If you can’t get a 3rd just keep him and see if there’s an injury in the offseason or early on next season Worst case scenario he’s a good backup or even wins the job under a new coaching staff and plays well Jets screwed up his development but I’m unsure if he’ll ever be good at this point...I’m willing to bet a team out there thinks they can make him good and will offer a 2nd or so. QBs always go for more than they should (Bradford trade rings a bell)
You could definitely be right. I think Sam should never have started day one. He was too young and had too much pressure dumped on him immediately. I think that pressure is why he has regressed and his fundamentals have gone to crap. I think he quite possibly can be salvaged elsewhere, but he'll probably have to sit for a year, maybe two behind a veteran starter. He will need to focus on fixing his fundamentals and learn to read Ds, work on his leadership skills, learn when to throw the ball away and to not lock onto receivers, and not throw into double and triple coverage. I also think it would probably have to be with a team that is a smaller market team, preferably on the West Coast or one that has had a lot of success in their history and already has a very good team, so he doesn't have the pressure of having to try to be a "savior" of the franchise.
It was me. Time will tell, but I think it is a strong possibility the Jets get a 1 or 2 for Sam. I debated, but went with a low 1st Round pick. Busted! Good call, @Ralebird.
Positives - he's very young but he has parts of three seasons under his belt. Negatives - those three seasons have allowed people to actually see how he plays. Turn it around. If he was on another team, how much would you be happy with the Jets giving up for him? I would be extremely unhappy if we gave up a second. I can't believe anyone still thinks a first-rounder is a realistic scenario. I would love to be proved wrong, but that would be a heist to make the Jamal Adams deal pale in comparison. The fact that he was an overall No.3 pick is irrelevant. The fact that he is young is irrelevant. The fact that he is throwing almost three times as many interceptions as touchdowns, in his third season, is painfully relevant. Joe Flacco is throwing twice as many TDs as INTs. If someone gives us a third, they are overpaying.
If the Jets were to pick up a player with a similar record and evident fundamental problems for anything more then a 5th the I'd be raging.
I agree with your positives and negatives, but pretty much disagree with the rest. How much I would be happy with the Jets giving up for him is irrelevant. The Jets are rebuilding. Other teams, like the Steelers are not. He would immediately go into a better situation, get better coaching, and could sit behind Rothlisberger for a year, and should be a better player. He would be worth more to the Steelers than he would a team that is rebuilding. What the Jets get for him will depend upon how desperate other teams are for a QB, how they view his problems, how they view his injury history, and whether a bidding war develops between a few teams for Sam. NFL HCs have huge egos and they are notorious for thinking that they can fix/rehab players with talent. Players are given second chances for a myriad of reasons. It will also depend upon what other teams think of the Jets. I imagine that they think that Gase is a horrible HC, that Bowles wasn't much better, and that Sam has never really had a chance here. He's played in two different offensive systems with 2 different OCs and HCs, with a crappy OL and crappy offensive skill position players around him until this year. He was thrust into the spotlight and cast as a savior of sorts of the Jets. That's a LOT of presure for a 20-year old kid. He was better his rookie season when McCown was here. With positive reinforcement, patient teaching, and the right situation (quality HC, good OL and very good offensive skill position players), Sam could still possibly develop into a quality starter. The fact that he was the #3 pick is not really irrelevant. The Jets gave up a lot to get him, so aren't going to give him away. His age is not irrelevant, either. He's only 23. A number of QBs and other players coming into the league these days are 23 or 24. He's still young enough that he could sit for a year and work on his fundamentals, be coached up, and then possibly start next year. What Flacco is doing is irrelevant. He's a long-term veteran who won a SB. Sam's confidence is shot. That will have to be rebuilt, and it possibly can be rebuilt. It will just depend upon how much Sam wants it. If he still has a burning desire to play football, be a starting QB in the NFL and be great. If so, I could easily see another team giving up a 3rd, and maybe a 2nd if another team or two also wants his services. Don't forget how scarce good QBs are in the NFL. Teams are always looking to upgrade their QB corps.
Good post, NCJetsfan. Yes, in terms of what we will eventually get for him, I completely agree, but it's a way of looking at Darnold from the other side of the equation. I would be furious if my team (whoever I was supporting) gave up a second for a QB like Darnold. That is still a possibility, yes, but it is a long-shot. Why would any team give up a high draft pick on such a gamble? Worth a flier for a fourth-rounder? Maybe. A fifth? Why the hell not! A second? I can't see it. It's not up to the Jets. As painful as it is, whatever they gave up in terms of draft picks, time and money will not factor in to what somebody else is willing to pay for him. Absolutely true, and that desperation is the best hope we have to steal a high pick from someone. But I don't think Darnold is a good QB. As a starter he is bottom of the barrel in the league at the moment. Nothing would make me happier than being proved wrong. If we could get a second I would be delighted. If we got a first I would build a shrine to Joe Douglas.
Mitch Trubisky has had a better career than Sam , Mitch 63 per comp. 57 tds and 34 ints 85.5 passer rating, Sam 60 per comp,39 tds 36 ints 75.3 passer rating. Mitch is being run out of town and has put up numbers we could only hope Sam could put up. How pissed would we be to give a 4th for Mitch?
Ukjetsfan brings up a great point, if the shoe was on the other foot, how much would you offered for a guy like Sam? And you have a perfect scenario: Stealers, a team that has aging QB and may need a starter in a few years. A scenario nearly identical to this has already played out. Josh Rosen to the Bucks. On a draft night Rosen was considered close to Sam, save from some injuries history (he was not injured in NFL, so that's not much of a concern later), and was traded up to go #10 overall, with many considering that a steal. After he failed to produce in two years, still young (same as Sam) the Bucks with aging Brady took a chance on him and put on practice squad without any assets to give up. So, near identical scenario (Rosen to Bucks as Sam to Stealers) has already played out, and the QB who does not produce after his rookie year is just not going to fetch much value. Unless Sam turns this around in the last few games, a late pick is the absolute best Jets can hope for, or might end up like Miami just giving Sam up for nothing eventually.
