I mean if your bottom line answer is going to be I trust the GM over a guy on the internet then why even discuss anything at all here? We're here to praise and scrutinize. But the whole I believe in the GM mic drop line is annoying.
That wasn’t the bottom line answer. If that’s all you took from my multiple responses to you then you’re right it’s not worth discussing anything here. I discussed plenty of reasons for shits and giggles, but in real life which is all that really matters, I’m going to trust the guy who probably will get it right more often than us.
It's most of what I got, because you wrote an entire paragraph on it. It's not simply about AVT versus Darrisaw as individuals. It's three players for one in a draft that's rich at all of our positions of need. That and you saying he's a left tackle so it seems like an added risk to flip him.
My actual premise the entire time is that it’s asinine to call the trade a failure while also claiming the correct move would have been moving an LT to RT and hoping a third rounder can be your 10-year starter the way AVT projects to be. I’m not making a definitive statement on whether or not this was the right move. All I know is I’d rather give up a shot at two guys that have a 50% chance of panning out for a shot at a guy that has a much higher chance. Especially when you consider the amount of draft capital we have moving forward. This isn’t a one year rebuild... go get the guy you think best fills your biggest need while also preserving the chance to fill even more holes over the next year.
Fair enough. I like that a lot more then I believe in the GM because he's not an internet idiot! Respect.
were pretty good at edge IMO. between lawson, JFM, and curry subbing in. plus lots of young guys from last year like zuniga and hall. If I was going to take one I would have taken collins TBH. he's a 4-3 SAM in a base but can slide to to edge in Nickel/Dime packages
i've watched quite a bit on collins. he is very versatile. He can fit any system. he's a perfect 3-4 EDGE and also a 4-3 SAM. he can also play with his hand in the dirt at DE. He's a lot like a calvin pace type
I don't know about his ankle bend/flexibility or pass rush moves. I think he might need a lot of work as a 4-3 DE, and may not have the natural flexibility.
well since you like scouting reports (check the underlined for TLDR) Tony Pauline’s Zaven Collins Scouting Report Positives: Explosive, game-impacting linebacker who was a three-year starter for Tulsa. Instinctive, breaks down well, and quickly locates the ball handler. Forceful up the field and plays with balance as well as body control. Gives effort defending the run and attacks assignments as well as opponents. Big, strong, and defeats blocks to make the play. Easily gets back to playing balance off the initial block and quickly changes direction or alters his angle of attack without losing momentum. Terrific pass rusher who bends off the edge with speed. Explodes through gaps to penetrate the line of scrimmage. Very effective making plays in space, fluid moving laterally and shows speed in pursuit. Stays with assignments, possesses solid ball skills, and stands out in coverage. Negatives: Not overly quick. Occasionally gets caught upfield and out of position. Analysis: Collins is a game-impacting defender and one of the more understated prospects in this year’s draft. He’s not the small run-and-chase linebacker teams prefer these days. Rather, he’s a throwback of sorts, and possesses the size as well as speed to be a pass rusher as well as play in coverage. Collins is a true three-down defender who should quickly break into a starting lineup and comes with outstanding scheme versatility. Collins’ incredible 2020 campaign In one season, Collins has gone from relative obscurity to legitimate first-round contention. Few players — let alone non-Power Five players — are able to accomplish this. In eight games, Collins put up 54 tackles, 7.5 tackles for loss, 4.0 sacks, four interceptions, two pass deflections, two forced fumbles, a safety, and a fumble recovery. The Tulsa linebacker also took two of his interceptions back to the end zone and accumulated 156 return yards. Collins was instrumental in helping the Golden Hurricane to their first winning season since 2016. Not only was he a first-team All-AAC selection, but he also earned first-team All-American honors, alongside Jeremiah Owusu-Koramoah and Joseph Ossai. On December 23, the Tulsa linebacker was announced as the Bronko Nagurski Award winner. The award is given to the best defender in the nation each year. Collins joins a group that includes Aaron Donald, Luke Kuechly, Ndamukong Suh, and Chase Young, as previous winners. A day after winning the award, Collins announced that he would forgo his final season of eligibility, and declare for the 2021 NFL Draft. Analyzing Zaven Collins’ NFL Draft profile Looking at his physical profile, it’s clear why Zaven Collins is a first-round prospect. Collins is 6-foot-5, 260 pounds, with decent length for his size. He’s also a good athlete. He doesn’t have every athletic trait in the book, but Collins can mold his game around several qualities, most notably his explosiveness. Collins has excellent stop-and-start ability in short ranges. That explosiveness helps him in several phases on defense. In pass defense, the Tulsa linebacker has enough closing burst to cross gaps and enter passing windows. He’s also fluid with