Blaine Gabbert as a top 10 pick in the first round of the 2011 draft should be taken into context. If you remember, there was an unusual run on QBs in that draft (4 of the first 12 picks) because of the impending CBA agreement which redefined contract spending limits on first round picks as well as measures (simpler rookie contracts) to prevent holdouts. As a result of all this, a number of these "lower $-risk 1st rd. QBs" went higher than they should or normally would have: #1 Cam Newton: was going to be the #1 pick anyway, CBA or not (n.b. Newton ended up getting 1/2 the guaranteed money Sam Bradford did). #8 Jake Locker: like Matt Barkley (USC), Locker should've come out after his junior season. #10 Blaine Gabbert: now on his 2nd QB-strapped team that very well may be looking to draft another QB. #12 Christian Ponder: surrounded by great Fla. State talent - no way was this guy upper 1st round material.
Ponder actually was a good QB but multiple injuries in college and the pros ruined his career. Pre-injury he had a lot of potential.
Yes he was. My point was that he would've been (like Barkley at USC) better off had he come out a year earlier. Guy had athletic skills (nice mobility) but was a victim of timing and circumstances.
He's not like Barkley. Barkley always sucked. Ponders last year in college was his most successful so I think you are mistaken. And he was picked 12th overall, saying he would have been better off declaring a year earlier makes no sense.
It's apparent 74 and I have a completely different views of QB prospects. I'm a quasi-FSU fan, and I thought Ponder was at best a Day 3 prospect then. I was completely floored when the Vikings drafted him in the first. Ponder is a very smart guy that played like an idiot on the field at least in college. Locker I thought was a bit of a reach but at least it could be excused because of the apparent potential. Gabbert I know nothing about; wasn't the concern with him was that he was like a one year wonder?
The point was, Locker's circumstances were along the lines of Barkley's, i.e. they both should've come out after his junior season. Had nothing to do with who sucked or who didn't suck so beating a contentious dead horse for the sake of being whatever, doesn't fly. For all his 'sucking' Barkely (after breaking a boatload of school passing records) headed into his senior year as the odds on favorite to win the Heisman while USC was ranked #1. Everything in his senior year went up in smoke as USC ended up losing 5 games while Anthony Barr (UCLA) laid out Barkley for the year. Myself, I only saw Barkley once in person. It was the 2nd game of the season (Trojan's were #1) against Syracuse in the Meadowlands. Game was remembered for a stoppage (nasty lighting storm) and Barkley 'lighting' up the Orange by throwing 6 TD passes (to a great Woods/Lee receiving crew). While Barkley had 'lay-it-up touch' he was never stout enough nor had a "deep out" NFL arm.
74, my understanding was that Locker's junior year was the better one. And his last game as a senior against Nebraska (6 for 17) was anything but 1st round material. 2009 12 230 394 58.4 2800 7.1 6.9 21 11 130.1 2010 12 184 332 55.4 2265 6.8 6.6 17 9 124.2
He was a two year starter and declared after his junior year. His sophomore season was actually better than his junior season. The main concern was his ability to transition to pro style, he was a system QB.
Dude! My post was not about Locker. It was about Ponder. I even said his name twice. CHRISTIAN PONDER FSU QB 2008-2010
Ponder had a high ceiling coming out but his frame and arm strength were always a question mark. He was dubbed a QB with good instincts, decent mobility, good footwork and a high football iq. He just wasn't built for the pounding in the Pros. If you look back at that draft class (imo the best I have ever seen) besides Cam all the other QBs were mid round picks at best 2nd rounders. So in a stacked draft 4 QBs went in the top 15 and only 1 is a franchise QB. This is why there are only really 14-15 true franchise QBs in the league, it's the hardest position to get right no matter how you break it down.
QB's really are the hardest position to project coming out of college. can't believe Locker is already out of the league. Inaccuracy at the college level definitely seems a major flag, maybe even the biggest flag. guys don't tend to become more accurate at the pro level. I'm gun shy now if i see anything related to inaccuracy, character/attitude/leadership concerns, lack of intelligence, long wind up, or small hands. Just from a pattern perspective, can't remember too many prospects at QB overcoming any of those red flags in the NFL.
http://www.ganggreennation.com/2016...ch-the-quarterback-of-the-future-for-the-jets pretty good breakdown of Lynch, with some film clips. i think the Flacco comparison is not too far off. He'll need some time and experience before you can play him. so logically, he'd probably be more of a high second rounder, but if you think he'll become a legit starter in this league, you take him in the first.
Locker just couldn't stay healthy and I think that was his major issue at the NFL level. I honestly thought he was coming along in the NFL. Accuracy in my opinion is the hardest thing to really evaluate at the collegiate level. You have to take into consideration the system being used, tendencies and everything else. Can't look at the completion % and determine if a player is inaccurate or not. I think a QB can be taught to fix their accurate inconsistencies, but they will need to sit on the bench. Have to improve footwork, just like Rodgers did while he was on the bench. QBs need gurus to fix their release and delivery. you need the right methods, the right coaches.
a high completion % doesn't necessarily mean accurate. need to determine whether it's a dink and dunk high % system, what the YPA is, competition levels, etc... however, a low completion % is definitely a red flag. again, it's a little more forgiving if the system is multi-read pro style, the YPA is high, and the competition is among most difficult in college. but if it's flat out low, it's generally a bad thing. can't count on coaching to fix fundamental problems......certainly not with a high draft choice. interesting question which i don't know the answer..... what collegiate QB's in the past 25 years have thrown under 60% in college, but went on to be productive pros?
Carson Palmer 3 out of 5 years was completing less then 60% of his passes. Russell Wilson 3 out of 4 years. Michael Vick, Matthew Stafford, Jay Cutler all career completion percentages below 60. So a player can have success at the next level despite a low completion %. I bet you Palmer wanted to throw the ball deep every chance he got, same with Stafford and Wilson. You are correct that coaches can't waste their time fixing fundamental problems, if a QB wants to truly be great they will take time out during the off-season to work and perfect their craft.
did any of them throw for under 60% in their final year of college? btw Vick sucks...should strike him from that list. EDIT here is a good site.. https://www.fantasyindex.com/2014/03/30/factoid/college-qbs-completion-percentage-yards-per-attempt Looks like Matt Ryan had 59.3% and Cutler at 59.1%
