No one is saying it started a dynasty--I HATED Parcells early drafts. The names Steve Rosga and Tim Scharf and Terry Day and Dustin Johnson and Chris Brazzell and Marc Megna and JJ Syvrud and Blake Spence and Casey Dailey roll off my lips like my kids names--that he kept trading down and down and down to gather more crap in rounds 5-6-7 was the WORST. But he had a GREAT draft in 2000--Ellis and Abe were great picks and but for injuries--Pennington becomes possibly the Jets GOAT and while I didn't love Becht, he was serviceable and played in the league a long time. And Coles was my favorite steal of a pick of all time. Groh had nothing to do with that. Kill Parcells for his crappy decisions, but at least give him his due. _
I am only go by what Bill Parcells himself said(and what Groh said). either way BP did a mediocre job as a GM type for us. he inherited a lot of talent AND the #1 pick in each round his first draft. go look at the 1997-1999 drafts, let me know what you find.
whether he gets the credit or not how is it a great draft when they gave up Key and Belichick(won 5 SBs btw them) and we got one longterm starter? Injuries count, I love Chad. Might be my favorite player of all time and a MUCH better person than a player but he couldn't stay healthy. when healthy we won w/ him but could not stay healthy. Coles was a great pick. Becht was a disappointment to most, Parcells had just gotten rid of a blocking TE that couldn't catch then used a 1st rd pick on another one a year later. Abe was a great pass rusher but had injury and off field issues and was quickly gone.
Key wanted out, was a lockerroom disease and a malcontent and looking at Bellichick with 20-20 hindsight and relating it to the 2000 draft is silly. Parcells cost us Belichick--we all acknowledge it--but was it totally Parcell's fault? Belli left because (IMHO) he had already cut a deal with Kraft (who loved him) and it wasn't totally Parcell's fault--he was gone at that point. Once he was gone--he did the best he could and got the pick for him. He didn't trade Belli for a pick--he recouped as much as he could. He did the best he could with a bad situation. Considering how many 1st round picks completely bust out of the league--the fact that he got guys 4 guys (including Coles) that played at a very high level, and a fifth at an adequate level--whether Jets fans loved or hated him--some for years--is a testament to how great that draft was. Did it bring up championships? Did it change the franchise? Nope. But it was a great draft considering what a crap shoot drafts are. Looking at injuries to judge drafts is so much 20-20 hindsight--that's not my style. And losing Key--as much as I liked the player--was almost a necessity--he was a douche. Hell, a few years later after winning a SB, his coach sat him down for the last 6 games of the season and traded him for nothing. I loved the player but he was a jackass. -
Key was a locker room leader, he was not a disease. he wanted more money, he didn't want to leave. BB played a role too but his fear of BP led to him looking elsewhere. BP changed the franchise as a coach, he changed the culture and until very recently we had very good teams since he came on in 1997. yes he was a jackass but a very productive player and a guy that hated to lose. Bryan Cox was a jackass too but also a respected guy in the LR and a fierce competitor like Key. w/ that said the trade worked out. we had some successful years w/o him and he got his ring but when you look at giving up a HOF coach, a pro bowl/AP caliber WR for 3 of the 4 1st rounders and only one became a longtime starter. I'm not sure it is as good as we all like to think it was. On the surface it is but giving up BB and seeing what he became in NE takes some luster off the draft.
Wow. We have markedly different views on what type of leader Key was. He was a me-first guy and that money grab was his way of getting himself out. He wanted money--and didn't care where it came from. The Jets didn't blink and he was gone. I loved Key the player but he was the opposite of a leader--always more about himself than the team. _
Quoted for truth. I laid all of the evidence out in black and white yet you still cling to your ridiculous bias against Parcells.
Key wanted money, so does/did Revis but Revis is beloved. Key was a fierce competitor, I am sure that rubbed some people the wrong way w/ his attitude but he was well liked/respected by most on those teams. Most players want money and will play anywhere to get it, for him he went to a better team, got paid and got a SB ring so it worked out.
I think this is true about his tenure with the Jets. Later in his career he matured and became more of a leader, team player. I remember a few years after he left the Jets - his friend Eric Moulds was thinking about holding out/leaving Buffalo. Keyshawn advised him to re-sign telling him that the grass isn't greener and that he regretted his actions in NY both financially and in the locker room. Moulds took the advice and re-signed and matured himself. Either way it's good they traded him as Groh was such an asshole. Even good soldiers like Testaverde complained. Keyshawn would've exploded. Keyshawn was quite the odd fellow, hard to narrow down personality wise.. On one hand he could be all about himself for more reasons than just money (we all know those instances) but on the other hand, Keyshawn always wanted to win. He busted his ass as a blocker which isn't typical of a primadonna receiver and he was loyal to those he built relationships with. The Keyshawn/Chrebet combo will always be my favorite receiving combination. What an interesting dynamic that was. The guys were almost completely opposite individuals and might have despised one another but fuck they were a perfect fit together on the football field.
Keyshawn was not well liked and respected by his teammates in NY Revis wants to be paid but he is a quiet individual who has never had an issue with his coaches or sought to divide his teammates. They are very different
Coles, Fabini, Fergeson, and Young were better than any four players Rex Ryan got outside of round one.
there's no bias at all, I love what BP did for our franchise as a COACH. that list was mostly a joke, guys here a year or 2, many decent players, only a few guys better than decent and very few who spent a long time here. -Inherited talented team when he came here- Key, Chrebet, Brady, O'Donnell, Jumbo, O'Dwyer, Murrell, Anderson, Green, Mo, Marvin, Glenn, Mickens, Coleman, Graham, Baxter, Douglas, etc... -Inherited #1 overall pick and #1 pick in each rd of '97 draft. w/ trade down had 11 picks. 2 never made it in NFL, 3 lasted 1 year, 2 last 3 years. the best player in that draft was a mediocre player for us and then thrived elsewhere. -In 1998 had 12 picks, 2 didn't make it in NFL, 3 lasted a year in the league, one 2 years, our top pick last just 4 years in the league. only one player played double digits in the NFL- the lone good pick that was Jason Fabini. -In 1999 had 8 picks. selected 2 OL starters but we had to give one up in expansion draft a year after he left b/c he left us in cap hell. Only one player lasted more than 5 years in NFL of the 8 picks(Randy Thomas). -refused to commit to Peyton Manning -ran BB(knowingly or unknowingly) off to NE -lefty us w/ poor cap which forced us to lose Aaron Glenn, Marcus Coleman and Ryan Young following 2001 season other than this he was a fantastic GM
100%. I remember being envious all those years later when he went to the Cowboys and became a TRUE leader. He was a douche as a Jet and the opposite of a leader. _
Or that Groh had anything to do with that 2000 draft. There are plenty of things to get on Parcells for but not giving him 100% of the credit for that draft is unecessary revisionist history to falsely bolster that bias. _
http://espn.go.com/premium/nfl/columns/cannizzaro_mark/488859.html same article but going back to the earlier discussion:
Sure Rex Ryan had no say in his drafts. It is just a coincidence that every single first rounder was used for Rex's defense. Coples over Dave DeCastro has Rex written all over it.
