Figured. Taylor ham-egg-&-cheese is popular in NJ. Most people get it on a bagel or roll. Sometimes it's referred to as a "Tower," with salt, pepper, ketchup. I don't consume meat/poultry (seafood is a go), but I don't hate on it either. Anyway, there's my contribution to the derailment of this thread's subject matter.
What really sucks about this, is you're forcing me into a corner where I appear to be a Hill apologist..which I'm not. It's really easy to sit back & cling onto the negatives when expectations aren't met in a young player. That said I stand by my assessment. Which by the way isn't making any proclamation's about what Hill's future may hold. In the end you maybe right. Maybe he's out of the league in 2 years. But you act as if he's a UDFA level player who has absolutely no production & no football skills to work w/. But while limited he's HAD success both in practice & game settings. Not just against Buffalo either. I distinctly recall him having a couple big catches against the Patriots, a big gainer against Pittsburgh(holding onto a ball while getting pummeled by Polamalu by the way) 6 receptions vs. Bucs & other efforts w/ multiple receptions. I've attended every training camp up to this year & have watched him along w/ many other young players closely. I see a player w/ the skills I mentioned above who continues to progress. I never mentioned anything about his hands & I'm not sure what that even has to do w/ body control. Body control is referring to gathering one's momentum & mechanics in order to put your body in position to make a play on the football. Yes he is a body catcher. In the modern game alot of guys are body catchers. Especially big long "Basketball" types. Would you prefer a guy to catch with his hands? Of course..but that doesn't mean a body catcher can't have success. As for "extra coverage"..I must be a raving lunatic then. Cause I've seen several safeties lined up directly on top of Hill's hash. Do you think I just made that up? Who says anything about Hill being double covered? I never did. A safety occupying a hash could mean a number of things. It could be a bracket, cover 2/cover 3 as you alluded to, a trap or yes even a double team.But from a pre-snap perspective it is a sign of respect when a safety drapes over the top of a specific receiver. Suppose it was cover 2 as you alluded to. Let's just take that scenario. Why in the world would a defense play that coverage against the Jets unless they had legit concerns over Hill's deep speed?Afterall, the cover 2 is designed to split the deep seams in half & its weakness is lateral/intermediate middle.Who were the Jets primary playmakers in the passing game the last 2 years(I use the word playmaker very loosely)? Jeremy Kerley on crossing routes & Holmes finding seams/slants in the intermediate flats. They had no other deep threat than Hill.yet teams were still playing cover 2 against the Jets? I'd love for you to explain that one...please do.
is it even fair to judge our very average offense harshly for struggling against a defense that may be emerging into an elite one in training camp? i think i'd rather see in the pre-season before i start judging our young players.
I'm not clinging onto the negatives at all, simply stating that the player himself has not shown a lot of progress. Throw out the practice 'success' already because the guy is entering his third year in the league. It's one thing to applaud guys in their first year in camp with a team, or a rookie, but applauding the success of someone in camp is getting a bit absurd at this point, especially when he's already loaded this camp up with dropsies reports. Clyde Gates is destroying training camp by the way, and we all know how that translates. You're right, I discredited Hill a bit more than I should've he's had more than two multi reception games, but that doesn't make him a productive player in two years by any stretch. While hands and body control are not the same thing, it's obvious that one helps the better. You control your body to put yourself in better position to make the catch with your hands. Make sense? The point is that he doesn't contort his body well, or adjust well to the ball. Jumping and turning and catching balls on the back shoulder, and just turning your body in general to move towards the ball is a big part of being an NFL wide receiver. 'Body catchers' don't succeed in this league, despite the fact that there are some receivers who catch with their body rather than their hands. I can honestly say that I can't remember a ball he didn't catch with his body and that's the alarming part. Even his big touchdown against Buffalo from Marky Mark he made sure to get himself in position so that he could pin the ball against his chest. You're giving Hill way too much credit for the coverages that teams play against the Jets. They could be playing cover 2 for a multitude of reasons, I really don't know. Maybe protecting edge rushes which allows them to leave their corners up, maybe because they know they could get a high school corner to put a jam on Hill and he'd have trouble breaking it. Jam the receivers, and collapse the pocket and your life is easy because your offenses flanker can't get off the line in the first 4 seconds. It has a lot less to do with this game breaking speed in which I don't think we've ever seen Hill straight up blow by a corner which one would think he would with 4.3 timed speed. I'd bet he's much slower on the field and in pads than that, albeit still not a slow guy. I'm honestly in support of the guy, but I don't really see him as becoming very valuable to this team, especially when he's still dropping a bunch of balls (which I imagine is in turn to body catching). If he even becomes just a deep threat that's a great thing for the Jets because it expands the array of talents they have at wide receiver. I'm just not overly optimistic about a guy because he's caught a couple deep balls in practice.
