Russia in Syria

Discussion in 'BS Forum' started by mute, Sep 25, 2015.

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  1. Antoni

    Antoni Well-Known Member

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    What does a EU/US puppet government have to do with Crimea? How about sitting in your shitty ass Russia and not acting like Hitler and trying to "protect" the Russians in Crimea? Because after all, that is the Russian argument--that they are protection Russians overboard. It's the same argument Hitler used. The "Russian Separatists" in Ukraine are all Russian.

    A US/EU puppet government in Ukraine is impossible anyway. Why? Russian intelligence. We can't reliably work with them because of the GRU/SVR/FSB which have laughably infested all of Ukraine.
     
  2. Cman69

    Cman69 The Dark Admin, 2018 BEST Darksider Poster

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    exactly like.. That was a hard lesson both the Russians and the Brits learned. Too bad we didn't.
     
  3. Br4d

    Br4d 2018 Weeb Ewbank Award

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    The Russian argument is and always has been that the Ukraine is in their sphere of influence and that other world powers should stay out of the political affairs of countries on Russia's border.

    Think of it in this case as the "Breadbasket Doctrine". That would be like the "Monroe Doctrine" only Russia isn't claiming an entire hemisphere, just the countries that used to be part of the Soviet Union and are directly on the Russian border for the most part.

    Russia's reaction in Syria was much more delayed in terms of it's timing because Syria, a true Russian client for two generations, didn't fit the proximity criteria that Georgia, and the Ukraine did. Syria doesn't share a border with Russia.

    The Baltic States are spared only because they joined NATO before Putin decided to try to re-establish Russia as a superpower. There is a real possibility that the expansion of NATO to include states with a significant Russian population for the first time was the thing that led Putin to pull Russia as far back from the new detente as possible. Relations between the US and Russia became noticeably chillier after Latvia and Estonia joined NATO in 2004. By 2008 the Russians were pushing back hard against NATO in Georgia, a process that led to the Russo-Georgian War and the de facto annexation of South Ossetia by the Russians, accomplished by declaring South Ossetia and Abkhazia as separate republics not bound to Georgia.

    Fighting Putin with economic weapons, which is what the West has continually tried to do will not work. The key players who support him will never be discomfited enough by sanctions and seizures to risk the consequences of breaking with him and Russian nationalists of all stripes. The sanctions that we do put in place just cause more hardship for the average Russian and make it easier for Putin to enlist him in the struggle against Western Imperialism.

    This is one of those situations where honey would be much more effective in pacifying the bear. Using a stick just makes it angrier and results in unpredictable actions against our interests.
     
    #183 Br4d, Mar 16, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 16, 2016
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  4. alleycat9

    alleycat9 Well-Known Member

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    so you could say imagine what would happen if russia decided it wanted to be a major influence in a country in close proximity to the us... like lets say, i dont know.... cuba maybe?
     
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  5. Br4d

    Br4d 2018 Weeb Ewbank Award

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    Well, we annexed Guantanamo Bay in response. Effectively.
     
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  6. Sundayjack

    Sundayjack pǝʇɔıppɐ ʎןןɐʇoʇ
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    This actually ticks me off differently than most people. The US government, and particularly the military, has commandeered some pretty friggin nice real estate over the last 200 years or so, but you and I will never see it. There's an island not far from Martha's Vineyard - matter of fact, it was originally called Martha's Vineyard, and now known as Noman's Land. From a mile away, a gorgeous chunk of land, with all sorts of really enticing fishing nooks. Except the Navy used to use it for bombing practice and when they got done with it the US Fish and Wildlife closed it off as a nature preserve. I step one foot on Noman's Land, a pimply-faced little creep in a ranger's hat will have the coast guard tase me, wrestle me to the ground, seize my boat, molest me less tenderly than I generally request and fine me the last twelve years of my earnings. If nothing else over the next four years, I want a Trump Resort on Noman's Land.
     
  7. Br4d

    Br4d 2018 Weeb Ewbank Award

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    The area is likely closed off due to the government not wanting to be responsible for UXB's left from the years of use as a naval firing range. If they ever give up Plum Island I'm pretty sure it will be turned into a nature preserve with no human visitors allowed also. Slightly different reason, that being the notoriety attached as opposed to actual danger levels, but they still won't want people traipsing around unsupervised on an island where the government would likely be exposed to tremendous bad publicity if anything bad actually happened to anybody.

