Doing what ever it takes is a hard thing to do. If it involves trading up, fine, but you can't expect an NFL franchise to lose on purpose to get that pick. Rex Ryan is coaching for his life, Vick is playing for a starting spot every week, guys like Wilkerson are playing for contracts, etc. You can't expect these guys to let things slide so they can get a top 3 pick. If you are taking about potentially trading up, I agree, but it's hard to do "whatever it takes" on the field.
have you watched him play this year? honestly? that offensive line is the worst in the NFL and he hasn't helped. he's going to command a large contract and i don't think we should give it to him
Of their remaining games, these are the only possible wins I see for the other bottom 3: Jax has home and home with Houston and Tennessee at home Oakland has @ Rams and Buffalo at home TB has Atlanta at home, Cincy at home and @ Carolina Not a lot of wins there. _
I think Jax could definitely split. Oakland I think loses twice. TB can beat Atlanta but I dont like their chances in the other 2.
Yeah, I've seen a good amount of 49er games this year. The 49ers offensive line is not the worst in the NFL - our line you could argue is worse. He struggled early in the season but picked up his play. He also had a concussion. He's a former all-pro - he's certainly an upgrade over any G we have now. Depends how FA goes, but at least it's worth talking to him.
valid point, here are the remaining schedule of all teams with 3 or fewer wins and my personal projection for each team. Raiders 0-8 Jcksonville 1-8 Jets 1-8 Titans 2-6 Rams 3-5 Buc's 1-7 Falcons 2-6 Panthers 3-5 Bears 3-5 Redskins 3-6 Giants 3-4 (they may or may not be on the list after tonights game) So each team's remaining schedule and my personal predictions Raiders- one semi winnable game, they might pull off 1 upset...prediction 0-2 wins, 1 being most likely end result. Denver L, San Diego L, Kansas City L, Rams 60/40 L, 49ers L, Kansas City L, Buffalo L, Denver L. Jacksonville- jacksonville has a hard schedule to call, they have a number of games where they are underdogs but the games are also very winnable. They could go 0-7 or they could go 4-2. I'm guessing they win 3 and end up 4-12 Dallas-Small chance of an upset but most likely an L, colts L, Giants 60/40 loss, Texans 60/40 L, Ravens L, Titans 50/50 (I may move this up to 70/3 L if Mettenberger plays well leading up to the game). Houston 60/40. Jets- Jets are a little like Jacksonville, they could easily go 0-7 or they could go 5-2. I'm guessing they go 2-5. Steelers L, Buffalo 60/40 L, Miami 70/30 L, Minnesota 70/30 L, Titans 50/50 (this one depends on how Mettenberger is adapting), Patriots L, Miami L (at miami) Titans- The Titans all depend on how quickly Mettenberger adapts to the NFL, he had a good first game for a rookie, but it was against a terrible pass defense in Houston so it has to be taken with a big grain of salt. At best the Titans will wind up going 4-4, at worsts 0-8. I'm guessing they wind up going either 2-6 or 3-5 (I like Mettenberger A Lot, I think he'll be the steal of the draft, but the Titans are not a good team and he's going to have growing pains) Ravens L, Steelers L, Eagles L, Texans 50/50, Giants 60/40 L, Jets 50/50 (see Jets), Jaguars 50/50, Colts L. Rams- i can't see the Rams winning more than 2 maybe 3 of their remaining 8...I'm going with 2-6 Cardinals L, Denver L, Chargers L, Raiders 60/40 W, Redskins L, Cardinals L, Giants 70/30 L, Seahawks L. Bucs- Bucs are another team thats hard to call, they could go 0-8 or 5-3, I'm guessing 2-6 Falcons 50/50 (falcons are a better team but damn), Redskins 60/40 L, Bears 60/40 (jeckyll and hyde team), Bengals 70/30 L, Lions L, Panthers 50/50, Packers L, Saints L. Falcons-Falcon's are a team that doesn't make sense, they should be winning a lot more, but their game plans and execution is horrible. I just can't see them going better than 4-4, I think they go 3-5. Bucs 50/50, Carolina 50/50, Browns L, Cardinals L, Green Bay L, Pittsburgh L, Saints 60/40 L, Panthers 50/50 Panthers- I can't see the Panthers going better than 5-3, but I think they go 3-5 Eagles L, Falcons 50/50, vikings 70/30 L, Saints L, Bucs 50/50, Browns L, Falcons 50/50. Bears- I can't see the Bears going better than 4-4, Really if Cutler is always the Jekyll Cutler they could go 8-0, But Hyde shows up too often. I'm actually calling the Bears 4-4. Greenbay L, Vikings 50/50, Bucs 60/40 W, Lions L, Dallas L, Saints 60/40 L, Lions L, Vikings 60/40 L. Redskins- RGIII stays healthy and plays well I still think the best they do is 3-4, and that's what I think they do. Bucs 60/40 W, 49ers L, Colts L, Rams W, Giants 50/50, Eagles 60/40 L, Dallas L Giants- 9 games left, 8 after tonight. I think they lose 4 and split the rest so I'm guessing they go 3-6. Colts L, Seattle L, San