It doesn't matter what pick the Jets used for Quinnen. That's a sunk cost and has no bearing on the future.
It does, we got #3 pick for reason. We sucked. Top 5 picks are premium picks, that usually means either generational talent or pro Bowl type talent! So to trade that in 2 yrs. well,I suppose keep doing that then #3 picks will be normal occurrence. Say if we drafted Bosa, would you trade him? Yes he has already shown massive potential, but I don’t think SF wouldn’t trade him for any return. Same here, are the Jets sure Q not elite? Not sure. But to get late 1st round pick for him at this point, doesn’t seem like good deal to me. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I agree. It's a sunk cost and it doesn't matter at this point. The question is whether or not Williams is worth dealing for a late first round pick or if he should be our defensive anchor since he's a quality player (not great yet of course). He might never be great. But there comes a point in time where you have to start accumulating quality players at all positions. Ask the Texans or Cowboys if defensive tackles are important or not right now.
Like others have said, you need to hold on to your young talent that is improving. You simply can not let decent players go because you need a build a core.... Borat says this is part of the plan. Ok, please explain it to me because I am not getting it. Keeping a HC that maybe losing (or has already) the LR and letting good up and coming young players who could and should be part of your core...is not a plan its chaos and that is exactly what exists today.
If trading Williams is part of the plan then the plan needs to be reevaluated. He's a quality player. Not a superstar by any means. Unless there's something we really don't know and he's the second coming of the big disappointment that was Robertson. He just seems and feels like he'll be able to have a couple ten sack seasons in his career. His 'situation' is completely different than Adams' situation was as well. So they shouldn't be compared. Although it's frustrating that he's gone it seems like it was the right move.
We traded Richardson and paid Wilk because Richardson started a fight with Brandon Marshall during halftime of the Chiefs game in 2016. Obviously Bowles was not going to tolerate that and at the time it seemed like the only reasonable decision. Since Richardson has left he has been with 3 teams so he hasn't stuck anywhere and is basically just a merc. In todays league to get a solid pass rush against a decent line you need one of two things. 1. Two DLs who may require a double team. This stresses the o-line about when, who, and where to double - and of they do double two players they are toast for any blitz. If they only double one players then other is going to cause problems, etc. 2. You have Aaron Donald. People overuse the term generational talent. Donald is the only generational talent at DT in this league. He is in a class all his own. Right now we have one player who requires a double team. Thus we only need one more for a strong pass rush. If we trade that one player we are back to needing two players to develop a strong pass rush. Your not going to just steal a player that magically requires a double team in the later rounds of the draft. I don't know where people are getting that idea. They are first round picks. Trading our one player for a first rounder means we will have to use that pick on another DT in the first round. Thus returning to rolling the dice on DTs again. After the last six seasons WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WOULD WANT TO GO BACK TO THAT PLACE? Quinnen is a solid developing player who is essentially in his junior year of college. His best seasons are still ahead of him. At this juncture our DT problem is solved for the forseeable future. Now we just need a stud at DE. Trading Q now for anything less then two first rounders would be a massive step backward for our defense and rebuild. And even two first rounders would still be a gamble. The league sees we are currently in chaos and several teams are here to pick our bones before the trade deadline. That does not equate to a plan for a rebuild, it equates to the league showing up and trying to sucker our amateur management out of what little promising talent we have left to build around. This trade deadline is going to be another test for JD.
I think 2 1st rounders may be only way trading Q for me. But we all know never happening. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
You can only get two first rounders for defensive players who are A.) Proven Pro Bowlers. B.) Proven All Pro's and C.) Future HOF greats. Just a Safety. Or just a D-Lineman etc it doesn't matter because Quinnen is none of the above.
Agree with your post. I forgot the Richardson punch. In hindsight, Richardson was better to keep than Wilkinson, but he did come with an edge, that could cause further issues. Him and Gase would have clashed, so would be gone anyways. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I think it’s already pretty clear that this is a complete tear down...whether they trade Q or not... this is what tanking looks like...no one can say it, and publicly they will deny any notion of tanking because they have to. Players don’t tank. But the GM can make it happen by stripping down the talent level. A good example of this was when Bill Polian let the Colts run out Curtis Painter at QB when they were tanking for Andrew Luck. I think Polian was a great GM....he built up the Bills, Panthers and Colts and got them all successful...and I love listening to him on NFL Radio, so I don’t for one minute believe him when he says they were absolutely not tanking and that they were trying to win....come on! A great GM like that knows Curtis Painter is NEVER the best option at QB if you’re trying to win...however, he is assuredly the best option if you’re trying to tank. so that’s what I HOPE JD is doing...to the public, he HAS to say we are trying to win, but it’s clear as he gets rid of talent that he is tanking the season. at least that is what I have to believe, because if this is really his idea of fielding the best possible team, then we are all in big, big trouble...
I would have loved to have been able to keep Richardson. But it turns out he is a me guy and not really a team player. Just another DT pick we busted on.
No, no, and hell no. I never said this was a part of the plan. I said the opposite. Trading Q now, trading Crowder now does NOT make sense, and JD has not done things that don't make sense at the time he did them. It's just fake news, like the Crowder trade talk. Trading Adams, who asked for a huge contract JD is not ready to give yet or releasing Bell, who asked to be traded, never did well here, saves CAP in case of injury, opens up space for a youngster, and was going to be cut at the end of the year anyway are not in the same situation as Crowder and Q. Crowder and Q are on good contracts, and are good core players. Just because we released Bell, doesn't mean there is a fire sale going on.
Highly doubt this is planned by JD. On the colts, Painter was backup. I don’t think they picked cause he sucked. He turned not as good as they thought, and the team basically gave up w/o Peyton, and season was already over with all the losses. At some point yes, they sent him out there hopeless, but any team would have done same. Polian is great wonder if jets can get him? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Q Williams has shown flashes of being a consistently good player; at this stage consistently good does not make any player untouchable. If he yielded a first I’d make that trade. Like Adams, he was another one of Mac’s wrong picks when better players at more pressing positions were available.
Even if someone offers first, say mid rounder, what's the point? You think a guy like Q would be there mid first-late round though? He is still on a rookie deal and has two more years after this. Not sure if I see the point in dealing him, even for mid to late first rounder.
i don't need a lot of convincing on Q. i actually like him ev. At the same time, there's a cap and JD needs to figure out where he wants to spend. if he thinks DT is not the area to invest, I'm ok with that too. If he thinks DT is a critical position to invest then he should keep Q unless he's blown out of the water at the moment we can count our really good players on one hand and still have a good number of fingers to spare, so i'm in no hurry to get rid of him I am not a power user so don't know how to do the search feature but i recall the Richardson situation and recall posting that we should keep him then and (ironically) analogized to when we traded Vilma away. IIRC i got a lot of flak for that then
Probably. I've been vocal about building through the draft and not giving our big contracts and what not. But it's starting to get absurd here. Every good drafted player we get we have to deal or let go because we're scared to pay? Or they become a malcontent and force their way out in some fashion? It's a trend. Vilma always pissed me off for obvious reasons. He could've played in the 3-4 (talent obviously wouldn't be maximized), but players adapt. Lawrence Timmons and Shazier were both considered to be 4-3 WILL linebackers and they worked just fine in the 3-4. Shazier was going to be a DPOY candidate if he never got hurt.
