No excuses...

Discussion in 'New York Jets' started by ColoradoContrails, Sep 28, 2019.

  1. Biggs

    Biggs Well-Known Member

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    I believe the Packers highest scoring game last year was 44 points against the NY Jets. Philbin was the HC.

    The Packers went into a tail spin last year with Mike. They had a losing record the year before. They were shut out twice when their 2nd string QB played the year before.
     
  2. TonyFtLaud

    TonyFtLaud Well-Known Member

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    Same Jets team that gave up 41 points to the Bills a couple weeks earlier? 37 to Kirk Cousins too.
    McCarthy actually has a successful history of developing QB, which is what this team desperately needed.
    If Gase develops Sam, it will be his first time developing a QB.
    Rodgers is his own worst enemy. If he would run the plays called, hit the open Reciever instead of trying to force every ball deep, he would have several rings.
     
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  3. Biggs

    Biggs Well-Known Member

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    McCarthy did a wonderful job developing Alex Smith as a rookie.

    I can't see the argument that Mike developed Rodgers on the one hand but Rodgers freelancing cost the team multiple SB's on the other hand. Clearly either Mike is responsible for Rodgers or he isn't. I think you have this backwards.
     
  4. TonyFtLaud

    TonyFtLaud Well-Known Member

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    You can see it clearly, but you won't admit it.
     
  5. Biggs

    Biggs Well-Known Member

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    I honestly think it’s one of the craziest theories for why Green Bay underachieved I’ve every heard. Rodgers is the reason they have been in the hunt for years. I think you have it ass backwards.
     
  6. Passepartout

    Passepartout Active Member

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    Winning a game against a big time opponent like New England or that of the Chiefs could boast the team's spirit. But am running out of patience with Coach Gase. I am not the only one hopefully!
     
  7. TonyFtLaud

    TonyFtLaud Well-Known Member

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    There's no question Rodgers has won them games, the lack of defense held them back numerous times. A fact you ignore. In recent years, Rodgers has hurt almost as much as he has helped.
    Teammates have said on Record he changed play calls as much as 80 % of the time. The franchise publicly stated this past off-season ,they hope Rodgers isn't the problem again, regarding the new coach.
    You can't fault McCarthy for the play calling when Rodgers was changing the play that often and they had so much success prior. But admitting that discredits your praising Gase for Denver's success when Payton successfully changed his plays.
     
  8. Biggs

    Biggs Well-Known Member

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    You can't give Mike credit for developing Rodgers if you want to blame Rodgers for the teams underachieving. That's what is nuts. If you want to blame Green Bay underachieving on Rodgers and the D that's a pretty big red flag for the HC who was running the team on the field and had a very big influence on the front office for well over a decade.+

    If you want to throw Gase under the bus in a no excuses thread, stop making excuses for Mike McCarthy. Mike McCarthy coached a great organization that won before he got there and is winning after he left.
     
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  9. ouchy

    ouchy Well-Known Member

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    The truth is some where in between. McCarthy isn't a top 3 coach but he also isn't a terrible coach for not winning more SBs in GB. Its like saying Don Shula was a terrible coach for not winning the SB with Marino, Tony Dungly is bad because he only won 1 SB with Manning, Sean Peyton has only won 1 with Brees - etc. The fact is, the Jets could have hired an experienced winner, a guy who knows what it takes to win the SB, and instead passed him by.
     
  10. azhar80

    azhar80 Well-Known Member

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    No what I'm saying is, just bcuz someone has failed before in life doesnt mean they will continue to fail. Many coaches players are able to succeed in the right situation.
     
  11. azhar80

    azhar80 Well-Known Member

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    Pat's defense is a dink and dunk offense and throw deep when the dink and dunk offense is working. Same with Gase, did we not see 2 deep passes to Roby in game 1 that easily couldve blown the game open?

    Oline sucks but that is easily masked with the right Qb. We seen MccoMc last year stink with this oline and Sam made the Oline look decent.
     
  12. K'OB

    K'OB 2021 TGG Fantasy Football Champ

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    A whole two deep passes eh, wait until I get giddy about it.

