When Mac and Bowles took over this team in 2015, there was virtually no young talent to speak of. By my count, Mo, Sheldon, Pryor and Enunwa are the only players who were under 25 when this regime took over and are still contributing the team. I don’t need to emphasize how unbelievably terrible that is. I also don’t need to point out, since it’s often mentioned on here, that the goal became to launch a “competitive rebuild”. Mac brought in a bunch of late-prime and post-prime veterans in an effort to cover the stench while he rebuilt the team in his own vision. Somehow, we were able to avoid injuries and age-related regression that is typically seen in a team comprised of mostly veterans and pulled out a 10-6 season, which overhauled everyone’s mindset and made them completely forget about the true state of the team. Now that those factors have caught up to us, people see a 3-9 team led by a bunch of post-prime players (Revis, Mangold, Harris, etc…) and figure that there’s no hope for the future, and that the only course of action is to blow the whole thing up again. It would be an enormous mistake to fire either Mac or Bowles after this season. The way I see it, they’re a perfect pairing for each other based on their mindsets. Mac operates on the concept of “draft and develop”. Bowles is an old-school coach that makes sure young players are completely ready before earning their playing time (Hell, Leonard Williams was considered the best player in the draft and they made him a rotational player for the first half of last season while he learned the NFL game). This combination, joined with the idea of a competitive rebuild, has led to almost 2 years of band-aid players assuming the identity of the team, while the young players sat in the background and watched. Why would we fire them right when that’s about to change? This organization has spent the last 2 years developing young players and we’re going to just pull the plug right before the season that was the likely target date for their arrival? Almost all of the veteran contracts Mac signed and traded for had guaranteed money either terminate or drop off precipitously before 2017, and he was adamant about only giving Fitzpatrick a 1 year contract. 2017 was always the plan, and that’s absolutely fine. There is absolutely, positively no way to regenerate a nucleus of young talent in 1 or 2 seasons unless you somehow have 20 freaking picks within the first 3 rounds of the draft. Christian Hackenberg, Deon Simon, Jordan Jenkins, Juston Burris, Robby Anderson, Jalin Marshall, Charone Peake, Devin Smith, Brandon Shell… These are all young guys that have barely made contributions but clearly have potential. They’re just being brought along slowly, and I believe next year is when they take over for the veterans that have held this team together while the plan was executed. When you add them to Darron Lee, Leonard Williams, Mo, Sheldon, Pryor, Mauldin, Winters and Enunwa and another full draft class, I think there’s more than enough promising young talent to wait another year to see the direction of the team before moving on from the guys who brought them in and developed them. Maybe Mac and Bowles aren’t the right guys to lead this team, there are surely a lot of ominous signs. However, I think it’s reckless, irresponsible and would set the franchise back 2 years if we fire them before ever seeing what their vision for the organization was. Seriously, they’ve never even gotten a chance to implement their own quarterback… It would also send a horrible message to future GM/HC combos that they won’t be allowed the time to correctly rebuild the team, and force them to make ill-advised decisions in pursuit of immediate success. TL;DR: We’ve endured the lumps of this rebuild, and even got a good season out of it somehow. Moving on before it’s complete would be a waste of time.
I simply dont see Bowles resonating with this group of players. He is clearly not ready to be a head coach. He said this last game was about execution, NOT ABOUT EFFORT. huh? Is this guy on the same page as everyone else? No way. I also don't see how he and Mac can get alone. Personally...I think Woody should have Mac hire a head coach that is to both of their likings. My biggest disappointment is how badly the defense has looked. A defensive guru that Bowles is supposed to be, especially for secondaries has been totally blasted on the field by big plays time and time again. It is very lackadaisical play and the coach has to take accountability for that.
