Do they have stats for INTs that are "like punts"? Because Junc tells me Sanchez leads the league in that category. I just want to confirm
I didn't clarify, the groupings aren't in order. So while Mark is in that last grouping of 12-16, the order I listed the names aren't in the order I believe they played. I just showed he was close to my 11-15 estimation of rankings. TD #1, game 1 for Schaub, up 6-0 in the 2nd quarter. #2, game 2, down 6-0 in the 2nd quarter #3 game 2, down 27-10 3rd quarter #4 game 2, down 27-20 in 4th quarter (so he ited the game at 27) #5 game 3, down 27-6 in the 4th quarter #6, game 4, Tied at 7 in 1st quarter #7, game 4, up 24-14 in 4th quarter, they win 31-24 #8, game 6, down 7-0 in 2nd quarter #9, game 6, down 31-28 in 4th quarter (game winner) #10, game 7, down 24-3 in 3rd quarter. #11, game 9, down 17-10 in 3rd quarter #12, game 9 down 24-17 in 4th quarter (jaguars hail mary game) #13, game 10, down 23-10 in 3rd quarter (Sanchez comeback game) #14, game 11 tied 0-0 in the 2nd quarter #15, game 11 up 7-0 in 2nd quarter #16, game 12, down 17-3 in 2nd quarter #17, game 12, down 20-10 in 3rd quarter #18, game 13, down 21-0 in 2nd quarter #19, game 13, down 28-13 in 4th quarter #20, game 13, down 28-20 in 4th quarter (forced game to OT) #21, game 14, down 24-3 in 3rd #22, game 14, down 31-10 in 4th #23, game 15, up 7-0 in 2nd #24, game 16, up 20-17 in 3rd quarter. So we have 3 bolded ones, which are clearly garbage time and one italicized which is 50/50 garbage time. Not even close to all his stuff was in garbage time, in fact more of his throws were "clutch" than garbage. Rivers had the #10 D in ppg allowed and the Jets had the #6 D so not sure why that matters. WE are judging how the QB played and Rivers played was more positibely impactful for his team than Sanchez was in 2010. http://www.nfl.com/stats/categoryst...eStatisticCategory=GAME_STATS&qualified=false Flacco threw for 8 more TDs and 3 less INTs with a lower INT%, higher TD %, higher comp %, and more YPA. Not as similar as you make it seem, Flacco played the QB position better. Cool you are going to take a 1 game sample size for Cassel? That's a great way to judge the 2010 SEASON for QBs right? Cassel threw for 27 TDs and 7 INTS, with higher TD%, lower INT%, with a higher YPA and higher completion percentage. He played the QB position better. Why are you looking at 2011 and 2012 for 2010 rankings? Freeman also played in a much tougher division than the Jets if you are arguing Cassel/Rivers played in a wekaer one, it's only fair to argue Freeman played in a tougher one. Besides this hypothetical pressure, Freeman's 10 was better than Sanchez's 10 but both thier 2010 years seem to be the outliers in their careers. Neither has throws that few INTs in their other 3 years. If you take out game 15 and 16 for FReeman, he still threw for more TDs than Sanchez at a higher percentage. Garrard and Sanchez are pretty similar QB wise that year. Sanchez did a bettre job avoiding INTs, Garrard a better job throwing TDs. Not sure why you are shocked there. He belings in the same grouping Again, I didn't put Eli above Sanchez, just in the same group. That's a misunderstanding. Cutler was on the same level agreed. Fitzpatrick to round out that grouping also makes sense for similar reasons to Garrard. EDIT: Me personally, I have Sanchez in that 12 or 13 spot out of the 12-16 grouping. I don't think that's unreasonable. I think that's fairly accurate how Mark played that year. The key for him was protecting the ball, he just couldn't match the positive output other QBs had while protecting the ball better. EDIT2: I could also be argued into 11 barely, but I don't see how he makes the top 10. I see him as out of that top 10, just didn't have enough positive output. If we include Vick, he bumps Sanchez down a spot.
We'll have similar discussions over Geno and etc. It's a discussion board, there will always be discussions. There will be something, somewhere that two people disagree about or want to discuss about.
Hobbes, do everyone a favor. Stop grouping yourself with junc. It's an embarrassment to junc. You are a Tebot in Jets clothing.
Garbage time isn't just down huge late in games. When down big or up big, throwing early TDs then disappearing late in games. They lost 8 of 9 games in one stretch: -crushed 30-17 to Indy -Up 23-14, lose 29-23. led team to 3 2nd half pts -good game against bad Jax team -fell behind big at Jets, played well late, ahd a chance to end it and failed allowing mark sanchez to win the game -after struggling early again trailing 17-3 he leads them to 24-20 lead, fails to score in 4th and they lose 34-24 -leads big comeback vs. Baltimore, throws INT for TD in OT to lose it -crushed at Ten -up 20-7 against Den, lose 24-23 as he leads O to 6 2nd half pts. Nice fantasy year, bad year. sanchez was better. I mentioned Rivers D b/c in the worst division in the AFC he had the #1 ranked defense and still couldn't even get SD to the playoffs. 38-13 3 tds 41-10 2 TDs 35-14 4 TDs 31-0 2 TDs 34-7 3 TDs garbage time QB, we have seen what he does in January. Flacco had more talent, a better D and threw 5 TDs and 1 INT against Cle. Playing them twice helps. Freeman beat ONE team w/ a winning record all year- NO in week 17 when they were resting players and had nothing to play for(they won 31-6 earlier in the year when they were trying). Racking up meaningless fantasy #s against bad teams means nothing to me. 25 INTs says Eli is below Sanchez. Fitz and Garrard played for bad teams w/ no pressure to win. Let's say you have him 12 or 13, that's pretty close to top 10 which I have been saying all along. You get it, most don't. It's not all about #s.