Maybe it's called that only in my area? There's a Facebook page for TE&C, and I think Tower is referenced there too.
We can agree to disagree. That said..I'm not sure where this idea that he's "flooding practice w/ drops" is coming from. Have you attended any practices?
We can agree to disagree. That said..I'm not sure where this idea that he's "flooding practice w/ drops" is coming from. Have you attended any practices? If you have & can speak first hand I'll shut up.I follow TC extremely closely via all possible outlets. I'm aware of 3 drops from Hill at the very most. 3 Drops would mean approximately 1 drop for every 2 practices.About on par w/ what's been reported for Kerley thus far. Considering all skill guys have drops in practice..that isn't bad at all.Conversely, he's made big catches for both Vick & Geno in all but one session that I'm aware of. It's also been remarked by many how much smoother & stronger he looks in his routes. You may not think much of progress made in practice. But progress has to start somewhere & you can't just down play obvious improvement especially for a WR entering year 3..which is supposed to be when the lights really come on.Additionally I get the sense that you'd be all over him if there were reports that he was struggling in Cortland.
I think we'll have to agree to disagree. Again, it's not as if I'm rooting against the guy, because if he puts it all together and becomes a bonafide deepthreat and JUST THAT it's mission success for the Jets. We're all in this together really. It's not a great thing to be one dimensional but the offense MM is running relies on having receivers that can do different things so it'd benefit the team if he really started ripping the tops off defenses and teams playing a cover 2 doesn't really indicate that at all. I haven't been able to attend any practices, I have also read all the tweets and reports from camp and it seems as though there's a Hill drop noted in every report. It'd be pretty tough for him not to improve after how poorly he's played the past two years. Once again I'm not against the guy and perhaps it's his draft position that gets to people, but it's tough to draw positives from a guy that hasn't shown much in two years when he plays. That's all I'm saying, yet fans such as yourself continue to draw all these positives from a couple good games in two damn years.
With Amaro struggling Studs will get some serious playing time in the first 2 pre season games. I think Geno has looked good so far not great... Vick too... Decker has been legit and is BY FAR our best WR... Kerley will be good in the slot and will produce if healthy... Its just that #2 guy that is a glaring hole!! RB's are gonna be sick this year!! CJ and Ivory reminds me a ton of LT and Greene... I like it!! Front 7 are top 5 in the league hands down and i have been impressed with Patterson i think he fits the scheme real nice. McDougal is mad raw though and needs time to develop.. I cant see him starting unless we have injuries.
While we're all convincing ourselves of how great were gonna play this season with Geno in his 2nd year, the D-Line one year better, and so forth remember we'll be sitting right here again next year saying the same thing about how much better Geno will be in his 3rd year, Milliner too. So....keep some room for next year's improvements when your planning just how great we're gonna be this years!
Decker is no doubt the real deal. It's clear to me that Peyton (although still really good obviously) has been getting way too much credit for the Bronco's success last year, and the three legitimate pro-bowl receivers he had deserve alot more. That's just how the NFL is these days though. The Jets QB situation (ironically) seems to be the least of their worried right now. Both guys are playing very well, very early in camp. The phrase ussually goes "If you have 2 QB's then you really have no QB's." but the Jets legitimately have 2 QB's this year. As for the TE's. I am expecting all 3 to get equal playing time with the 1st and 2nd team offenses this pre-season. Amaro has the best skills but is struggling to pick up the offense. Sudfield has the best size and looks to be the most improved. Cumberland got into camp a little late but from the little I have heard of him, he sounds ok. I would agree with you that Sudfield will get the most time, but sometimes when you put a guy in a live game situation (Amaro), they play much better because they are not overthinking. Pretty much the reverse of what we have seen with Steven Hill.
Drops are just part of the game. Brandon Marshall led the league with 12. Wes Welker had 10. Calvin Johnson had 8. The key to me though is if a guy has a drop percentage of 4 - 5 percent. Andre Johnson, Calvin Johnson, Decker, Bryant, Julio Jones, AJ Green, and the majority of the pro-bowl level guys are all in this range. The bigger concern when it comes to drops though is when talking about Running Backs, because there are a bunch of guys that just can't catch. If Chris Ivory could catch as well as Calvin Johnson then he could legitimately be a top 5 RB. He has terrible hands though so whenever he is in the backfield, if it's a passing play the opposing team knows to not even worry about him coming out in the flat. That's a big deal. CK2K though will demand attention from atleast one defender, because if Geno slings him a pass in wide open space, that's an easy 15 - 20 yards, and there is a chance he will break it for 60+ yards. Easy TD's like that are something the Jets haven't had in the entire Rex era.
