So you're agreeing, they put up similar numbers so you're off into leadership. Something we know Geno failed at work the Jets and something we have no idea how Mayfield will do with his NFL team.
I said it for one reason. Some people are looking at numbers only. Think they know what a player is and what he will be totally off of his college stats without a clue as to their game. Perfect proof that it's more than stats, Geno Smith vs Mayfield, number wise.
If we get one of those two I'll be extremely happy. I think those two are a level up on Mayfield and Allen. We should be so lucky!
Good, look up the numbers. Remember that Geno was supposed to be a 1st round pick. Other than to call it crazy explain how the same type numbers are not the same. You know because it just doesn't fit your point of view. It's crazy, right? . What's crazy is how stats are totally the end all when Mayfield fans want to jump him ahead of Allen, not so much when they're the same as Geno Smith.
My gut says the disconnect is between Allen and Mayfield. I suspect the brass would be happy with Rosen and or Darnold. But the third choice is not unanimous. This choice will require Chris, Mac and Bowles to be joined at the hip. It's that important. Bates needs to weigh in big time. When you draft someone at three, he needs to be ready to start sooner than later.
I'm not agreeing. You accuse Mayfield fans of only caring about stats yet that isn't the case. There is a whole host of factors that make Mayfield a great choice for the Jets where Geno was not.
You haven't been reading posts then. Lol That's all they talk about. And given that he comes from an offense that has nothing to do with an NFL offense there is absolutely no way to know that he will be a great choice or a worse choice than Geno was. Both would be viable choices. One didn't work out, no guarantees the second will. Actually to me, the way it was stacked in Mayfields favor to put up big numbers he's not a better choice. As I said, mostly just to show why you can't be so dependent on stats.
I remember last year when people were arguing for Adams over others, several people here acknowledged that he might not be quite as good as say Lattimore, but his LEADERSHIP was what the real difference was in his favor. If that can be said about a DB, how much more true must it be for a QB? I still hope it's Rosen because in addition to his clear advantage as a passer, I think that will be the basis for the respect he garners as a leader. But I agree that Mayfield's leadership quotient is very high and would be an asset on an offense that seems lost.
I'm not trying to speak for the Mayfield collective, but myself. I recognize his weaknesses, and I disagree as to what those are. What legitimately scares me about him is when I hear that he maintains a list of media members. That raises the question of whether this is an overblown thing that isn't a big deal, or if he is a mental patient who is on course for a massive burnout. Someone like Sam Darnold doesn't have this concern and I can understand why he is seen as safer, despite being the turnover king in this class. The height thing doesn't bother me at all because you can scheme that issue away. The height topic is where Brees / Wilson / etc are completely relevant. The height thing can be overcome so long as the player progresses properly. Then there is the college system issue. This too can be overcome, and there is a history of players who have and the rate of players who are doing so is increasing. The spread system criticism is diminishing because of the NFL's evolution into a passing centric game. I have a problem with the attribute criticisms the same way people have a problem with statistics. When viewed through a myopic prism, you tend to miss the forest through the trees. Mayfield is so much more than his statistics. He is NOT the most physically gifted, and that is commonly accepted. He is however an incredibly efficient gamer with through the roof intangibles. Many don't want to buy the intangibles because of the arrest and a few other things. My own research on those topics has led me to believe those concerns are overrated. Mayfield's arrest was dopey, and even unacceptable, but it is not indicative of greater problems. You don't hear about things like that with guys at other positions simply because the event and the position are not high profile enough to warrant talking about, where his being a top 5 QB it is. It is much ado about nothing. Then as I pointed out earlier, there is always the list thing. It is fair to ask if his motivation can be maintained, the same way it is fair to ask of Josh Rosen as well. That is where we just don't know and need to trust the NFL teams to do due diligence on these guys.
Bowles needs a lot more than just looking in the mirror...ahahah..dont ya think? It's scary if they put so much time into Allen although I don't really see that Kurt. HOW does Toilet Bowles the most conservative anal Coach in the world SAY he prefers Mayfield?? Strange..strange ...If this is reportedly true that Bowles LIKES BM it would be NICE abut a complete shocker frankly...I think if Bakers the pick he WINS DESPITE our crappy HC ....Bates has to be the key here
You are forgetting how DUMB Geno was/is ...as far as I am concerned Baker is a brilliant football player compared to Smith Kid is smart enough to learn a NEW system ..did you ever learn anything new LF??
2 of the 3 seasons Bowles has had a decent offense with a journeyman QB who everyone saw as a complete JAG. And on to of that to these 2 long time QBs had good statistical seasons which were career years. The whole he's sad coach who kills QBs is nonsense.
We had no idea coming into the draft if Geno was smart or not. Just as we have no idea how smart Mayfield will be as a NFL QB. Of course you like Mayfield, don't like Geno so you just know Mayfield is smarter. You do understand this is not based on fact, no one will know until Mayfield proves it. Not saying he won't, saying we don't know.
There was no leak. Bowles told the press what he values in a QB and the traits he specifically listed are most closely attributable to Mayfield based on common public perception. Combine this with a Mehta report (so trustworthy, I know) that the Jets internally are having "healthy disagreements" over which QB is the "right" QB that it has created a perception that Bowles is the Mayfield advocate. Frankly, every thing I've listed above is totally untrustworthy hearsay and should hold no value. That said, that is what is currently happening in the rumor mill.
Here's what we know about Geno. There was a point where he was considered a potential top 5 pick. Fast forward to draft day, and we are watching Geno in the green room pouting and looking like he just swallowed a goldfish. The next day, John Idzik, in all his infinite wisdom and cleverness, decides that he's just defeated the draft and obtained a franchise QB who simply fell into his lap. Then we have Geno's stay with the Jets that included several reports of unprofessional behavior, a generally angry demeanor, and a propensity for turnovers. Geno has talent, there is no doubt about that. He showed flashes, especially against Miami. But flashes aren't success. I believe it wasn't Geno's talent that was lacking, but his character. I believe teams successfully identified Geno as a character problem, and that's why he fell out of the first round. If he hadn't been a major concern in that regard, he would've went significantly higher. I also believe that teams are not coming away with the same impression of Mayfield. I think if there IS a universal belief that Mayfield is more trouble than he's worth, than he too will slide as opposed to going in the top 5 or 10.
No one knew about the bold until the day around / post draft. He was the top QB up until like the last couple days per reports. The draft process is still on-going. It's just like when people loved Manziel's football IQ (ie reports; Gruden), now all of a sudden you see reports that claim Manziel didn't know how to prepare himself.
Bill Polian was kissing his ass too. The media has such an influence, sometimes we don't know the full story.
I gotcha now. Yes, I agree, it's not just about stats, but people arguing for Mayfield aren't exclusively going off stats from what I've seen. They seem to be going based on leadership and also lack of stats for Allen in comparison. No college QB with a comp% that low has ever amounted to anything in the NFL. Maybe he'll be the first but chances are low. Stats don't say everything, but they play a factor. Winning titles and coming through in big games does as well.
