in 1994 and included NACC members as well as former Soviet Asian countries, such as Kyrgyzstan and Kazakhstan. The result was a greater formalisation of the security arrangements, initially developed by the NACC, into a structure that allowed for PfP members to engage in Nato peacekeeping operations in the former Yugoslavia.

    Russia was a participant in these new security arrangements, and was keen to clarify that Nato enlargement was not a security threat to Russia. The then president of Russia, Boris Yeltsin, wrote in a September 1993 letter to the then US president, Bill Clinton: “Any possible integration of east European countries into Nato will not automatically lead to the alliance somehow turning against Russia.” So it was being clearly signalled that Russia did not object to the direction Europe’s new security architecture was following."

    The bedrock of the Nato-Russia relationship, the Nato-Russia Founding Act, was also signed at the 1997 Madrid Summit alongside the enlargement invitations. As the second formal agreement of the post-Cold War era between Russia and Nato, the act confirms that “Nato and Russia do not consider each other as adversaries”, and that Nato transformation is “a process that will continue”. It is, therefore, clear that Nato enlargement, was not considered a primary security concern for Russia."

    Ukraine: the history behind Russia's claim that Nato promised not to expand to the east (theconversation.com)

    What we know from history is that Russia has repeatedly invaded neighbors who have wanted greater freedom for their nation, particularly freedom from Russian domination. If Ukrainians wanted to be free from Russian domination and move closer to the West, what gives us, or the Russians, the right to say that they can't?
     
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  16. Acad23

    Acad23 Well-Known Member

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    I don't care about the usual sophomoric insults you frequently toss my way... but the kkk shit is stopping
    right now.
     
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  17. barfolomew

    barfolomew Well-Known Member

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    Akkkad, you've made some foul posts in the past and have no standing to demand charitable language.
     
  18. barfolomew

    barfolomew Well-Known Member

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    Don't forget russia cooperated with nato in bosnia as well. If russia had become a functioning democracy after the ussr collapse, they may have been a member of nato by now. Unfortunately, putin took control
     
  19. barfolomew

    barfolomew Well-Known Member

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    How about dan qualye or mike pence only getting the job because they are white males and bland as fuck. Or cheney only getting the job because he is evil. All those guys were in over there head.
     
  20. NYJetsO12

    NYJetsO12 Well-Known Member

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    This week is this week..but why do I get the feeling that US will get into a hot war here??? And barring nuclear arms use it will stop Putin ..stand up to him like we should have to Hitler! If the atrocities continue?? The West can't just stand there sorry to admit...waiting for Russian people to revolt feel sanctions may take a while. We need to defend Airspace as the Russians unfortunately advance West toward NATO...it's a game of Chicken isn't it?

    My Republican roots are bristling now ..Reagan or the 2 Bushes would have given Putin a serious warning before this all went down and threatened serious war with us if Putin started this shit

    Hell..even President Kennedy faced up to the Nuclear Threat with the embargo of Cuba..and ya know what ? Krushyev backed down

    I don't like Trump at all..but Biden / Kamala are just not the heavyweights we need in this fight right now..apologies to Bart heh
     
    typeOnegative13NY likes this.
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