You're assuming here that the Russians shot it down in Ukranian airspace. Keep in mind this has happened in Ukraine before (a commercial airliner was mistakenly shot down). Also keep in mind that nearly all planes have been diverting from that area completely and it's odd that they were flying the path they were. We'll hear from Malaysian airlines on that one and they may be held equally at fault here for ignoring the war zone. I'd say it's a bit early to assume that Russia shot this down. I'm sure many so-called journalists will jump to such conclusions as well before any evidence appears from an investigation.
I was responding to your assumption that it could have been the Ukrainian Air Force that shot down the passenger jet. The Ukrainians are not shooting any ground-to-air missiles there, as the "rebels" don't have any planes. So, there's nothing to shoot at.
I don't think so. The Russians have just involved the Netherlands and Malaysia, two widely diverse nations that had little interest in the Ukraine situation, in the fighting. Neither will become a participant but now the hostilities are a big issue in those countries that just didn't really give much of a damn about them before. The thing about shadow wars is that you have to keep them in the shadows where only the major players are really involved. Once you bring local politics in other places into play you've lost the ability to fight in the shadows. A cause celebre was the last thing the Russians needed right now. To put it another way: US containment of Iran failed after we shot down the airliner over the Persian Gulf. There was no way to keep the clamps on them after that because another mistake would have led to catastrophic public opinion problems for the US. The US wound up paying a huge settlement to the families of the victims but refused to apologize for the incident. The dynamic in the region shifted sharply in favor of the Iranians over the next decade and catapulted them into a position to become the dominant regional player. We should have apologized. It would have taken a lot of the wind out of Iran's sails in the aftermath of the incident. Saying "we thought an Airbus was an F14 Tomcat and it was an honest mistake" just made us look stupid in addition to unaccountable. There wouldn't have been any harm caused by admitting we made a mistake and apologizing to the families of the victims for our error. The smartest thing Putin could do right now would be to admit the error, apologize to the families of the victims, make reparations and assure the world that the same error (putting anti-air weapons in the hands of undisciplined rebels) would not happen again.
The one thing that is pretty clear coming out of this is that Malaysian Airlines is the last carrier on earth you want to fly with.
But the Ukes do have jet fighters, one of which had just been shot down. It's pure speculation, but its not inconceivable they had some pretty anxious birds in the air in the general vicinity. EDIT: This is from the BBC, Ukraine military denies involvement: 20:36: "No surface-to-air systems are involved in the military operation against separatists in the east, and the plane was out of reach of other Ukrainian air defence forces," the statement from Ukraine's Defence Ministry added. (BBC Monitoring) 20:35: Ukraine's Defence Ministry has said that no Ukrainian fighter jets were in the air in the area where the Malaysian plane was shot down.
I'm on my phone now and was reading yahoo comments (yikes) and if correct apparently from the BBC there are audio recordings just upload on YouTube to prove who was at fault. Something about communications between the Russians.
From BBC http://www.bbc.com/news/world-28354787 20:33: And a quick recap. A Malaysian airliner carrying 295 people has crashed in east Ukraine on a flight from Amsterdam to Kuala Lumpur, amid allegations it was shot down. The BBC has a summary of what we know so far. 20:31: In the YouTube footage a militant nicknamed "Major" is seen saying it was shot down by "Cossacks from the Chernukhino roadblock". Major goes on to say: "It is definitely a civilian plane... there was a lot of people on board," BBC Monitoring reports. 20:27: BBC Monitoring reports more from the conversation between militants allegedly intercepted by the Ukrainian Security Service. The conversation starts with Igor Bezler, a key militant, apparently telling a Russian security official by phone that the pro-Russian militants have shot down a plane. 20:23: The Ukrainian Security Service SBU has published on its Youtube account what it says are intercepted conversations between pro-Russian militants in which they say they admit shooting down a civilian plane, BBC Monitoring reports.
Will the world sitback and allow civilian carriers to be shot down? Thinking the hammer must be dropped on whoever is found to be the guilty party. Amazing how little action has been taken by Europe thus far. Whatever "lead" or position they take USA would almost certainly back 100% Sad as it is, this may finally be the push needed to get Europe to act.
And not a single one of you even wonders what happened to the 777 that spent months in the media and has never been found. What a fucking joke.
It was a Cossack group that apparently did this, according to a Ukrainian Security Services phone tap. When the rebels asked them for clarification, they supposedly replied, "they wanted to bring some spies to us. **** them. " http://mashable.com/2014/07/17/mala...s-leaked-audio/?utm_cid=mash-com-Tw-main-link Here's the full translation of the video, provided by Kyiv Post:
Lol. The day after the tuff guy speech, a jetliner is conveniently shot down by "Russians". Dude, some day our government is going to pay for its evils, and it will REALLY be in terms of civilians that another country actually perpetrates.
