OP: you make your case under a common denominator assumption, i.e. that each QB worked behind equally strong (or weak) teams. I'd take Archie Manning (35-101-3, 26.3%) over practically all of those bolded on your list.
The thing is, looking at that list of Jets' QB draft picks, it becomes obvious that we have NOT taken many chances on drafting a QB high. How many of these draft picks were 1st rounders? Mark Sanchez, then Chad Pennington before him, and before him, you have to go all the way back to Ken O'Brien in 1983 (unless I am missing someone). So in the last 31 years, we drafted only 3 QBs in the first round, not one of which became a true franchise QB. To put it in perspective, here is a list of current average or better NFL QBs and a few really good historical ones, with where they were picked (r = round, p = pick): peyton manning r1p1 eli manning r1p1 andrew luck r1p1 cam newton r1p1 aaron rodgers r1p24 tom brady r6 drew brees r2p1 joe flacco r1p18 phillip rivers r1p4 russell wilson r3 matt ryan r1p3 ben roethlisb. r1p11 tony romo UFA matt stafford r1p1 jay cutler r1p11 ryan tannehill r1p8 andy dalton r2 alex smith r1p1 joe montana r3 troy aikman r1p1 john elway r1p1 dan marino r1p27 jim kelly r1p14 So while occasionally teams get lucky with a later round pick, you can see that most good QBs go in the first round, just where we haven't been picking that often. If anything, this suggests to me that we should be taking more chances in the 1st round on QBs.
I'm with you. I am highly skittish on both Mariotta and Winston. Would rather build other areas of team into strengths and get a veteran and see how it goes.
Great job on that one... In addition, the three guys that were picked in Rounds 3, Montana, Brees and R. Wilson all would have been picked earlier if they were taller. They had elite talent but weren't thought capable of withstanding the impacts QB's take in the professional game. From this viewpoint, it seems that if there is a QB that grades in the top 5 of the talent pool and you dont already have an elite QB you basically HAVE to take that QB. Which kind of sucks because I dont like Winston. I think he will be a major behavior headache in NYC and will bust.
This thread makes no sense. You include guys drafted by people who have been dead for 20 years. Half these guys were drafted to hold clipboards. If the right guy is there you draft him.
Patriots 1st and 2nd round picks at QB (going back to 1965, the year the Jets got Namath): 1971 - Jim Plunkett #1 overall 1978 - Matt Cavanaugh 2nd 1983 - Tony Eason 1st 1993 - Drew Bledsoe #1 overall 2014 - Jimmy Garappolo 2nd Bills 1st and 2nd round picks at QB (1965 again): 1970 - Dennis Shaw 2nd 1982 - Matt Kofler 2nd 1983 - Jim Kelly 1st 1995 - Todd Collins 2nd 2004 - J.P. Losman 1st 2013 - E.J. Manuel 1st Fins 1st and 2nd round picks at QB (you know the drill): 1966 - Rick Norton 2nd 1967 - Bob Griese 1st 1978 - Guy Benjamin 2nd 1983 - Dan Marino 1st 2007 - John Beck 2nd 2008 - Chad Henne 2nd 2009 - Pat White 2nd 2012 - Ryan Tannehill 1st Jets 1st and 2nd round picks at QB 1965 - Joe Namath #1 overall 1969 - Al Woodall 2nd 1976 - Richard Todd 1st 1983 - Ken O'Brien 1st 1991 - Browning Nagle 2nd 2000 - Chad Pennington 1st 2006 - Kellen Clemens 2nd 2009 - Mark Sanchez 1st 2013 - Geno Smith 2nd Ok, so what's the difference between the Jets and the other teams at QB since 1965? The Jets three good to great QB picks were all driven out of the NFL by injuries, with Joe Namath lasting the longest but the second half of his career turning into a series of crippling injuries that lead to reduced effectiveness. O'Brien was a good QB but he got hit too much and the concussions did him and Chad, well Chad could have been the best of the three of them given the new rules coming into play but the injuries took him down also. It's bad luck. The Pats got great luck when their 1st from 1993 was finally not panning out and a 6th rounder came out of nowhere... BTW, note that a good NFL QB has never been drafted in the 2nd round by one of the 4 franchises.