    I could be wrong on this but I believe you are not allowed to travel to Alcatraz except on a park service sponsored tour. It's there but if you tie your boat up to the dock they'll have you shove off with instructions to go get a ferry ticket on the mainland to take the tour.
     
  8. Sundayjack

    Sundayjack pǝʇɔıppɐ ʎןןɐʇoʇ
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    Well, yeah, I know why they SAY I can't go there. Look at a nautical chart. Just about anywhere off the east coast you'll see some area marked for unexploded ordnance.

    We'll never really know, will we? Looks to me like a pretty friggin' amazing place to fish and walk around. But I suppose you're right. I mean, it's the gub'mint. It MUST be for my own good that I never step foot there.

    You all just wait until Trump makes Noman's great again.
     
  9. Br4d

    Br4d 2018 Weeb Ewbank Award

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    The gub'mint is why most Americans aren't living in shacks and fishing up dinner. That's kind of how America was prior to the Great Depression and it didn't get better at that point until the gub'mint stepped in and actually did a few things to make some areas of America livable for the average person. The TVA is a good place to start on that list as is the Rural Electrification Act.

    I get that it's in style to rip the gub'mint now but the people who rip the hardest also tend to be the people two steps from falling off the grid entirely. Not you of course but all the people who think taxes just pay for welfare and corruption and the streets in front of their houses and between their towns are like all magical and the sewer systems that keep their water clean (sorry Michigan, you drank the Tea from the Party on that one) are God-given and the fact that their kids don't have two heads is because local business is so upstanding as opposed to terrified of the EPA.

    It is a corrupt government system that we're dealing with but until fairly recently the corruption also greased the rails of transit and transportation and kept bridges safe to use and water safe to drink (sorry Flint) and the crick from running all rainbow colors when the mill had spill day.

    Guess what Jack? Nobody is buying the stuff you guys are selling any more. Those people you think are going to elect Trump? They want THEIR needs attended too just like everybody else's seem to be. They hate gub'mint welfare but they'd love gub'mint overtime instead of holding down two jobs while the missus does hers and the kids run wild.
     
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  10. alleycat9

    alleycat9 Well-Known Member

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    i wonder if that is fresh water on those ponds on nomans island....
     
  11. Petrozza

    Petrozza Administrator

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  12. JetsVilma28

    JetsVilma28 Well-Known Member

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    ^ this is huge deal, largely underscored by what's happening in NYC.
     
  13. abyzmul

    abyzmul R.J. MacReady, 21018 Funniest Member Award Winner

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    Total coincidence!
     
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  14. JetsVilma28

    JetsVilma28 Well-Known Member

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    Something big is happening. Pieces are moving.
     
  15. abyzmul

    abyzmul R.J. MacReady, 21018 Funniest Member Award Winner

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    Over the next month, Trump will make at least 3 more ridiculous statements that will throw people up in arms, Hillary (or someone that looks like Hillary) will show up and hug victims and make 200 tweets about national security and Trump, Obama will talk to the public once and pardon 900 convicts, and nothing will actually be done about what just happened except for maybe a bill passing to track anyone who buys a pressure cooker.
     
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  16. Antoni

    Antoni Well-Known Member

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    "pro-Russian insurgents" aka Moscow backed Russians in Ukraine shot down that Malaysian jet a few years ago and killed like 300 civilians.


    Funny though that the Russian media is painting this actual mistake as deliberate. Putler steals billions and you don't hear anything. Those who speak out are executed like Nemtsov and Politkovskaya or get shit dumped on them at best.
     
  17. abyzmul

    abyzmul R.J. MacReady, 21018 Funniest Member Award Winner

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    You say this as if US media is somehow noble and objective. Both countries have a propaganda arm and they are using it.

    Only, one is blatant about executions. The other pretends it's Supreme Court Justice fell asleep with his face in a pillow.
     
  18. NotSatoshiNakamoto

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    remember when they talk about Hillary's great experience, this is the type of results she gets.
     
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  19. Petrozza

    Petrozza Administrator

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    Manhattan Bridge earlier today :)

     
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