Francisco L, Dallas 50/50 w/o Romo (L with Romo), jaguars 60/40 W, Titans 60/40 W, Redskins 50/50, Rams 70/30W, Eagles L. So, if my predictions are correct, and it's 99.99999999999999% likely I won't be 100% correct, but I think i'll be pretty close in the end regarding the draft order effects. Bear in mind I haven't fully cross checked who plays who to see if this combination is even possible based on interaction of schedules. Additonally I tried to be pessemistic rather than optimistic, but since some teams play each other it was impossible to be completely pessemistic because being pesemistic required being optimistic for the other bad team they were playing. Raiders currently 0-8 predicted end record 1-15 Jets Currently 1-8 Predicted end record 3-13 Bucs Currently 1-7 predicted end record 3-13 Jaguars currently 1-8 predicted end record 4-12 titans Currently 2-6 predicted end record 4-12 Rams Currently 3-5 predicted end record 5-11 Falcons currently 2-6 predicted end record 5-11 Panthers currently 3-5 predicted end record 6-10 Redskins currently 3-6 predicted end record 6-10 Giants currently 3-4 predicted end record 6-10 Bears currently 3-5 predicted end record 7-9 Now I'm not saying the Jets will have the #2 or #3 pick, but I'd put the odds of it at about 75%, only about a 1% chance of the #1 pick, the Raiders are Just BAD. And the Jets being the Jets will probably now run the table despite all odds and wind up at 7-9 and the #19 pick in the draft.
I'm not saying they should tank to get in that position, but winning 3 more games is pointless as Rex should be gone after this year (regardless of how the year ends) and Vick won't be here either. It's not the team's job to let these guys audition for their future employers. They should be evaluating the younger players on the roster right now since this season is a lost cause. This team needs to see what we have for the future and what positions need to be addressed. Would you rather the Jets be a contender for most of the next 10-12 years because they draft high enough to get what's thought to be an elite QB talent in Mariotta? Long term thinking. Or would you rather they win 3 more games this year in one of their worst seasons ever that people will only remember for being miserable? Short term thinking.
It's entirely possibly someone trades up to one spot before us specifically to take Mariota. That's what you have to worry about. The only way to avoid that happening is to specifically trade up to #1 overall pre-draft, which would almost certainly cost multiple first-round picks. As dire as our QB situation is, I'd be loathe to give up multiple first-rounders for Mariota when there's still talent at other positions of need on the board. My jury's still out on Mariota as the hope of the franchise. Let me briefly explain why. First, Mariota is ridiculously athletic, to the point where it almost worries me. I'm wary of true dual-threat QBs generally simply because I wonder if their athleticism impedes their development as a pocket passer. All the top NFL QBs are pocket passers, some (Big Ben, Luck, Rodgers) with great escapability. The vast majority of dual-threat prospects haven't been able to develop into that in the pros, so I'm naturally wary of passers who wow us with 100-yard rushing games. I acknowledge that this is absolutely not fair on my part. Everything I've read suggests Mariota has a massive football IQ and iron-clad work ethic. But history has not been good. Second, the systemic dominance of the Oregon offense was evident versus Stanford. I saw multiple plays that were made as much because the sheer pace of the Oregon offense catching Stanford out-of-alignment as much as by flawless offensive execution. While Mariota absolutely made some very pro-level moves (hitting his WRs in stride on a slant route, a nice check-down to his non-primary receiver, a beautiful count-change to get a clear blitz read from the Stanford D, etc) but also some mistakes showing he has room to grow (missed a throw to a wide-open receiver, etc.) Finally, and I know it's silly, but you know those rumors about Mariota being too nice? I get it, a little. Watch Rodgers, Brady or Manning play, and the other team scoring - they just strap on their helmet and get ready to march down the field again. But when someone on their own team makes some bone-headed mistake - they don't tolerate that from their teammates. That's a quality that I think raises the level of play around them. Honestly, there's a simple way for Mariota to answer the concerns I have about him - make it in to the college football playoff and dominate there. But if he can pick apart those nasty defenses and look good doing it, playing under as much pressure as you'll find in college ball, put a team on his back and drag them kicking and screaming to victory - I'll be all-in on him.