LOL Whatever guy. I couldn't possibly disagree with you any stronger or more than I do regarding Bowles. I doubt that anyone's forgotten about the state of the talent level on the team when Mac and Bowles took over. There is absolutely NO reason why Bowles should be brought back. He hasn't learned or improved, at all, and if anything, he has regressed. He is not holding players accountable, can't motivate the team or get them prepared for games and appears to have lost the team. Mac should absolutely be back. Only a few posters are saying he should be fired. He has shown potential, made good moves, and it will be another year or two before we can accurately judge his drafts. OTOH, Bowles has done nothing, is clueless, and he is the one who is mucking things up and would be holding this team back. The only enormous mistake (other than your post) would be to bring Bowles back.
If I bought the Jets tomorrow, I would clean house because of how bad the team has been. I could just explain to coaching/GM candidates that I want to hire my own people. It's tougher for Woody though; if he fires Bowles and/or Mac, he'll get the Jimmy Haslam reputation, which is the last thing we need.
A new owner would be very welcome and would by necessity need to pick his own regime. But you're right, bad organizations fire people every 2 years and get caught in the cycle instead of giving the decision makers time to execute their plan. The only way Woody should move on at this stage is if he knows he can miraculously lure Harbaugh, who is an absolute match made in heaven for Christian Hackenberg.
"#Jets DE Sheldon Richardson to me on talk of Todd Bowles’ job security following MNF loss to the #Colts, via phone: “It’s always an easy to decision to sit and say clean house…Ultimately I could see if it was five or six years in, and we weren’t going anywhere; but after two years, no.”" But I'm sure you have a better pulse of the situation than them
the defense is clueless. bowles and rogers are terrible at communicating their vision in a digestible manner ... if bowles doesnt go then rogers must
I would give them one season, but I would allow the GM to control the personnel and allow the GM to be responsible for the HC.
First off, it's very easy to disagree with someone without being arrogant and disrespectful, it happens in hundreds of posts on this site daily. If you haven't forgotten about the talent level on the team when the 2 took over, then why is it fair to pin the shortcomings on Bowles? He was given a veteran team and competed with it, then when the bottom fell out of the old players there was nothing left to fall back on. He's coaching with a team that had little talent just 2 years ago and was replenished with veterans and developmental players; when the veterans started to get hurt and regress due to age who did you expect him to win with?
I kinda agree that firing would just set back this team a few more years. I'm willing to give the staff more time. The constant turnover is just something that doesn't work in the NFL. I agree that patience is needed here and I want to give this team that. Now I'm not sure the lack of decent play is something to be fired over but Monday was just a brutal watch. Maybe some players quit, maybe it isn't their year. I want to give the staff more time though.
This is a great topic, and as always plenty of kneejerk reactions. Plenty of reasons not to fire the HC / OC. https://www.reddit.com/r/nyjets/comments/5h0eic/gailey_is_not_the_issue/ For a change, I would like to see if the CS can get out of this funk, before prematurely firing someone.
I'm not even saying they should automatically get 5 years to fix this. I'm only vouching for the 2017 season. If they put in their young players and it's a complete dud, then you can let them go with the clear conscience of knowing that their plan just wasn't going to be successful. But if the team goes 7-9 or 8-8 with a clear upward direction and the young talent comes in and shows they can take over the team going forward (e.g; the Raiders last year) then you keep them.
I think Bowles has pretty much forced Mac's hand....I think he needs to go at this point. He's just been awful in every way imaginable. I really liked the move at first and thought he would learn from his first year of mistakes but that definitely did not happen. Same issues as always. Poor clock management, poor motivational skills, his shit defensive scheme which uses not A SINGLE ONE of his players to the best of their abilities. Hate Rex all you want. At least he made our defense a top 10 finisher every year....with much less pure talent than we have now. It's disgraceful to say the least. We've regressed significantly this year with arguably the same or slightly better roster. And I don't want to hear about the damn schedule because we've lost to shit teams too. Also looking back at that first six games, those teams aren't nearly as good as we thought they'd be.
I think Gailey is fine...and tbh I wouldn't mind seeing him promoted to head coach and see what can happendix if he runs the ship. He maximizes talent. Bowles makes it look worse.
