What you should have said that we could have stayed put and selected Clay Matthews. Kind of a weak draft overall but if we used # 5 to take Andre Smith or Brian Orakpo we would have come out of the trade clear winners. What really hurts is that the second rounder we coughed up could have been used to take Leshon McCoy, Phil Loadholt, Sebastian Vollmer, or William Beatty.
I respect your opinion, and we often agree. For the most part, I agree with this post too, but do differ a little. I agree regarding a RB at #20. If Elliott is head and shoulders above the other players available at #20, is the clearcut BPA, and Mac can't find a trading partner to trade down, then I'd rather he take Elliott rather than reach for a player at another position. I don't want to put words in your mouth, but think I know how you think well enough to know that you wouldn't want Mac to reach for a player at #20. I also don't think you can apply BPA to just one or two positions. Of course need must be taken into consideration. If two players are rated about equally, then one takes the player at a position of need over the player who plays a position that is a strength on your team. IF Mac sticks to his BPA mantra, we could very well wind up with a player at a position other than OLB or OL. I hope we don't, but I'd rather that than reach for a player at OLB or OL. My one exception is DL. I think I may freak if he takes another DL with our first pick. I don't care if that player is a sure-fire HOFer (which won't happen at pick #20) or if we do wind up trading Mo before the draft, I don't want another DL even taken this year, much less one taken in the first round. The jury is still out on Mac, but I feel pretty confident about his choices in this draft. I think he did a good job last season using the Jets old Scouting Dept. He now has his hand-picked scouts and people in place. I totally agree that upgrading the right side of the OL should be a priority this off season. I understand your concerns with taking lower round OL, but here is where we vary a little. For one thing, I don't understand how a lower round draft pick can be a colossal bust. Lower round draft picks often don't work out. They fell to lower rounds for a reason. As I think we both know, teams often take a player who excels in one style of play and assume that he can be equally effective in a different or opposite style of play (read and react defensive style vs. aggressive, attacking style and/or zone blocking vs. man-to-man power blocking scheme). For another, if Mac is true to his word, I expect him to take some OL in the middle and lower rounds, but to not take OL in the higher rounds very often. That is his stated philosophy. I know that very good, if not great OLs can be built in that way. It's all about finding the right players and then having the right system and right coaches to teach and develop those players. Hopefully, we have the right scouts and GM making the decisions and the right system and CS to develop the players we pick. We definitely need to upgrade the right side of the line. Of course, the exception to that is the LT position. They almost always have to come from the first 3 rounds, if not first 2 rounds, or even first round alone. I agree that OLB should be the other big priority this off season, and hopefully, there will be an OLB who Mac considers to be the BPA will be there at #20, be it Smith, Spence or Floyd. Question...would you take Smith, who is risky due to the major knee injury, or Spence due to the drug concerns?
Thanks for your response. I hope you're right, as it would be grade to get both a RG and RT prospect from the draft, and it would also be great to get an OLB and and ILB or 2-3 of the 4 positions. If there's not a player the Jets really covet at #20 and he thinks the draft is as deep as you, I hope that Mac can find a trading partner and trade back. Getting an additional pick or picks would help. What do you think of Le'Raven Clark as a LT prospect? I haven't seen him play or any footage on him, but really like what I've read about him. If what I've read is accurate, I think there's a chance he could develop into our future LT and replace Brick in 2017. I hear what you're saying about not just assuming that all drafts will be alike, and that one needs to specifically look at each draft. I may be mistaken, but I think the posts I've seen where posters are speaking about taking a RB in the 3rd round or later are looking at a RB there as a 3rd down back and PR or perhaps as part of a RB by committee approach, not as the starting RB or carrying the load.