his backpedal. Featured | Latest 7-Round 2021 NFL Mock Draft In run defense, Collins’ burst allows him to shoot through gaps and block off rushing lanes. He can carry his burst around blockers and sear into the backfield. Through this process, Collins has good angle awareness. His physicality and strength allow him to finish plays at the contact point. Although Collins doesn’t have top-end speed, he has enough to be a threat in pursuit. Additionally, Collins has immense potential rushing the passer. He possesses the size of an edge rusher. His explosion and bend gives some offensive tackles fits. With his well-rounded skill set, Collins can be a versatile chess piece on defense. On top of it all, he’s a smart, quick processor who reads plays well, and does well with his positioning. Zaven Collins’ best fits in the 2021 NFL Draft By now, Collins is a bonafide first-round prospect. There is the possibility that he slips into Round 2. However, Collins is highly-rated across the board. His physical traits will likely be valued highly by the NFL. Although he doesn’t have great natural speed, Collins has a lot of other crucial traits. He also possesses elite size for a linebacker. That will undoubtedly help him pass the eye test for NFL scouts. Additionally, Collins knocked his pro day out of the park. He measured in almost a full inch taller than expected, and he also put up excellent athletic numbers — among them the aforementioned 4.67 40-yard dash, a 35-inch vertical jump, and a 122-inch broad jump. Overall, Collins logged a Relative Athletic Score of 9.54. His combination of size and mobility certainly shows up on film. Which teams mesh best with Collins’ skill set? The best fits for Zaven Collins partly depend on his range. The Tulsa linebacker likely goes in Round 1. However, beyond that, the possibilities number in the many. Slipping into late Day 1 is a possibility, but teams might also like Collins enough to take him near the top ten. In Round 1, anyone from the Carolina Panthers and Denver Broncos, to the Washington Football Team, could have interest in Collins. Beyond that, teams like the Tennessee Titans, Pittsburgh Steelers, and Cleveland Browns also profile as excellent fits. Going to a scheme that utilizes his versatility is key. Not only is Collins scheme-diverse, but he’s also versatile within his role. He can provide value against the pass, against the run, and along the edge. That kind of player can be hard to come by. and another ANALYST'S REPORTS Marino Click here to read Collins' full Premium NFL draft profile. After a high school career in which Zaven Collins was a four-year starter at quarterback and linebacker/safety, Tulsa was the only Division I program to offer him a scholarship. He ended his college career by claiming the Bronko Nagurski Trophy, which is awarded to the nation’s best defensive player. Collins offers an exciting blend of size, length, power, football intelligence, and versatility that makes him a dynamic prospect for the NFL. Whether it’s defending the run, dropping into coverage, or rushing the passer, Collins has the requisite skill set required to execute and was arguably the most dynamic defensive playmaker in college football for the 2020 season. He demonstrated notable growth in 2020, becoming a complete defender and making high-impact, clutch plays seemingly every week. The Belichick disciples and teams that deploy that style of defense are likely salivating over Collins’ skill set and he projects as an impact defender in the NFL that can make plays in a variety of ways. Ideal Role: Starting linebacker given opportunities to rush the passer, drop in coverage, play downhill, and in space. Scheme Fit: Collins projects favorably to a defense that is multiple with its alignments that presents the opportunity for him to unleash the full breadth of his skill set. In short saleh could have found many ways to use this kid as a 3 down players. would have loved him on the jets but very happy with the AVT pick
This isn't telling me anything I didn't already know. There's a difference in being versatile and being topnotch at one thing, and I think the one thing at which he is topnotch is being a 3-4 OLB. He could play as a 4-3 DE (But not SAM imo), but it wouldn't be what he's best at.
I think Collins best comparison would be to Anthony Barr but he can be multiple. I was kind of hoping to see him end up with the Ravens to see how they use him. He is fast enough to play off the ball in a traditional 4-3 and has great size and good enough raw skills to make it as a 3-4 edge. Barr was an edge rusher in college that the Vikings converted to an excellent roving linebackers. The ceiling is the sky for this kid especially because of his intelligence (pre-med) and raw skills/versatility.
He is easily a sam LBer in a 4-3. eh already displayed it at college. the report backs that up as well
Barr weighs 247. I think that's the right range for a SAM, but 260 is too heavy imo. That extra 13 pounds slows one down and takes a heavier toll on one's knees, but that's just me. I never agreed with Rex wanting 260-270 pound OLBs.
depends on the talent. adalius thomas was 6'2 270 lbs and a beast at OLB. Some players are just bigger and play heavier. For example typically you don't want a 365lb OT but here we are with becton and he's a beast. typically you want your OTs in the 300-310 range to handle speed rushers and be more agile. OGs are usually the heavier ones
