Don't get me wrong. It's a good list. But in terms of franchise Qbs. At most the top eleven. And you could whittle those down. Or add one more who would be Flacco.
My whole point is that there are varying levels of franchise QB's. The qb doesn't have to be elite to be considered a franchise qb. A franchise qb is somebody that your offense is built around. He is your starting qb and the guy you feel you can win with, or win games for you.
In order to be a team that wins year-in and year -out--that is continuously playoff bound and a championship contender--you need a Pro Bowl QB. An average game manager can get you in the playoffs every few years to be summarily bounced in the first round. If Geno becomes even Andy Dalton (I don't think he will), I'm not satisfied getting bounced in the playoffs every year. _
I'm thinking that a franchise Qb is on a more elite status. Not just a good starter. But a Qb who is a star player. When the Jets drafted Mark they wanted him to be their franchise Qb. But he never played even remotely up to that. The Panthers have drafted Cam overall first and tried to build a team around him. But he hasn't played up to that level. Eli won two Super Bowls and Flacco one. I would subtract from you top list rather than add to it.
OK, I'm all for getting one. But the pickings are slim. But I think you can win without one. And put your resources into building an infrastructure. Starting with a good O-line.
I mostly agree with this list. However, I would probably bump Luck to the first group, and Flacco and Cam into that 2nd tier group. Those guys are right on the border of each respective group so I get why you put them where you did. Just one man's humble opinion. The sad thing is that I would take any of those QB's over Geno. Except for Andy Dalton because, as we all know, gingers have no souls. My QB has to have a soul, that's where I draw the line.
Your definition of "winning" and my definition are different. And building the infrastructure at the expense of the QB is backwards thinking. Nothing else matters more than the QB--ESPECIALLY in today's offensive first league. That's why I wanted Teddy or Carr last year or Mariota or Winston this year. After those 4. the pickings get VERY slim into the foreseeable future. _
You don't know if any of those 4 are going to be franchise Qbs. Or if some guy further down in the draft is going to be great. Like Wilson was 3 years ago. And if you want to give your Qb a chance to be successful you start first with the O-line before anything. Carr's brother got killed because of that.
I don't know anything other than we haven't had a true franchise guy in decades and we haven't been to a SB in decades. Coincidence? I think not. I don't know whether any of those 4 guys will be franchise guys but IMHO they ALL will be and we passed on 2 for a really bad reason--to prop up a flawed player--and we may pass on another one. And stop with the Russell Wilson BS and the fantasy that you'll fine some "guy" further down in the draft that is going to be "great". It's a bullshit red herring. That's like saying let's throw shit at the wall and see what sticks. One Russell Wilson. One Tom Brady. Hundreds of failed QBs over the decades. Hope is not a plan. _
I really wish people would stop with this Russell Wilson stuff. Yes, he was a 3rd round pick. Yes, he's turned out to be a really good QB for the Seahawks. Yes, once every blue moon you can get lucky and strike gold with late round QB's. He's the exception for late round QB's though, not the rule. There's a reason 1st round QB's get graded as they do, because they have a higher chance of working out than the later round prospects. So for those waiting on the next Brady/Wilson/Romo to fall into our laps, be prepared to wait for a very, very long time.
Of couse many failed 1st round Qbs including overall number 1s. I don't think the reason the Jets haven't been to a Super Bowl in over 50 years is tied to the Qb position. I just don't see any one of these guys being a slam dunk. And don't want to go through any more losing seasons developing a Qb who might not work out. But if Mariota falls to 6 I'd draft him. I couldn't root for a scumbag like Winston.
you should've just said that from the start. Instead of being wrong about (not) needing QBs to win, Geno Smith, the importance of QBs, first round QBs, etc, all the dumb wrong arguments you chose to make because you don't like Winston as a person you could've just said you don't like him as a person and thus have a biased opinion because you don't like him. then you wouldn't have had to grasp onto bad arguments like you did
Read my lips. You need a good Qb to win but not necessarily a franchise Qb. Qb is one position out of 11. If you don't have a good center your Qb is screwed. I'd take Mariota over Winston who I hope the Jets don't draft. If they do take him I still root for the Jets.
It's the only common theme. So 2015 is more important to you than 2016 through 2026. That's fine. I'm not that short-sighted. _
Not if you want to win consistently. And win the big game. It's more important than the other 21 positions combined. _
4 hits 2 Misses: Brian Winters and William Campbell Also, I simply refuse to ever call Geno a miss. I don't care how bad Geno looked last season he was the right pick at the time and there is no way I will ever fault Idzik for taking him where he did. I remember watching the draft and hearing every analyst suggesting that he wouldn't be a bad pick at 13. Idzik played chicken and he won. That was a solid football move that just didn't work out. Also remember the only reason he ever slid to the 3rd was because of his size. He had all the intangibles--go and watch the Gruden QB camp episode on him and how well-spoken and sharp he was. I just hope the days of drafting guys with low Wonderlics to play QB are over
The Jets had Qbs who were good enough to lead a team into the Super Bowl: Ken O'Brien, possibly Vinny and Boomer, Chad, Favre. And Mark went to two AFC title games.
QB is not just one out of 11. "Franchise QB" talk is semantics. that's fantasy football language. But the QB position is far, far more important than any other on the field and to win consistently you need a good one. To win it all in todays NFL you might need a great one. Your center comment could not have been more wrong. In Order of position importance in todays NFL -QB is at the top then there is a sizable, sizable gap where the other positions start and are close together. Center is somewhere north of Punter/Kicker and somewhere south of Guard or TE. They are for the most part, along for the ride. You can have the worst center in the league and be the best team in the league if you have an awesome QB. If you have the worst QB in the league you will struggle to win even if you have the best center (see the NYJ)
