LOL! I provided that in my last post (three trade downs by MacCagnan in 2017 draft), the result of which Cimini described as trading a "quarter for two dimes." You obviously did not read my entire last post or you chose to ignore it. So, we apparently disagree on the jets GM ability to get the jets quality players. Look at the jets roster right now--after 4 years of MacCagnan, we have very few quality players and just finished another year in the basement of the AFC East at 4-12. Parcells always said you are what your record says you are. Anyway, if you want to keep talking up Maccagnan and where he has got us so far, feel free--you can have the last word.
I’d say that is more of a drafting problem,which everyone has criticized him about,than a trading problem. He hasn’t done a great job and the case for firing him is strong enough where it would have been a justifiable move but let’s try to keep the criticism to where it is deserved and give credit where it is due. The trade he has made to obtain players have been good. The draft picks he has made after the first round , regardless of how he obtained the picks used, have not. Stating he is bad at trading is just false .
(1) We do not want Von Miller. He's on the wrong side of 30...best years behind him....by his own admission he didn't show up for 4-5 games this year. Costs alot of $$$....he's perfect for a Super Bowl contender, not us. The idea is to get a cheap pass rusher in the draft. (2) Do NOT trade down EXCEPT if we get a haul (e.g., 50% more in value points). The last time we had this obsession with recouping picks was 1998 and Parcells blew Orlando Pace for a bunch of guys who wouldn't be on the team in 3 or 4 years. Do NOT pass on Bosa or Allen assuming we have a shot at one of them. (3) If Bosa and Allen go 1-2 (doubtful), then a trade down is more likely because I'm not sold on Quineen Williams or Jonah Williams overall or at #3. Many years ago, the Cowboys took Russel Maryland #1 overall because he was solid. They KNEW he would never be "worth" the #1 overall pick but that team was so loaded they could afford to play it safe. We can't do that at #3 if Allen/Bosa are both gone UNLESS the Jets see something/know something that someone they can take at #3 is guaranteed to make 4 or 5 All-Pro teams in the next decade.
It seems that the top players in this year's draft are either edge rushers (DE, OLB) or DT. Edge rushers are a lot like QB's because you can't tell from college how they'll translate to the pros. Nevertheless, like QB's, when you need one (and the Jets do), and you're in position, you have to take a shot because the rewards can be enormous. I don't care how many picks you trade down for, if you pass on a top edge rusher the chances of getting one later in the draft are reduced. The Jets should stay exactly where they are at 3 and take the best guy that's on the board, even if it's the DT Williams from Bama who's rated very highly. Jet run defense was very disappointing toward the end of the season, so that's a position of need as well.
I'm not taking Quineen Williams at #3 unless he's closer to Aaron Donald than an average tackle. We can get run-stoppers in the 2nd and 3rd and even 4th round. Get a guy who can hit and kill Brady. Allen or Bosa have to be the pick assuming that someone trades up to 1/2 for a QB.
I would tend to agree with you about Allen and Bosa, but remember, we took DT Shepard in round three last year and I don't think he quite lived up to the projections. From what I've read so far, Williams is close to Donald in potential.
I would prefer a trade down so that we can draft mid round Offensive lineman and a running back. We can still do that with the picks we have, but it would be nice to add more. It is very possible that McCagnan will be looking to trade back after giving up three 2nd round picks in the Darnold trade. Only makes sense to try and recover some of those lost assets.
Allen and Bosa are the only two I've seen so far that stand out potentially elite pass rushers. But I'm going to puke if I hear one my analyst mock Williams to the Jets on the grounds that he's the best player available. Almost every other year we need a pass rusher, or a wide receiver, or a middle linebacker, and yet we end up drafting a big, slow, run stuffing D-lineman because he's "too good to pass up." And it's gotten us absolutely shit. And only one of them is even still on the team.
And another thing to consider: going into the 2018 season Raekwon Davis was "the man" and drawing all the pre-season media attention among DL prospects. Then came the season and Quinnen Williams stepped up, cleaned house and took over Alabama's defense. Raekwon Davis? He's forgoing the 2019 draft and heading back to Tuscaloosa for his senior year. Even the other Williams (Jonah) was gettng more early season ink and as it turns out Jonah Williams (not a prototypical athletic,rangy LT) is not #3 overall caliber. I'd take a trade down for additional picks in a heartbeat but it Macc's staying at #3, the value pick is one of the front-7 monsters. .
I would as well, but if we can't any of the big three in Bosa, Allen, or Williams would be fine by me. At this point I don't really see anyone else I'd want at that position in the draft.
The guy who was supposedly the best player in the 2015 draft, but has been a middle of the road talent who doesn't show up on every play? Yeah, I've seen him.
Quineen Williams Fans....make the case for him at #3. I'm open to drafting him, but tell me why this guy makes 2-3 All-Pro teams and a half-dozen Pro Bowls that we didn't see from Wilkerson, Richardson, or Williams. Tell me (1) why he's worth drafting at #3 instead of a trade down for another #1 or a few #2's and #'3s.....OR.... (2) is worth drafting over Bosa/Allen.
Here's my criteria: I want an ELITE player at #3.....ELITE !!!.....not good, not solid, not a non-bust or OK for the pick. Elite. If nobody at #3 is elite, then trade down.
You understand that (i) ELITE in college may not translate to ELITE in the pros (Dante Fowler says hi) and (ii) you need a partner to trade down.
Of course....and good point on Fowler....but many times teams think a guy is just "OK" or "Solid" for the position and then oversell him to the fanbase and media. I think Allen and Bosa are potentially elite players. If they measure up at the combine....if they ace the interviews....if they have HIGH MOTORS and understand that it's a JOB and not a GAME on Sundays.....I think you are looking at impact players. I'm less sold on the Williams guys from Alabama. And while I'm an Alabama fan personally, their track record of defensive guys -- and some offensive line guys -- hasn't been that great under Saban. Ghost of Vernon Ghoulston (i.e., not enough games against good competition/teams) ?
You’ve admitted yourself you’ve never watched Williams. How do you know he’s not better than Allen AND Bosa by a BIG margin. I’m not saying he is but nobody here knows how any of these guys will translate to the NFL. We all love Bosa because of his brother and how he looked before he got injured but is he REALLY better than his brother? I like Allen but he could be a complete bust. Do you, perhaps, remember another 3rd pick of the draft that was supposed to be an absolute stud rush DE/OLB? Dion Jordan? The guy had as many drug suspensions as sacks. He was an ELITE talent pass rusher. Could play all over the field as a massively distruptive force. That could be Allen. Or Bosa. You have no idea.