That is the only trade up that I know of that worked that way. We have 23 FAs, most of whom won't be re-signed. We have glaring holes at OLB, RG, RT, TE, RB, PR and maybe ILB. We need eventual replacements for both Brick and Mangold and to improve the overall depth of the OL. We simply cannot afford to trade up this year. It's not complicated. There's no reason to have or keep an open mind on the subject this season. It wouldn't matter if we were able to steal the player, we need every pick we have. The only exception I can see is if it becomes clear to Mac that we will be unable to re-sign Mo, and he trades Mo for a 1st round pick and maybe a trade up in round 2 or round 3. Trading up to stick it to another team is the worst possible reason for trading up. It's sad that you didn't learn anything from all of Tanny's trading up and how it hurt the team. It's why we still have holes and little in the way of quality depth. It is not something that should be considered very often, and imo there are only a small handful of reason why one should ever trade up in the 1st round. When one does, it should be followed up by trading down in a subsequent draft or two to recoup the draft picks.
Unless you're leaving something unsaid, that sound like you're drafting for need, and that results in reaches. Not a good draft philosophy imo.
Very good reply. I actually revised my stand on a subsequent post under a different thread and is pretty much in line with what you said. I think there is a hi likelihood that BPA matches one of our needs at 20, and our needs for the longer term go beyond OLB or OL, but totally concur Mac will not reach for need. I have a suspicion that a strong candidate might be an ILB for a possible eventual replacement of Harris. After some more soul searching, I would not put a pass at a RB or CB, WR or even Safety if the OLB and or OL left on the board is not worthy of the pick. I venture to say, don't be surprised if even a DE that is better suited for a transition to OLB on the 3-4 is in the running. I feel less sure that any of the QBs would be worthy of the 20 pick. I find solace in knowing than if not in the draft, free agency might be able to plug a couple of holes for us. As for your question, I would stay far away from Spence, substance abuse is a major crap shoot, but if the medical staff says yeh, I would consider Smith. Interesting off season activity for us this year, changes are in the wind.
Thanks. Again, we are in agreement. I'd rather the pick at #20 be an OLB, OT, or ILB (in that order), but if the BPA is a RB, WR, CB or S, I can live with that. Even though I like Wentz, like you, I'm not sure if he's worth of the 20 pick, and if he is, it's likely he won't be there. I hate it, but I agree regarding Spence. Of course, if he didn't have the drug concerns, he'd never be available at #20 anyway. Smith makes me really nervous, but if he's there at #20, I think we almost have to take him, because he'll surely be the BPA at that point.
Treadwell announced that he won't run the 40 at the combine. I'm sure scouts will love hearing that from the top WR prospect.
Man I would love to grab Zeke. The kid is a beast! Got a funny feeling the Giants might take him at 10 though... If that happens I think trading back and grabbing a either Henry or a falling OLB could be a decent move if it's there for Mac.
I'll pass on Henry all together and go for Alex Collins in the 3rd round. He plays just like Chris Ivory.
I agree. I don't even see Henry projected as a first rounder in most if not all mock drafts. His first few steps to the hole are waaay too slow for the NFL. He is built as a tank of a human being so it's going to be interesting to see if he can adjust. He's definitely the type of runner who needs to line up only 5 to 6 yards off the line of scrimmage whereas you see the big time runners, namely AP 7-8 yards deep.
I'm a huge fan of Alex Collins. He does have a similar game to Ivory, that's a good comparison. The only unknown with Collins is if he can catch the football. However, I seriously doubt he will be a 3rd rounder. There is talk he might be considered at end of the 1st/2nd rounder. Henry is getting underrated because of his former Bama backs that haven't panned out and that's unfair. This kid is a 3 down back that can be an absolute horse for an offence.
Henry has 17 career catches and no fluidity in his hips at all. Can he grow into it? Maybe, but I highly doubt it. He's too big and lumbering to make people miss in the open field. I wouldn't be surprised if he ranks near the bottom of runningbacks at the combine in the 20 yard time and cone shuttle drills.
I don't see him as a 3 down back. Pass protection? Unknown, ability to catch the football? Who knows. Collins has better hands IMO than both Henry and our very own Chris Ivory. I guess he could be a 2nd round pick for us? I'm only taking 1 RB in the first and that's Zeke.
