lmao, how naive to think it is just that cut and dry. rex has/had weight in the organization(no pun intended, well a little intended) just this year 2 of the top 3 picks were db's. as far as the stephen hill comment, it was said as a compliment to the scouting dept after 1 of hills few good games. but we don't like to use context around here. hurts arguments. but obviously the problem is not rex though, he has only been here for 6 years and has had the same reoccurring problems for 4 consecutive seasons. definitely not the problem
Well considering the guy that Woody is going to hire to advise him came out and said Rex should have been coach of the year last year and the roster was the issue... But that doesn't fit your version of the story I guess.
Rex had a 6-10 two years ago without Idzik. Was the team coached well. And just a problem of talent. I think the talent was a lot better than the team's record. But I wouldn't be shocked if Woody keeps Rex and fires Idzik.
Just look at all of the teams with Qb problems. Even the highest paid player in the NFL played poorly even though his head coach is considered an offensive guru. And many Qbs recently drafted have been bad, not just Geno. Plus guys like RG 3 have regressed after good starts. To me Geno isn't hopeless: it's not like there isn't talent there.
He's been here 6 years and had two AFC Championship seasons. And then the talent eroded. First the OL. Then the WRs. And now, finally, the secondary. If you're going to say Ryan's responsible for that, please do more than repeat that he's been here for six years and tell me why, when it's the GM's responsibility to stock the team, Rex Ryan should be blamed for the lack of talent. No, wait. Don't. Because you're just going to say the same thing over again "he was here for six years..." Blame Rex Ryan for not developing an offense. Blame him for keeping his role as DC when the team clearly needed a game manager. But you surely can't blame him for Stephen Hill, Vlad Ducasse, Brian Winters, the WR class of 2014, losing Cromartie and not restocking his position with talent. Those are whiffs and gaffs of the GM mostly on the OFFENSIVE side of the LoS. Surely Ryan cannot be held responsible for those mistakes.
In 2012? That was the worst roster of talent we had since.... Geez... I honestly don't remember a worse roster. I guess maybe the worse since the mid 70's.
Part of the job of a head coach and his assembled staff is to develop the players given to him by the GM. Say what you want, but besides the defensive line, what players have developed into good players under Rex? However, your argument still has merit in that we don't know that these players were any good to begin with. Especially guys like Hill and Ducasse. Its frustrating though to see other teams take raw talents like those players and mold them into good players. I'm more dissapointed in Rex's failure to develop his own defensive players at this point. As I said, outside of the defensive line, who else has reached their potential? Wilson? No. Coples? No. Millner? We'll see, not looking great so far. Pryor? Eh, he's played out of position though so I'll wait. The other thing to consider is this. Although Rex doesn't have final say in personnel decisions (Im assuming), he still has a say in players drafted and free agents signed. I don't think there is any doubt there. So he is somewhat to blame for the erosion of talent over his six years here. For whatever reason, Tannenbaum drafted well and signed good free agents while Mangini was here. They built a very solid foundation by the time Rex arrived. What changed? Not the scouting department. Not the owner. Not the GM. It was Rex. Rex wanted his guys in here and the GM gave him what he wanted. So although you can't blame only Rex for the erosion of talent, there is a correlation there.
I don't think Woody wants to pay Rex 3 or 4 mil to do television. So for that reason alone plus with Casserly's approval (he likes Rex) I could see Woody holding onto Rex and firing Idzik or at least keeping Idzik in another capacity so he doesn't have to eat his contract, too. But if Woody does keep Rex no additional year. Rex will be a lame duck who can be easily fired without financial ramifications.