    As for the Pats offence is dink and dunk, the comment was about his 3 seasons with Cleveland btw ;) and Brady seems to play a hell of a lot of deep balls for a dink and dunk offence and for that matter please, please, please do not try and compare Gase's offence to that of the Pats, fuck me o_O

    2 long balls to Robby in one game :D:D:D:D:D:D:(
     
  13. Bellys Lies

    Bellys Lies Well-Known Member

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    The only games gase won in Miami were at home and close games. He coached conservative and won. He had horrible defenses in Miami. Matt Burke was the worst d coach ever. The hiring of Greg Williams was the only good thing Gase has done in NY. It will get him 5-6 wins this season,especially with the weak teams remaining this season. That means he will be a 500 coach with Sam as QB. Gets the man a second yr. Then what do you do? Most of the wins will be close games and I assume Greg will get offered a HC job because the defense has played very well and will actually win a few of these games.
     
  14. azhar80

    azhar80 Well-Known Member

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    I see every pass play should be a 30+ yard pass play, with a line that cant give a QB 2 seconds. Love it. Madden play calling 101. How about we start doing fake punts at our 5 yard line?
     
  15. Jetsfansince95

    Jetsfansince95 Well-Known Member

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  16. Biggs

    Biggs Well-Known Member

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    I think Don Shula is still alive. We could hire him. Shula at least won 2 out of 3 SB when he had the best team in football.
     
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  17. ColoradoContrails

    ColoradoContrails Well-Known Member

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    Beat me to it.

    This is the part that sticks out:

    "The point — as it relates to the Jets and their beleaguered, bad-luck head coach Adam Gase, who’s been playing his third-string quarterback, Luke Falk, for the past three games — is this: Everyone in the league has adversity.

    Sure, some teams’ adversity is worse than others, but it’s how those coaches and teams handle whatever they’re dealt that they are measured by".

    And this is the crux of the entire "Fire Gase or not" argument.
     
  18. Biggs

    Biggs Well-Known Member

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    Every team does have adversity, the teams that stay healthy, field the best over all talent and have consistency in the front office, head coach and QB generally win consistently.

    This is a league of attrition. When you start off with a bad roster and attrition takes a couple of key players you're toast.

    The Browns put up 3 points last night with an absolutely staked Offense. KC put up 10 with an absolutely staked team after a couple of guys on O went down.

    If you can't block and you don't have a solid QB you can't move the ball against good teams.

    There is no compelling argument to fire Gase based on not being able to overcome a crappy roster where the key guys aren't in the lineup having nothing to do with Gase.

    That doesn't mean he's a good or a bad HC, neither does his past in Miami where his teams had lots of adversity and were still not very good but they were competitive. Post Gase they aren't remotely competitive.

    Gase is the guy this year. I want the Jets to show improvement when Sam and some of the other key guys are in the lineup. At that point we can start to see improvement and potential or make the case to move on.

    You can bring in a million articles and tear your eye's out of their sockets because our team is unwatchable. It doesn't change the facts of what are team is right now.
     
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  19. ColoradoContrails

    ColoradoContrails Well-Known Member

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    I get it Biggs, the old Tony Soprano argument which is intended to end all discussion: "It is what it is". Fair enough, I understand, but whenever big changes are required - in any situation in history - somebody said "Yeah, but what if it doesn't have to be?"

    Gase sucks. Maybe he'll be allowed to coach for the rest of the season, or maybe even his full contract, but that doesn't mean he's a good coach, or that anything will change. Change happens from agitation, and whether or not it's fair, a lot of Jets fans are agitated. This is what I warned when Gase was hired. Like or not, fair or not, he was going to be given a very short leash. If the Jets didn't get off to a good start - not necessarily winning every game, but being in every game and winning a couple - he was going to feel the heat. He had a hand in this roster; he made choices about who to sign as backup QBs, who to start, who to cut, and he's made choices about what schemes he would use and the plays he would call based on the personnel he had. And up until Sunday, he has denied any real responsibility for the failure, and even then, nowhere did he say "This falls on me". Apparently he believes he's smarter than everyone else, and the real problem is that people just can't keep with his intellect.

    But I get it: It is what it is.
     
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  20. ouchy

    ouchy Well-Known Member

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    Heres the thing Biggs. McCarthy sends in plays. Rodgers keeps changing them in the huddle. The plays don't work and GB loses. Now they both blame each other.

    The problem is the HC is charged with coming up with a gameplan. If the QB keeps changing the plays than the HC cannot execute his gameplan. It doesn't matter who's play choices were better. What matters is the QB is hamstringing the HC. Someone has to be in charge, and Rodgers thought it should be him, not the HC. He is an MVP QB so he wins in the end. This situation reflects more on Rodgers' discipline than it does on McCarthy's coaching.
     
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