If we're drafting 3 or 4, the only team we need to worry about is TB. Jax and Oakland are not taking a QB at 1 or 2. They're not. And if it's anyone other than TB is at 3 or 4, we do not need to worry about them because Jax and Oak are not going to want to be out of the top 5. and it's not going to take multiple 1st rounders to make that trade because Jax and Oak DON'T want to be out side the top 5. Wrong way to think. You give up every position player in the world to get the franchise QB. Or you suffer the fate we've suffered for 45 years and sit there marveling at the Pats and Packers and Colts and Steelers for decades. _
That's what everyone says every year. Those guys aren't trading the top pick. Oakland will most definitely take Cooper and as for Jacksonville they need a pass rusher, so Randy Gregory it is. Look at the Rg3 fiasco, I doubt any team will be willing to give multiple first round picks to move up three spots.
Ordinarily I'd agree with you. But BOTH those teams have their franchise QB and BOTH those team would move down a spot or 2 to get extra picks. Cooper. as good as he is, can't be a number 1 pick, but at number 3 or 4 with an extra few picks--absolutely. Same with Gregory or even Peat. This is not going to be an RG3 situation. _
This right here is my biggest issue with him as well. These types of QBs can have success, but it's not sustainable in this league. Not only is the sheer speed of the league going to shut down a lot of his options, but his body just won't be able to keep up with that game. I don't like comparing players because everyone is different, but I really don't have much confidence in mobile QBs. And can the Jets take the chance on another guy that doesn't play in a pro style offense? If they do, they better find the very best to develop a QB. As lame as it may seem, from a Fantasy perspective (many can probably follow the logic here), you never know what you're going to get from these dual threat QBs. Whereas, a true drop back stand in the pocket passer is almost guaranteed to put up consistent numbers. Throughout the history of the NFL, the stand in the pocket guy has been the guy who has taken his team to the promised land (with some exceptions, but let's play the game of averages). That said, I just don't see that type of guy in this years draft. Winston could possibly fit that mold, and I see him more as a passer than a runner (think Rodgers or Big Ben using their escapibility rather than rushing). However, his off field stuff just has me in a rattled and I'm not the one handing him a multi-million dollar contract. So I can only imagine what a front office must think of the guy. With all this "Fire Idzik" billboard stuff, could you imagine if he is still here next year? Do you swing for the fences with Winston with the possibility of striking out? Or does he try and play it safe and keep his job? It obviously can be a whole other thread, but I think that billboard stuff can be a huge detractor if he is indeed still here. With that in mind, I would say the safest pick in the top 5 would be Cooper. But who is throwing the ball? The FA QB class is full of broke dicks. Do you select Cooper, and take your chances with one of those, or do you select Winston/Mariota and sit them behind one of those QBs for a season and lose out on a potential top WR? Perhaps Vick is that guy, and the Jets grab someone else to develop in the later rounds. There are a lot of games left, and things can still happen as far as records go. However, I am sticking to my guns and pegging this a 3-13 season, which should put us in/around the top 5. With rumors of Cook saying that he's staying in school, how would you guys feel about picking Cooper in round 1, sticking with Vick/random injured retread (Bradford for example) and drafting a guy like Grayson in round 3 to develop? Of course this can all be null and void if the FO is also cleared out with the coaching staff and the new GM picks Winston/Mariota at the top. My head is spinning. What a shit year.
As long as we get either Mariota, Grayson or Cook I'm OK with that. And after the season and combine don't be surprised if Grayson goes end of the first early 2nd round.
I really think the top three wideouts are in place, especially if Percy continues to perform at such a high level. I'd like to add another guy to the mix though; maybe a vet like Nate Washington who could probably be signed for not much money.
That's what makes this difficult. It will be bad enough if he falls to us at 3 or 4 and we take him and he busts. Can you imagine if we trade up? But before we do anything with regard to a QB, I want to see a commitment to modern approach for NFL offense with the next regime,and a serious upgrade of the OL... otherwise, whowever we pick is doomed, like everyone else since Joe Wille.