Moving on is as common for any team a drafting is. Sanchez is going to get a shot. You should be hoping that a QB comes out of this deal confident. Your post is typical Jets fan fare. Lets move on to the next guy. I happen to think that Sanchez will crash and burn, but it doesn't mean that I'm hoping for it. Understanding realistic scenarios doesn't mean that you stop being a fan.
And then, when Geno Smith rolls over, they will cry about why Geno sucks, and some will defend Geno to their grave, and then Jets will move on; wash, rinse, repeat. This fan base gets what they deserve. Simple as that. (LOL)
Sanchez scrambled to his left and basically threw a hail mary. Trying to act like Sanchez did such a fantastic job on that play is funny. Sanchez just threw it up in the Indy game. Edwards is the one that made the adjustment and did a great job to get both feet down in bounds. Sanchez only played well in 1 comeback out of the 4 you listed. Cleveland wasn't a 4th quarter comeback.
It was an excellent play, no one was open, he bought time then gave his playmaker a chance to make a play and if he wasn't interfered with he would have caught the ball. The Indy throw to Edwards was a PERFECT throw Cle wasn't a comeback but he did need to rescue the D after they blew ANOTHER late lead. what a great article to help jog the memories of the folks that hate Sanchez. http://sports.espn.go.com/new-york/nfl/columns/story?columnist=oconnor_ian&id=6004465
Don't get me wrong, I have been annoyed with junc in the past, and also given him shit. But I have also seen him concede arguments, even though it is rare. He did it a day or so ago in this thread. But as unbending as he is, I haven't seen him do some of the empty arguing that Hobbes has done in this thread. And I like Hobbes. But his arguments against Revis and for Sanchez have been avoidable, meaning not worth reading. junc at least attempts to stay consistent in his arguments, although he does stray at times when he is in a corner.
I understand that but IMO you really have to be delusional to defend Sanchez this vehemently when it's obvious that he's a bad QB. Ask any other fans of other teams if they would want Sanchez. Ask any nfl player off the record what they thought of Sanchez. To me this is insane.
I'm not comparing him on just 2012 Hobbes, it's his complete body of work that I'm judging off of, and it's underwhelming. In 2011, your dream season, the jets beat 0 teams with winning records. Additionally, and the numbers are back further in this thread, of Sanchez's redzone TD's only 1, if my memory serves me correctly, came against teams #16 or better in pass defense. and all but 3 came against teams ranked better than #20. In fact in the last 3 regular season games Sanchez led offenses have beaten exactly 3 teams with winning records, 2 in 2010 and 1 in 2012. So yes Sanchez put up a good number of TD's against equally inept defenses....a bottom 1/3 QB beating bottom 1/3 Defenses but getting pretty much shut out by middle of the pack or better defenses. My numbers may be a bit off here, but the full breakdown from the fresh and verified information is back further in this thread. As far as the Schotty thing, I've already admitted I was wrong on that, I used a second hand source for the information and hadn't verified it. Not an excuse, I normally verify information before using it. That time I didn't and got burnt by it. And I'm not excusing myself for using erroneous information, it was my mistake not to verify the data before using it. That Won't happen again.
and again Junc they are not comparable to Sanchez, none of them had been bottom 1/3 of the league QB's by the end of their 4th season of play for their career up to that point. Sanchez has NEVER been above average in any way shape and or form. NEVER, you can call them fantasy stats if you want, but here's the simple truth...looking at stats 90% of the time in any given season the stat leaders will be the ones who successfully reach the playoffs.. They're will always be exceptions. Numbers never lie as a whole, perception does lie...all the time.
In 2011, the jets failed to win a game, where ther werent 24 points on the board. Maybe..,,just maybe, the defense couldnt stop winning teams. Like Denver, 98 yards, a lead 2 minutes left, and a 21 yard td run. When you cant beat teams, unless your offense scores more than 24, you have a defensive problem. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_New_York_Jets_season How many Jers losses in 2011. Did the defense hold a team under 20. 2? Some losing totals...34,34,30,37,45,29.... Yeah....thats a QB problem. 32 scores,2nd in red zone efficiency, for sure too many turnovers, but...get real.
Did he? *I haven't seen that achievement myself - must have been quite a scene, eh?* I don't know about that. When you add Sanchez and Schottenheimer, you'd get just that, no? [The only logical position available to junc is: 1. Schottenheimer did not suck. 2. Sanchez does not suck. 3. It is all defense's fault that Jets did not advance. I have to frown first whenever I see these jokes.] He is always consistent - that much I can agree with. Junc probably won't make a good scientist, but he'll make one hell of a priest.