The only certainty is that the NY Jets have had only "SHIT" success in the QB department over the last 40 years or so. I stress SHIT!! The NY Jets QB draft landscape looks thus (I'll start with Namath...who, by the way, has a losing record in a Jets uniform and is only in the HOF based off of one damn game...sacrilege I know but it is what it is) ........................................................................................................................................................................................................ I suppose it is because I was a kid and grew up with the Jets along with Namath, and so if you would all bear with me, I will take a moment to heavily dispute the opening remark on this thread (above). His induction into the Hall of Fame is NOT based on one Super Bowl Game. Among the many things written about his accomplishments was that NFL coaches of that era were quoted as giving Namath much credit for changing and revolutionizing the style of QB play in the NFL. He is credited with one of the quickest releases even in today's evaluations. His leading of the Jets to the SuperBowl and then the victory was historical in its own right, but the man did more for the position than one game. he also led the Jets back to the AFC Championship Game the following season. He was not a one and done athlete. He changed the league, the QB position, and gave the entire NFL a new era in television and publicity because of his play. * He was Rooke of the year in the AFC * First professional Quarterback to pass for 4,000 years in a season (1967). NOTE: The season was 14 games when he played. It was not until 1979 that Dan Fouts became the next player to break the mark in a 16 game season and that was 12 years later in 1979!! AND - the rules in the NFL that year were seriously revised to give the QB and WR's more protection. * 4 time AFC All-Star 1965-67-68-69 *1968 was awarded the Hickock Belt for the outstanding professional athlete of the year. *1972 Pro Bowl
Yes, the reason the Namath quote in SB III got the press that it did was because the press all thought it was going to be a blowout for the Colts and as soon as Namath made the statement everybody looked at the game a bit differently. You don't guarantee a win against the best team in football unless you're the best QB in football or damn close to that and Joe Namath met the criteria.
Great posts by everyone!!! Now that we've got a bunch of information about past...fantastic post by Br4dw4y5uks about the division...I throw out another question about this upcoming draft then... Let's say we are able to stay in the top 5...how about top 3... Mariota is off the table...what is the thoughts on Winston? Considering the NY Jets "luck" in drafting QB's do we even remotely attempt to bring in this guy who, clearly, has far deeper rooted issues than how far to throw a football?? To be honest I can't say that I would take him...it's a better than 50/50 chance that the environment alone would take him down. It's fairly clear, as well, that his personal decision making abilities is impaired. I think that if Mariota is off the board...quite likely...we go BPA that ISN'T Jameis Winston. Thoughts on that one??
Not the case...if you read a little deeper you'd notice that due to our success in certain areas we should never draft anyone other than o-line and defense.
Namath also led the league in passing yards for 3 years (including the 4,000 yard season), he often led the lead in yards per attempt, and he was remarkably good at avoiding sacks during an era when offensive lines had to keep their hands clenched in fists to their chests while "blocking." In addition, while Namath played until 1977, the NFL did not pass the Mel Blount rule until 1978 (as well as 2 more rules designed to increase scoring). Before The Mel Blount rule was passed, DBs were allowed to manhandle any receiver before the ball was thrown. Seriously, there's a reason that the single game passing record is held by Norm Van Brocklin. It always bothers me when football fans discredit Joe Namath. This is a great article about how good he actually was: http://www.footballperspective.com/joe-namath-has-become-footballs-most-misunderstood-quarterback/
This is such a sad list it's not even funny. Yet, we need to gamble at the top for a QB. Please. No more "drafting the best player". No more "draft for defense". That's how you end up drafting Vernon Gholston when Joe Flacco is sitting on the board.
No if you read a little deeper you'll see In 2013 we drafted Brian Winters, Oday Oboushi, and William Cambell. Year before that Robert Griffin two years before that Vlad Ducasse. Add in a few other bums and Mangold and D-Brick are the only successful OL picks. Just because Sheldon and Mo worked out so well doesn't mean the picks of Dewayne Robertson and Vernon Gholston (DE/OLB) didn't happen. Those are 2 of the biggest busts we've ever drafted.
appreciate another person joining me in this. Glad you added more. I didn't want to go on and on, but he truly was a great quarterback. he just didn't back in because of one game.
Keep going deeper...sorry I wasn't clear...I'm talking over the last 50 years in this particular instance. Not just the last 10...we've drafted so much top defensive talent over the last 50 years it's insane.... Same with the o-line... Most certainly NOT like our QB drafts.
Sorry guys...it's why I laid the caveat out there. Yes, I understand Namath's "impact" to football in general but you will never confuse Joe Namath with Bob Griese, Dan Fouts, Dan Marino, Joe Montana, Steve Young, Peyton Manning, Tom Brady etc...as far as it comes to passers. That is basically all I was implying. Also, it's why I started the list with Namath....to show the wide GAP between the last time we drafted an actual GOOD QB (Namath) to now. I hope this assuages any feelings I've hurt in tossing Joe Willie under the bus a little.
