I'm not a big Hillary guy by any means but I gotta admit she was the only one who looked "presidential" last night. I was excited to see how Webb would do because I like him and I think he would make a good President but damn he needed to stand out and he did not. although he was getting screwed by CNN too. Chafee probably won't last too long. It was awkward with O'Malley and Clinton debating because O'Malley drinks Clinton kool-aid more than anyone. So it was kinda like he was looking for reasons to disagree with her but was basically kinda phony. Bernie Sanders - - yikes. Even as a Dem myself I am quite disappointed that he is currently second in the polls. He's the Donald Trump type of the Democratic party right now. I think Sanders sucks. Biden needs to throw his hat in the ring, we need a capable alternative to Hillary IMO
He's a damn good candidate. He has serious Foreign Policy chops that were on display last night as he stood out far from the others in that regard. Sadly he doesn't raise money enough to buy the presidency like other candidates on both sides of the aisle. Also sad that some of the sensationalism we see from the Republican party is on display in the Democratic party too as he will be given shit for his answers on affirmative action and the black lives matter stuff. He had the opportunity to just destroy, possibly end Bernie Sanders last night but took the high road. Here's a guy as a Platoon Leader in Vietnam who shielded his fellow soldier from a grenade blast with his own body (receiving 2 purple hearts and the silver star) being asked if a guy like Sanders who filed as a conscientious objector should be President. That's an easy 2-point layup if he wanted it to be and other a-hole candidates would've easily taken that shot but he took the high road and said that's up to the voters and instead of bashing Sanders he touted his own acumen outside of just being a war hero. I really appreciated that. It was a refreshing change from the Republicans who sling whatever mud or shit they can find on other candidates. Also the last thing we really need as a country in 2015 is more candidates beating each other up about what they did in Vietnam. That's so 70s and 80s. Its 2015 and we got real issues.
Webb's a good candidate. He would be running as a moderate Republican if that was possible in 2015 but it's not. He left the GOP when he realized that it was completely focused on the top 2%. Even if you don't believe the Democrat's policies and platform are particularly valid it's not hard to choose them as the lesser of two evils in that situation. The reason he can't win the nomination is that the Democratic Party has veered substantially to the left in response to the 2% problem. He made the jump to the Democrats in 2006 but then they steered out from under him and further polarized the political spectrum. Sanders is running as a Democrat instead of an independent because the Democrats moved left and swallowed his natural constituency in the process. It's a total mess and one that we probably won't get out of until one of the two parties collapses or we wind up in a national economic disaster of unforseen proportions.
The real candidates are Clinton, O'Malley (VP bid in the offing) and Webb. Chafee and Sanders are just there to fill out the ideological spectrum for the Democrats. Chafee was probably the second most liberal candidate on the stage last night. The problem we have right now is that the Democrats successfully snuffed the Green Party by moving left and the Working Families Party never got off the ground. The center of the political spectrum is wide open and probably the only candidate that can grab it is Clinton and she's got worms.
this whole debate was horrible to watch...especially that fucking idiot Sanders. Guy is a walking laugh line
am I the only one that gets annoyed every time hillary feels the need to talk about how the country needs a woman president? As if that should have anything to do with it.
she only pulled that card twice last night if I am correct and not until late in the debate. One was an answer to a direct question about how she is "different." but yes overall I agree if she continues pulling that card out it will get annoying. Last night though I'll say only half annoying
53% of the voters are women. She pulls undecided moderate Republican women voters every time she uses the line. RINO had a big price to it and it's a price the GOP is going to be feeling in national elections for years to come. Soccer Moms who wouldn't have touched her with a ten foot pole in 2000 are going to vote for her in droves in 2016.
Bernie kind of has a long time script that he rarely goes away from. And it's repetitive about the billionaires and the 1 %. I thought last night it was overkill. He looked nervous and stumbled a little but when a question that he knew how to answer was offered to him he did pretty well. All of them including Hillary sometimes mumbled and were not always at the top of their game as speakers. I don't agree with the pundits who say she won the debate. She was ok. As for Webb he was constantly interrupting even though he was being ignored and most of the questions went to Hillary and Bernie. He did take the high road about the CO question and Bernie. And Bernie answered it pretty well, too. Also Webb saying that China was the top political problem in the world wasn't imo a good answer.
I can tell you that my wife frequently responds with "oh shut the fuck up hillary" when she does that shit, and my wife is democrat.
makes me ill how far right (and out of touch) Republicans have gone, and how far left Democrats are now going. I'm an Independent, who leans Moderate, and strongly feels the 2 parties (as well as lobbies who support them) are the biggest problem in government. so for me, the current trends couldn't be any worse. my only hope is a Moderate stepping up in the Democratic primary process. it's a long shot. still learning about Webb, but i like what i heard from him in the debate. wish they gave him more time.
