I believe there's some truth to that. Buddy, however, really knew how to build a D, and had an eye for D talent. I think he played a bigger role in the late 60's team with Weeb than his title signified. I think Buddy was Special Teams coach or something like that.
Are we about to go over old ground again? That's revisionist history. Ken did hold onto the ball far too long but the OL was dreadful - shall we compare to the 2009 OL again?
OL was NOT dreadful, that is revisionist history based on fans not knowing what they were looking at. OL was actually good, QB held the ball forever.
Among my friends and I back in the day, I don't think anyone ever kidded themselves into thinking that Ken was great, or that he even could be great. He was pretty good, and did give us some exciting moments at times, though. Can't take that away from him. I think it was his agent who said, "For 10 games, Ken was the best quarterback in football."
To start 1986 he was great but he injured his shoulder and never really recovered. I still like him, was one of my favorites as a kid I just think Jet fans overrate him and don't realize how they would skewer him if he had the same career in the internet/social media age.
When people bring up Marino and why the Jets didn't take him over O'Brien. I say why not how many rings does Marino have?
Yep. I didn't mean to imply that I thought he was "great." I think if he had learned not to hold onto the ball for so long, he could have been. He had all the rest of the ability except mobility. He not only hurt his own career (he eventually became gun-shy, and would duck at the first sign of pressure, due to all the hits he took), but he's probably responsible for shortening Toon's career as well. I remember some of the concussive hits that Toon took were because O'Brien threw the ball where Toon was going to take a big hit. Getting rid of the ball sooner and better ball placement probably would have extended both of their careers and helped the Jets win more games.
Leon Hess was a doddering, sentimental moron. He was known as a shark in business, but he was an absolute pussy when it came to the Jets. I had zero respect for him and despised him. It's awful to say or think, but I was glad when he died. I despised him that much.
What you're saying about social media is very true. It completely changes all the rules. It's is a new era. Think about how some of our sports icons like Mickey Mantle might be treated today. As for Kenny O being overrated, that might be true, but as a matter of perspective, I went to a Halloween party back in the day wearing a Number 7 Jet's shirt (not really a jersey). I had all kinds of stuffing coming out of my shirt, and my feet in boxes to symbolize Ken's feet in concrete. Ken had a great arm, and could be really accurate - but - he was slow, he did hold the ball too long, and he did get pounded. The thing about the 86 Jets is that in addition to Ken getting hurt, other members of the team started breaking down as well. It started out as an incredibly awesome season, though. After a long drought, it was a pretty exciting time to be a Jets fan, and for me at least, it was a great time to be a season ticket holder.
it wasn't a long drought when Ken took over, Ken took over a team that was young and had recently been in a championship game. Many players on that '86 team got hurt, it was a major factor why we ended on 5 game losing streak. '86 started great especially after an 11 win 1985 and it looked like we were going to be an elite AFC team for many years then it all fell apart.
That's true. You're right. 86 was sort of a peak, but it really wasn't that long of a drought. Good point.
Yes, except that somehow NE beat us in '85 (yet another painfull play-off loss ...and at home - a rarity) and went to the Super Bowl, where they were trounced by the Bears.
O'Brien was certainly under appreciated as a Jet. He was at least as good as Chad, and while Vinny had a great '98 season, I think O'Brien's overall Jet career was better. His talent was largely pounded out of him by too many sacks (think David Carr) early inn his career. He might've benefited if he went to another team around '89 or '90
O'Brien was underappreciated at the time and is overappreciated now. He was not better than Chad or Vinny, I don't even think he was better than Sanchez. He had a great '85 and a great start to '86 but the man had boatloads of talent around him and never won a single playoff game in a very weak era for AFC football. the sacks were largely his fault unlike w/ David Carr.
I agree. I think it is largely his own fault that his talent was pounded out of him. He admitted that they worked on his getting rid of the ball sooner in practice and that perhaps he was just stubborn (he was, also somewhat stupid). The Jets could have and should have upgraded their OL, but they whiffed badly on the OL picks they made. Still, he could have helped himself by giving up on some plays earlier. Based on his comments, he saw every play as a potential big play. That's a mistake. RBs lose yardage and get hurt trying to do that. QBs get pounded, strip sacked or throw picks doing that. He never learned to give up on a play, throw the ball away, and get 'em on the next down. He hurt himself, Toon and the team with his stubbornness (stupidity really). I liked Kenny O, but he should have corrected that problem.
Yeah, there's some difference of opinion on how the Jet OL deteriorated during O'Brien's time with hte team. Some say at least the FO tried to get good players. but their efforts led to generally poor results. How much blame they should get for the net result, either way it reall harmed O'Brien's career. Since Namath, we had a partial season with Favre, a great 98 with Vinny, and a strong showing by Chad that devolved into injuries and a weak arm. Imo O'Brien made the largest contribution to the team ovearll from the Qb position since Namath, and for that he deserved real credit.
How could O'Brien make the largest contribution since Namath when he never helped the team win a single playoff game? Vinny: 2 playoff apps, 1 playoff win, 1 title game app, best season in Jets history for QB, let to franchise record 12 wins, won div title Chad: 3 PO apps, 2 PO wins, only QB to lead team to title in AFC East in Brady era besides Brady and the Pats, had arguably 2nd greatest single season for Jets QB. Sanchez: 2 PO apps, 4 PO wins, 2 title game apps Ken doesn't compare to those 3.
I loved watching Ken O'Brien light it up. Hated the dolphins and it evolved into pure hate for the Pats. Mariota could be our Ken O'Brien.