I really don't see a scenario where Rex stays and Idzik is fired there's zero chance of this.The only way Rex is back is if Woody decides to keep both of them,witch I also doesnt seem logical at this point.Id put my money on both being fired
Well, I must say you have fleshed out an opinion here. I'd like to respond to it. First, "having a say" and "having responsibility" are not the same things. A child can have a say in what he/she wants for dinner. It's up to the parent to get the children to eat their vegetables. You go on to mention your displeasure at Rex Ryan for not developing players. That has some merit because that's actually in the job description for head coach. You mention that we don't know if these guys were any good--Hill and Ducasse--but we DO know they weren't any good. Hill's not on anyone's active roster. Ducasse is, but I don't believe he's a starter. And these were second round picks, whiffs. You then go on to mention Coples and Wilson, as if Wilson is any good. We also know that Wilson is not any good. He's been a pro for five years in the same slot CB spot. And players with 1/5 his time--the rookies that have taken his playing time recently--have shown the improvement Wilson never has. So, maybe you need to come to grips with the fact that Wilson sucks and was another whiff!! I'm not sure why you mentioned Coples because he has played well enough, in my opinion, especially playing out of position. I'm not sure why people had the notion that a guy drafted, what, No. 12 in a draft, is somehow not playing well if he's not the next Reggie White. Coples does ok, thank you. In the end, while you've fleshed out your argument, it's not a compelling one: that Rex Ryan is the reason for bad drafting and personnel decisions of two GMs. Neither GM had been one before. Neither GM had a talent evaluation background. Neither GM seems to know how to manage the salary cap--one guy spent too much on two few and the other spent way too little and passed up talent upgrades for bargains. So, if it's expected that a first-time coach is somehow responsible for overseeing GMs it seems unrealistic on your part and a weak argument against Rex when there are so many good ones: No offense, relies too heavily on the blitz, chose poorly in coordinators, didn't do his job as HC instead focused on the DC job, teams had poor records coming out of bye weeks; his recent teams are undisciplined--made mistakes at the most inopportune times; poor clock/challenge management. Judge Rex Ryan for the stuff he's actually responsible for and don't give a pass to the GMs who have failed in doing their jobs.
I almost didn't see this: So Gholston was a good draft pick? Please, that Tannenbaum got value from the first round is not particularly laudable is it? He also whiffed on Wilson, Stephen Hill, Vlad Ducasse among others. Plus, he traded up to get some of those picks, which kind hastened the erosion of talent. And, really, if Tannenbaum was so great, why was he let go? He was let go because he sucked. He almost always need to trade up to get talent, sometimes when he didn't need to. And when he didn't trade up, his other picks were marginal. I mean seriously, you're trying to re-write history: Tannenbaum sucked. Mangini sucked. If they didn't they'd still be here, no? They are not to be lauded as if NOT busting on a 1st rounder is something special.
I'm not going to pretend to know much about "NFL consultants" so maybe somebody can help me out. I'm seeing that Woody is putting together a "Dream-Team" of consultants, Ron Wolf and Casserly... is there reason to all the hype? Ron Wolf is very very old lol. 77 i believe, hope doesn't have like Alzheimer's or something
Sorry man, I'm just gonna have to disagree with you on this. Not that I don't see your point on some things, I do. I just think under Tannenbaum, Mangini and Rex both had quite a bit of pull in who was brought onto this team. Tannenbaum was an accountant, not a scout or football guy. He had to rely on his coaches and scouting department more. I think when you look at the two regimes, Mangini had a lot more success drafting and developing players. Hence why Rex came into a pretty nice spot and took that team as far as he did. That's not to say Mangini was a great coach and Rex isn't. He was probably a better talent evaluator however. Rex was not the sole reason for the talent erosion, but he played a big part. Tannebaum was rightfully fired for his poor peformance. Idzik should be fired as well for the horrible job he's done so far. When you have seasons like this, there isn't just one person to blame. Everyone deserves blame here, that's all I'm saying. I don't like the argument that Rex wasn't given any talent or that it was entirely the GM's fault for the poor drafts. Rex was given what any defensive minded coach would love, but he just couldn't put it all together.
Did not want to start a new thread on the front office chances but can't help but wonder what Woody's strategy is. The wait is nearly over. Black Monday is just around the corner. Will we hear something about Rex and or John? What is the best move timing wise? Does it make sense to let them go immediately or wait? To me Monday is a crucial indicator of where we are heading and I have some concerns about getting caught in a catch 22 situation Ideally the quicker the better, yet if we are targeting a coach or Coordinator currently in the NFL chances are (one would hope) he is in the playoffs, so its hands off at least for a week or two. Likewise for a new GM one would think. On the other hand if we have to wait for the consultants to evaluate the situation and provide a recommendation it might be weeks before we know if any changes will be made, possibly missing out on some key assets. Seems to me we would want the selection to be timely enough to affect the draft first and foremost. This is much more nerve wrecking than waiting for the draft selections. I feel strongly it is by far the most critical move of all for the Jets, and is a mandatory prerequisite to a solid if not spectacular draft. All eyes on Woody....all else pales by comparison to the future of the Jets.
Whatever is going to happen needs to happen immediately. This way candidates can be contacted and interviews can be scheduled even if the actual interview have to wait
