Listen, I am not saying that Odell Beckam Jr isn't a good player but if you were to compare the two, Cooks has him beat all day long. Cooks plays with a tenacity that is unrivaled . He plays bigger than he is and he never stops trying to extend the play. If it is between the two of them at 18 we are in a good position but from watching the tape I just don't know how people could think Beckam is better than Cooks. He looks to be one of the best in the draft and he has the stats to back it up. His quickness, shiftiness and toughness to take down would really make him a huge weapon in a west coast offense. What do you guys think?
Cooks has established a #1 WR production level in college. He needs to make the adjustment to the NFL but he doesn't need to raise his established level of production. He just needs to play up to his established level of production to be a star #1. No guarantee he will do that but he's got a shot. Beckham is a #2 WR. He needs to make the adjustment to the NFL to be a #2 WR in the NFL. Then he needs to raise his level of production to establish himself as a #1 WR. He has a much harder task in front of him than Cooks because he has to significantly raise his level of production as well as meet the demanding standards of NFL play. I'd make Cooks about an 80/20 favorite to be the better NFL receiver at this point. Remove the injury factor and I'd make it 95/5. Just my opinion but I think it's backed up by the skills and production levels of the players in question. The most likely results for the 2 of them is that Cooks is a star slot receiver and Beckham is an acceptable #2. I'll take the star slot receiver every day if that's the choice I have.
1 thing I really want to dispute is the idea that any given WR qualifies universally as a #1 or #2 receiver. Every receiver fits a different role on each team. Some teams rely on a guy that is a clear #1, catches by far the most balls, and is probably the largest part of an offense, and then have a clear #2 receiver who catches the second most balls. Teams that fit these patterns most recently were TB and DET. Many teams have a number of different role players that make up their WR corp, and while there will be a leading receiver by default he doesn't have to qualify as this #1 receiver everyone talks about. New England does not have a #1 receiver. The Bills do not have a true #1 receiver. The Saints don't have a #1 receiver. The Jets offense is going to be rushing focused, and thus receiver who complement that are ideal. Someone who maximizes RB touches by blocking etc while still having big playmaking ability seems more useful to me than a WR who can't block for crap.
Maybe it is shortsighted but I still think height plays a big factor. DBs are getting taller and/or stronger every year. It doesn't take much to knock a guy off stride by jamming him at the line or if you are throwing a ball into a close window and the DB has a few inches of reach that can make the difference. I'm not saying just draft no talent tall guys over super talented shorter guys but if two guys are relatively closely matched I think the edge goes to the taller and stronger guy. Typically, maybe not in this case specifically, the bigger guy is also going to be more durable and therefore less prone to injuries.
Well then you just don't understand NFL talent. You want a blocking WR instead of a potential star #1 WR? Really?
This isn't Madden. A guy doesn't come with a preset skill level with a maximum potential overall skill level. There is just as much chance OBJ becomes a legit #1 receiver as there is Cooks becomes nothing more than a decent slot guy.
He doesn't have potential as a star #1 WR. Guys who did that in college have that potential. Guys who were always #2 or #3 on their teams like Beckham had that result for a reason: they weren't good enough to be the #1 guy. That's not going to change once he hits the NFL. He still isn't going to be good enough to get open regularly when the other team is looking to shut him down and that's what makes for a #1 WR.
You're exactly right, it isn't Madden. It's not about numbers that are based on other numbers. It's about why Odell Beckham Jr was the 3rd leading receiver on LSU and then the 2nd the next two seasons. It's about why LSU targeted Jarvis Landry more often than Beckham over their respective careers. A #1 WR gets the ball more often than anybody else. He catches more balls than anybody else. He often scores more TD's than anybody else. He's the guy you can count on to get open when you need a completion. When you see somebody who was the 2nd or 3rd option for their team there's a reason that was the case. It's not about who the defense tried to shut down because for a #1 WR that doesn't matter. A #1 WR is going to get his catches no matter what the defense throws at him. That's why they're a #1 WR. Beckham is going to get to the NFL and if defenses pay any real attention to him at all he's going to struggle. As a #2 WR he'll probably be a good complimentary receiver because by definition you can't dedicate resources to try to shut down the #2 WR. If you do that the #1 guy just mauls you.
Well it's good that his entire career path has been confirmed by some guy on the Internet a week before the draft. I guess everyone can rest easy knowing his exact career trajectory before he takes a snap in the NFL. Not sure why someone with your infinite wisdom and insight is spending their time in the New York Jets forum, shouldn't you be predicting future catastrophic events or making it big in the stock market? I'm no clairvoyant, I'll grant that it's entirely possible that Cooks ends up an absolute superstar and OBJ is flipping burgers two years from now. But it could be the other way around. Whether you accept that or not doesn't change the fact that it's true. Guys that are expected to be superstars never amount to anything and guys that are picked as an afterthought or even signed as UDFAs go on to play in a bunch of pro-bowls or having HOF careers. Nothing is certain in the draft.
Yes, but you don't pick the guy less likely to be a star over the guy more likely to be a star because shit happens. Brandin Cooks (and Marqise Lee) have both been big time receivers who lead their teams in receiving and TD's and yards and the whole deal. They did this despite teams trying to shut them down and game plan against them and generally screw them up. Odell Beckham Jr has never been the guy. Expecting him to miraculously become the guy once he hits the NFL is lunacy. What's most likely to happen is that he does in the NFL what he did in college but not quite as well. He's most likely to be a #2 WR. That's what his history suggests and fantasizing that he's suddenly going to become better than he's been at the same point that his competition becomes dramatically better is just that: fantasizing. With Cooks and Lee they just have to manage to keep doing what they've been doing. With Beckham he has to get much better or the team that drafted him has a #2 WR on it's hands, which is a terrible thing to get out of a 1st round draft pick.
sorry bradway, but i can't concur with you on this beckham has elite speed, can high point the ball, has strong hands, and runs decent routes. he can beat press coverage and finds holes in zones. he's a deep threat, but can also go over the middle. you're basically basing all of this off of his production, which isn't fair
The Jets' best receiver that they've drafted since Keyshawn never had more than 21 catches in college (Coles). I prefer Beckham to Cooks. I think both will be good, but I think Beckham has more upside for the same reasons Dom said.
I see some Lavernaeus Coles in the clips I have seen of Beckham. Of course, clips are always positive. To me, Coles was never THAT guy.
Some guys outperform their college production once they hit the NFL. That doesn't mean that you fantasize about their potential production and take them in the 1st round. Coles was a 3rd round pick and he was a 3rd round pick for a reason. He had off the field issues that caused him to miss most of his senior season. The potential was there but it was not matched by production and so he was not in the 1st round conversation for anybody Again I'm going to go back to using your picks in the most appropriate way and taking chances with your 1st round pick is not appropriate when there is real talent out there to be had.
Coles was a very good receiver but he only had a couple of seasons where he approached star status, his last season with the Jets on his first go round and his first with the Redskins. He was not the kind of talent you are trying to get out of your 1st round pick. He was the kind of talent that you love getting out of your 3rd.
