Human beings would still be fighting and blowing each other up.. religion or no religion. We are violent by nature.
Exactly. War and killing is not part of the teachings of Christianity. Quite the opposite. But we have free choice... People like to blame religion because it's an easy scapegoat for our violent choices. Reminds me of southpark episode... Cartman freezes himself and wakes up 4000 years in future... In the future there is no religion... And there is constant warfare between all factions.... My science is the true science! No MY science is the true science!
Whoever we are Wherever we're from We shoulda noticed by now Our behavior is dumb And if our chances Expect to improve It's gonna take a lot more Than tryin' to remove The other race Or the other whatever From the face Of the planet altogether They call it the earth Which is a dumb kinda name But they named it right 'cause we behave the same... We are dumb all over Dumb all over, Yes we are Dumb all over, Near 'n far Dumb all over, Black 'n white People, we is not wrapped tight Nurds on the left Nurds on the right Religious fanatics On the air every night Sayin' the bible Tells the story Makes the details Sound real gory 'bout what to do If the geeks over there Don't believe in the book We got over here You can't run a race Without no feet 'n pretty soon There won't be no street For dummies to jog on Or doggies to dog on Religious fanatics Can make it be all gone (I mean it won't blow up 'n disappear It'll just look ugly For a thousand years...) You can't run a country By a book of religion Not by a heap Or a lump or a smidgeon Of foolish rules Of ancient date Designed to make You all feel great While you fold, spindle And mutilate Those unbelievers From a neighboring state To arms! to arms! Hooray! that's great Two legs ain't bad Unless there's a crate They ship the parts To mama in For souvenirs: two ears (get down!) Not his, not hers, (but what the hey? ) The good book says: ("it gotta be that way!") But their book says: "revenge the crusades... With whips 'n chains 'n hand grenades..." Two arms? two arms? Have another and another Our God says: "there ain't no other!" Our God says "it's all okay!" Our God says "this is the way!" It says in the book: "burn 'n destroy... 'n repent, 'n redeem 'n revenge, 'n deploy 'n rumble thee forth To the land of the unbelieving scum on the other side 'cause they don't go for what's in the book 'n that makes 'em bad So verily we must choppeth them up And stompeth them down Or rent a nice french bomb To poof them out of existence While leaving their real estate just where we need it To use again For temples in which to praise our god ("cause he can really take care of business!") And when his humble tv servant With humble white hair And humble glasses And a nice brown suit And maybe a blond wife who takes phone calls Tells us our God says It's okay to do this stuff Then we gotta do it, 'cause if we don't do it, We ain't gwine up to hebbin! (depending on which book you're using at the Time...can't use theirs... it don't work ...it's all lies...gotta use mine...) Ain't that right? That's what they say Every night... Every day... Hey, we can't really be dumb If we're just following god's orders Hey, let's get serious... God knows what he's doin' He wrote this book here An' the book says: He made us all to be just like him," So... If we're dumb... Then God is dumb... (an' maybe even a little bit ugly on the side)
Science is about theory and proof. The reason there are no major divergences in scientific thought that stand for long is that the theories are objectively provable or disprovable by various methods over time. So divergent scientific thought tends to dissipate as the weight of evidence accumulates to support one side or the other. Religion on the other hand is all about faith with no proof at all. Divergent religious thought will always be with us because you can't prove or disprove it. You either believe or you don't.
Babylonians, Akkadians, Greeks, Carthaginians and Romans all shared a belief in a god of the sea. My suspicion is that all ancient mariners had such a god because the sea will kill you fast and unpredictably and there's no hope at all if you don't have somebody to call upon to save your soul when the storms are churning.
Not--where is that statue from? I've seen the ones in Rome (both), the Vatican, Florence, Bologna and Madrid, but that one looks like it should be pretty famous and I can't find it on the web. _
Ahhhh, nice. I was looking up the Roman Neptune and they have him as the Greek Poseidon. I wonder who would have won in a fight between those two. Remember how fat Shelly Winters was in The Poseidon Adventure? I couldn't get that awful tune "There's Got to Be a Morning After" out of my head for months after seeing that flick as a kid. Oh, fuck...dammit. _
I don't buy that for a second. Less reasons to fight = less fighting. Most people are not violent by nature. Most of the problems stem from the highest levels of leadership. Islamic leaders that don't condemn the Muslim extremists for their warped interpretation of Qua'ran, and Christian presidents that don't denounce fundamentalist Christians that are holding back scientific progress and tolerance of others you don't agree with over here. Christianity will be gone just as quickly. Yes, that Bill Belichick is quite the devil.
War and killing is part of the bible, which is accepted by most Christians as a whole. If it wasn't they wouldn't include the old testament with the new. It wasn't part of Jesus' teachings, which is why it baffles me that so many Christians support war. When 2 factions believe they are "god's chosen people" and have a divine claim to a land, it is DIRECTLY the fault of religion, rather than the nature of people. It's an easy answer because it's so true.
Ive been to church like two times in the last decade. I studied science in college. I'm not a religious fanatic at all. But dude, everything you and Barcs wrote in this thread is not true. The causes of WW1 and 2 had nothing to do with religion. The last conflict that can be attributed to religious causes was the Thirty Years War. Islam is not going anywhere, it's thousands of years old and despite its use for violence among powerful sects it's still the fastest growing religion in the world. Massively incorrect scientific thoughts have stood for up to hundreds or even thousands of years at times. prime examples; the earth is flat, spontaneous generation, geocentric universe, miamasic theory of disease, phlogiston, static universe, etc. just as most of these erroneous thoughts fall out of favor over time, so do most divergent and extreme religious causes. Christianity, Islam, Judaism, and Hinduism interestingly all have 4 major denominations each that are similar to each other. Extremist offshoots tend to dwindle out eventually as their erroneous teachings are revealed, just as erroneous scientific theories are disproved. There is proof to support religion. There is proof that Jesus was a real person, and beyond eye witness accounts - The shroud of Turin for example has to this day defied the most advanced scientific evaluations. There have been many documented miracles. Many of our greatest scientific minds - the people who had the greatest understanding of our world - were or became very religious, most notably Einstein. Of course faith is an essential component because God works beyond the realm of our understanding. One of the most famous things Jesus said was to "doubting" Thomas; you believe because you have seen, blessed are those who believe without seeing. That's just false. Christians don't support war. Thou shalt not kill. We support killing only in self defense. The Old Testament is part of our history, it's important to recognize the past. The teachings of the New Testament is what Christians follow. The Old Testament is outdated but it is included in Christian Bibles because it lays down some fundamental teachings and to show that God was not merciful but that then God changed. He became human through Jesus to die for our sins. This marked a new relationship between God and Man; one based on love and forgiveness, not wrath and fear. Two factions fighting and killing over land for religious reasons is due to human flaw and our penchant for twisting religious teachings for evil or selfish reasons, not the religious teachings them-self. A great example is how the Pharisees, the most "holy" men of their day, constantly used warped understanding of scripture to try to incriminate Jesus because they believed that he threatened their power. In conclusion I'll say that I empathize with your viewpoint. Religion has been used as a tool for evil throughout the history of man. That's on man though. Read any of the major religious texts; they all preach love not hate. We can nitpick certain passages to twist it to our views but then we are no better than the Pharisees. The greatest trick the devil ever did was convincing the world that he doesn't exist. Think of it, if you were satan what would your prime target be? Religion. And yes, religious institutions have been infiltrated by evil many many times. The absence of religious teachings would not make satan disappear, it would make his job easier. I think it's very naive to believe that the world would be a better place without religion.
