This is an example of how the past always seems to fit the narrative that we have on the current day. You thought that we needed to replace among others: Either John Abraham or Shaun Ellis, plus Jonathan Vilma, Brandon Moore, Laveranues Coles, Dewayne Robertson (who was 24 years old), Erik Coleman and Kerry Rhodes? Those are just the guys under 29 who started games for the Jets after that season. Yeah, it was a real mess but the idea that the Jets just had a DE worth anything is pure hyperbole on your part. It's hyperbole designed to make one guy look good and another guy look worse.
Kerley, Brick, Mangold, Powell, Cumby, Harrison, Coples, Wilkerson, Davis, Harris, Pace, Allen, Ellis, Wilson, Walls, Jarrett, Bellore, Lankster is a considerable amount of contributors from the prior regime.
I was going off the top of my head; I knew I'd be missing some quality players that remained. Put my stance remains that it was a WHOLE LOT WORSE. Ellis was the DE I was referring to that did not need to be replaced. Abraham was traded for a 1st round pick, 29th pick I believe, which turned into Mangold so he needed to be replaced. Vilma and Robertson were 4-3 players that did not fit the 3-4 scheme Mangini wanted to implement, we knew they were going to be replaced and they were I think a year later? You got me on Moore, Coles, Coleman and Rhodes. So along with Ellis that makes 5 holdovers out of 22?
This is true, but only if that team has or acquires a top end QB. Rarely can a team make a drastic turnaround without great play from the QB position.
stupid thread.. it takes 3 years to really rate a draft..its been 1 season for his 1st draft and 2 freaking games for his 2nd. free agents are so over rated im sorry..80% i feel like get there contracts get terminated because a, they over paid for the FA at the time b. the player is not effective in his 30's. and people need to stop with this emmanual sanders garbage..hes with manning now of course hes going to look like a "true #1" wr
It's about what you'd expect two years into a rebuild. The 2006 Jets, who made the playoffs, had 14 starters carrying over from the old regime. The 2007 Jets had 12. The 2008 Jets had 8. The 2013 Jets had 14 guys carrying over, largely due to contracts in place and the cap. Holmes and Cromartie would likely have been cut if the option was there. The 2014 Jets have 11 guys carrying over at this point and one of them is playing out of position to do it, although I suspect AA would be starting at SS and Landry would be the 3rd safety if push came to shove. The 2015 Jets are likely to have 10 or fewer carryover starters from the 2012 team. That's just aging in the NFL. Calvin Pace is getting a bit long in the tooth. D'Brick, Mangold and Harris are all over 30. Guys who seem solidly in place right now might find themselves replaced by a really good rookie or by a guy the coaching staff imported to push them. That's what happened to David Barrett and Erik Coleman in 2007. It just happens.
He made the short and intermediate single move plays. When they treated him with a double move he failed in the exact same way both times and then got torched by Jordy Nelson after the catch. Do you really think that Jordy Nelson could outrun a healthy Milliner? LOL
I said it before I'll say it again,these corners we have aren't capable of covering a stud WR with a top QB at the helm.Millner needs to show something next week
Didn't Indy go from worst in their division to first? Didn't KC go from 2 wins to 11 a couple years ago?
If that is a considerable amount, then what would you consider the core of elite teams. Keep in mind that Kerley, Powell, Wilkerson, Coples, Harrison were all young during that season and the rest of the players you list outside of Brick and Mangold did nto contribute either.