The organizational chart is set up so either the HC or the GM can be fired by the owner without having to start fresh with both guys every time. I want Mac to stay. TB put together a terrible CS, fired April at the end of last year and ST improved slightly. While I think TB should be fired, I believe that TB will be given a 3rd year to implement his plan, but I think it's going to fail. It's going to fail because they don't have a QB and can't develope one, the days of sitting a QB for 3 years are gone. The way this CS might want to develope him is too old school for the instant gratification of today's business world. I have said it before and I will say it again, if TB wants to keep his job, he needs to fire Gailey and Rodgers and bring in an OC that is balanced, emphasizes the run and uses a TE. Hire a DC that sticks to the 3-4 personnel they have. The Jets have a defensive roster that is set up with 3-4 personnel but part of the failure of the CS is they have this belief that by playing the 4-3 they have all of their skilled players on the field more often. That's fools gold, because now you have more guys playing out of position, and the production will suffer because of it. Change is good, Woody just has to make sure that the next guy he brings in as HC is either an experienced HC or an OC that can develope a QB and has a balanced approach. Keep Mac and fire TB.
Go back to Gailey being a HC, he was terrible when he was younger now that he is like 70, I don't think he is going to be better.
That performance monday should absolutely be the nail in the coffin for bowles. Youre at home, prime time, against a team who frankly isnt that great and you get stomped on start to finish. Ive never seen a lack of effort like that. I generally agree with the idea of continuity, and I liked that Rex wasnt prematurely fired. But Rex at least had qualities that gave you some hope. I have zero reason to believe that Bowles can turn into a quality HC. Mac on the other hand should stay. Our organiztional chart is downright stupid. Let mac hire his own HC, and if in a few years we're in this same spot, then you fire him.
Why would we listen to 2 of the guys that have destroyed this thing? Sheldon Richardson thinks the Jets don't need to clean house? Hey, Sheldon, how about you fuckin show up to play???? that guy was benched monday night because he was completely dogging it. They shouldve traded him for whatever Dallas was offering, its better than a guy who slacks off. They had to put Deon Simon in the game because the kid wants it more. and Brandon Marshall? of course he's going to support Bowles. Bowles is allowing him to get 10 targets a game as the ship completely sinks... He's not going to want someone to say "gee maybe this throwing to Marshall all game stuff isn't so efficient" -- I'm sorry but there's no fuckin way the Jets should factor in what these idiots think. I'd say if the players want Todd Bowles despite this shit show, that's an even bigger reason to shake things up. I want the players pissed off not relaxing every week and counting down the days until its over. fuck those 2 guys
Arrogant is your perception. IMO your perspective makes zero sense and is borderline insanity. I don't understand how any knowledgeable fan could have seen the horrible way this team has played this season coming out flat in almost every game; continually beaten itself with stupid penalties, mental errors and sloppy play; how the game plans have been awful; how there have been no adjustments; how Bowles has continually made stupid comments to the media and head scratching moves; how players who have always played with a high motor now suddenly are not trying, and come up with the conclusion that Bowles isn't to blame and should be brought back or it's a huge mistake. While I may respect you as a person, your opinion/perspective is so ridiculous imo that I have no respect for that opinion that Bowles should be brought back. He's done nothing well and has done nothing to deserve being brought back. Stability doesn't come just from having the same people in charge. They have to actually be competent and good at their job. Have you ever considered that maybe, just maybe, the play of those veteran players has fallen off so badly because Bowles doesn't put them in a position to succeed, they don't like his philosophy/approach, don't think he is competent, and have lost all respect for him? If not, imo you should strongly consider it. Almost everyone else here sees how incompetent Bowles is. How is that you don't?
I think we should be keeping Bowles, Mac and Gailey for at least another year. The DC, Rodgers, I don't care if he gets fired. Bowles should call plays on the defensive side of the ball or get someone that is better at it. better lineman coaches, better secondary coach ... I would rather see those upgraded. Gailey is too old to be HC.