Webb is too far out on the right for the Democrats (meaning he sits right in the middle at this point). His only chance is a Clinton collapse and Biden jumping in to a poor reception. He's got a shot at being Clinton's VP but I'm not sure he's up for that. We'll see.
And vice-versa . ; ) Brad, as for Anderson Cooper himself, I didn't see him trying to stir the pot among the candidates so much as him trying to keep them on point when they attempted to go the "talking points" route, e.g. Hillary Clinton on the political expediency question and Bernie Sanders on when he'd authorize military force. I (admittedly cynically) think that this (like politics in general) is a rigged game, and in this case the strings being pulled by the DNC Chair (and Hillary-ite) Debbie Wasserman-Schultz who pretty much rewrote the 'debate rules' for the purpose of greasing the coronation skids. SIX debates this time around. . Back in 2008? TWENTY SIX. 2016 election year - first Democrat debate: October, 2015 2008 election year - first Democrat debsate: April, 2007 But here's where it got ugly this time around and why this reeks of "rigged" :the DNC threatened anyone who continued to complain about the lack of debates (5 out of the 6 candidates btw-lol) or who were caught participating in a rogue debate to being locked out of all party debates. Hardly "of the people" type stuff. Jim Webb, hellava songwriter. As for J. Webb the candidate, he's got to spruce up his carriage - the boy looked washed out physically and he came across as a tad petulent (then again, that's the frustration talking admidst the 'rigging'). But that's not going to matter because eventually his lack of do-re-mi is unfortunately going to bury him. Bernie: I was hoping for a better showing from the ol' firebrand. Regrettably he came off as too one-trick-pony and 'macro' in his comments. His shining moment however was his trenchent comment "Congress doesn't regulate Wall St., Wall St. regulates Congress!" Good stuff lad-lol! The cringe-worthy moment was Lincoln Chaffee handling the Glass-Steagall question like a radioactive hot potato. And while the guy's "my dad just died" excuse was uncomfortable to watch, when Anderson Cooper pressed him on it by asking: "are you saying that you didn't know what you were voting for?" I couldn't help but think of the striking contrast.........check that............the dead-on similarity between that and the former buxom Speaker of the House's now infamous "we have to pass the bill so that you can find out what is in it" comment. Summary: this isn't so much a debate as it is an interview for 'positions' once Hillary's stationary again reads 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue (read: get in line and 'play nice' ..... unlike those 'other' debaters). Lastly, at what venue was last night's event held? ...... think about that one for a minute fellow 99%'ers. ......like a.....really cryptic..... *swoon* A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep. - Saul Bellow .
It is a shame that with the GOP so far over to the right that any reasonable person has no choice but to accept the Democrats' candidate. I don't like that, either, but there it is. Back in 08 I did not like the Clinton campaign, but in hindsight I think she would have been a better president than Obama. I think she would have been an improvement in two areas - foreign policy and in passing legislation helping the economy. Right now I am not happy with her for going left on the Pacific trade treaty. But as Brad points out the dynamic of the Democratic Party's base is solidly anti-that treaty. Clinton is lucky that Sanders is not pushing a pacifistic foreign policy line since she could be pressured by that, but so far she is getting away with sounding more vigorous on foreign policy than Obama. On the whole I am far from a Hillary fan, but I am optimistic she will be closest to your moderate position than she seems now and also more than any one else with any real shot to win. Yes she will probably push for more regulation of Wall Street. But not as much as Sanders is calling for, and it says here more regulation, sensible regulation, of Wall Street IS a moderate position. Those guys are still very scary. But I don't see Clinton pushing for big tax increases on upper middle class voters. Probably take away the hedge fund carried interest break, some effort to reform corporate taxes if the GOP can be brought into some reasonable discussion of that. As a white man I don't see much reason to vote for Clinton, but when you consider the alternatives...
I'd love to see independents flood the Democratic primaries in the states that allow that and make Webb a viable candidate deep into the nomination process. I have the feeling a lot of them will be flooding the Republican primaries to vote against Trump instead. The way politics works in any western democracy except the USA is that the two mainstream parties move continuously to the right as their voter bases age. This makes room on the left for new parties and new ideas and the dance just goes on through the generations. The way it works in the USA is that the two main parties have become so entrenched that they can't be dislodged and they oscillate back and forth from the center of the political spectrum as new leaders emerge to drag them by the ear back towards the mainstream. Right now we're as far apart as the parties have been since 1931 or so and neither party has claim to the mainstream, unlike 1931 when almost everybody was hurting in a big way. Somebody has to move to the center or we're going to make 1935 look like a picnic before we're done.