Actually there were 14 guys starting for the 2006 team that made the playoffs that had started for the 2005 Jets. It sounds wrong but it's true. Chad came back to be the QB. Coles and Cotchery were the WR's. Baker was the TE. Kendall and Moore were the guards. So that's 6 carryover's on offense. Then you have Ellis, Robertson and Thomas (listed as a DE although my memory is he stood up a lot that year) on the DL. Barton, Vilma and Hobson at LB. Coleman and Rhodes at safety. That's 8 starters on defense for the 2006 Jets who were prior regime finds. It went downhill from there but that's because all the 27-28 year old FA's signed from 2002 to 2004 began to age out. Just like the 2007 to 2009 FA's aged out on Tanny's Jets which then became Idzik's Jets. The most important thing to realize about the FA market is that you are buying two years tops when you sign those guys mid-career. You may get lucky and find a guy who plays well past 30 but the odds are against it. This is the error that the previous Jets regimes kept repeating and then suffering the fallout from. Woody Johnson is willing to spend the money if his Gm thinks the guy is a solution. He's willing to pony up what it takes to make the Jets roster better. Both of the previous GM's were more than willing to go this route to try to boost the team over the top. So far Idzik is being very careful with free agency as a resource. It's possible that we'll lose an extra game this year because we didn't splurge on free agents. Possible but unlikely. It's almost a certainty that if we'd splurged the way we have in the past we'd have paid a heavy price in 2016, which is when the Super Bowl window should be wide open for us. That's what makes Idzik's approach interesting. He's not going to do anything to make this year's team look better than it really is if the cost is that it will be worse when crunch time comes in 2015 and 2016.
Hey I thought you weren't responding to me. But yeah, "worst to first" doesn't exactly indicate divisional rankings.
Indy got the #1 pick in the draft at a time when the best QB prospect of the last 5 years was available. Please don't use them as an example of how the Jets have failed unless you have a way to get the Jets an Andrew Luck caliber QB for free, without trading up. The Redskins went from worst to 1st in a season also and that's not looking so good right now, right? KC, well they took the FA option. How is that looking right now and how will they look in a year or two?
I don't know what your assessment is based on, but it should be obvious that the CS did not know how Milliner would do until they put him in there. I knew he would not be near 100%, though, so perhaps my lack of surprise has made me less critical of the decision, in a funny way.
We're already eating them. The Jets talent base as of the end of 2012 was 5-11. Right now they're maybe 8-8, maybe better than that. The Jets talent base at the end of 2005 was also about 5-11. They needed to rebuild the offensive line basically and they needed a healthy Chad. The Jets used the draft in 2006 to rebuild their depth and offensive line and then they started taking shortcuts in the draft and signing free agents and they never really got above a 8 to 10 win talent base after that. 2009 and 2010 were as much free agent bang for the buck as you could get and a defensive genius who saw a way to leverage a CB into a topflight defense for two seasons. I would say that absent the Jets hiring of Rex Ryan they never peak at all in the talent base assembled as of 2009 and we just wind up where we are right now without the two long playoff runs to show for it. What we're doing right now is the right approach to building a solid NFL contender. It may not work out in the end but throwing money at free agents and trading up will NEVER work out in the end either. It'll just put us back on the same stationary bike we've been riding since 2001 or so. There are a couple of exceptions to the statements above. If the Jets could actually find a 27 year old Drew Brees as a free agent QB they'd probably be fine. If they chanced upon a mid rounds QB in the draft who turned into a Hall of Famer they'd be fine also. Everybody else, all the good organizations, build the way the Jets are building now. Slowly, sometimes painfully but always with an eye on having a good young talent base that is good enough to be the core of a Super Bowl team.
Is all this to say that we were not in worse shape when Tanny took over vs. Idzik? Just want to make sure I understand where you are going with all this as I don't necessarily disagree with what you've written. BTW a lot of those guys remained starters because we couldn't address every position in one off season. In 2006 we QB was a need, that's why we drafted Clemens in the 2nd. We didn't know Chad was going to be able to come back. WR was a need as well; we had Coles but didn't know what we had in Cotch. He had done nothing up until that point. Cotch started only 1 game prior to 2006 not sure I would consider him a returning starter. Vilma, Hobson and Robertson were all going to go as they did not fit the new scheme, we just didn't have the personnel yet to replace them.
He looked gassed in the 2nd half. I think Milliner got over-worked on his first week back. Coaching staff didn't come through yesterday.