Lol it's comical when you put their stats side by side like that. Mitch seems like Joe Montana compared to Sam, and Mitch is a terrible QB lmao.
Thanks. I can understand your being furious if your team gave up a 2nd for Darnold, but fans' perspectives are different than teams' perspectives. They have more knowledge than fans (or think they do). As I said, coach's egos are a powerful thing. We all know that QB is THE most important position on a football team. If a team has a huge need at QB, and doesn't have a high draft pick, their chances at getting a quality starting-caliber QB are slim and none unless they get really lucky. Let's take the Steelers for example. For argument's sake, let's say they win the SB this year, so they will be picking #32 in the 2021 NFL Draft. If Rothlisberger decides to end his career on a high note and retire, what are the Steelers going to do for their future starting QB? Their backup QBs are Mason Rudolph and Joshua Dobbs. Do you think that they will be content to roll with those two QBs going forward? I don't. I believe that both played last year when Rothlisberger was hurt. Rudolph did complete 63.9% of his passes but his TD to Interception ration in 10 games was 13-9. He took 15 sacks. I don't know what the Steelers' record was in those 10 games, but the Steelers finished 8-8, so Rudolph obviously wasn't good enough. In his 4-year career, Dobbs has appeared in 5 games and barely completed 50% of his passes, and that was in 2018. Sam has more talent than both of them combined. With a solid OL, great coaching, excellent rushing attack, and very good WRs, if Sam's fundamentals can get fixed, then he would have a chance to regain his confidence and swagger. Initially, the Steelers wouldn't be willing to give up a 2nd, but if another team or two also thought that they could fix Sam and that he would make their team better, the bidding could go up to a 2nd round pick, and that team would pay it. There aren't enough good QBs to go around in the NFL. That's why so many bad QBs are still hanging on making a living as backups and spot starters. Oh, I almost forgot. Here is a list of the QBs slated to be FAs in 2021: https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/free-agents/all/quarterback/ Even if the Steelers could fit him in under the cap, I'm not sure that they'd be willing to pay Dak Prescott $40 million. Would they opt to sign Trubisky, Newton, Fitzpatrick, Rivers or some other QB on that list instead? Perhaps, but they'd have the potential of having Sam for 10-15 more years. They value stability. I'm not sure they'd be willng to go year-to-year with older FA QBs. They'd be willing because of the importance of the QB position, Sam's talent, his youth and the possibility of having their QB position fixed for the next 10-15 years. That would be even more true if they blamed it all on the Jets' incompetence. Why isn't it up to the Jets? They don't have to trade him. They could keep him as a backup next season rather than give him away. It's totally up to the Jets and what they're willing to accept. Yes, he is bottom of the barrel now, but that's because his confidence is already shot, he's confused/frustrated, not a good fit in Gase's offense, Gase's play calling is awful and Sam has developed some bad habits due to having a poor OL and receiving corps the two previous seasons. Personally, I doubt if he can be salvaged, but some NFL HC or GM with a big ego and what he thinks is the right situation for Sam could think totally opposite. I think Sam's lack of leadership and mental toughness are at the crux of his issues, but I could be wrong. Sometimes all a player needs is a change of scenery. Sam has had a rough start to his career with the Jets. He's taken a pounding, he missed games because of mono, he got his throwing shoulder injured, he's had dumbasses for HCs and OCs, and other than McCown, not a good QB Coach/mentor. The Jets have lost a lot of games. The culture here is effed up. Put him in a situation where he's not expected to be the franchise "savior", where he will receive excellent coaching, has a solid OL and weapons around him, and an offense designed around what he does well rather than trying to force him to fit some system that doesn't match his talents, and he could blossom. In the end, it doesn't matter what you or I think about Sam. The only thing that matters is what other teams think of Sam, his potential, and whether they think that he is already ruined and unsalvageable. I agree. I don't think we will get a 2nd, but it IS a possibility imo. It only takes one team. Remember...no one thought we'd get much for Adams after the way he ran down the whole organization, and look what the Seahawks gave up for him. It would only take one GM/HC to think they could re-capture the Sam Darnold who was thought to be such a great prospect 3 years ago and it could happen. Strange and bizarre things happen in the NFL all the time. It could definitely happen.
As I told UKjetsfan, it doesn't matter what I or any of us would give up for him. We look at things from a fan's perspective. A GM or HC who knows the game more intimately than we do, who is excellent at what he does, could easily decide that Sam could be fixed with some patience and good coaching. Read the rest of my response to UKjetsfan where I specifically mention the Steelers situation. One thing I've learned in watching the NFL for 57 years, the unexpected can and does happen, and that fans who are cocksure that something would never happen, frequently does and are proven wrong. I agree that it's probably not likely that the Jets will get a 2nd for Sam, but I can see that it's totally possible. It only would take one team. Look at what Douglas got for Adams when no one thought the Jets would get squat for Adams.
Yes, Trubisky had a much better situation than Sam, but imo he wasn't nearly the prospect Sam was. I think Trubisky only started for one season at UNC. I thought it hilarious that the Bears traded up for him and passed on Mahomes and Watson. Sam is a lot more talented than Trubisky.
I can remember insisting that Sam needed to sit and learn behind McCown for half the season and the entire board trashing the idea. I can still remember the endless "there is no better way to learn then on the job" posts. There was like 2 other people on this board that agreed with me and I dont think they even post here anymore. Everyone else was full blown sink or swim Sammy.
