I don't know what to tell you then. Stats are stats. Kerley had ___ opportunities and managed more passing yards than Tim. Call it what you want, but that can't be good.
He came to NY because he thought in his mind that he was going to be given an opportunity to win the QB job. It wasn't until they saw him throw in training camp that they realized there was no way they were going to use him in a traditional QB role. The marketing aspect was always secondary. Rex, Tanny and Sparano truly believed Tebow could help them win games with the stupid wildcat package. There really isn't anything more to it than that.
Actually, I had no idea your forum existed until around January when another poster sent me a message saying I would get a kick out of it. Never brought it up here until one of your posters came on here claiming I referenced a topic discussed there... as if Tebow talk isn't happening anywhere else all over the internet Don't blame me for the bannings. As for the comments. I get that you are sticking up for your members. But really, you come off as a hypocrite for calling me out for it, when you have several members on your board doing the same thing to me and others from this site. I doubt it. Backup QB probably mentioned it more than I did when he kept saying I made referrences to a topic there. Honestly, I think there are very few people here that didn't already know about it. The guy that messaged me telling me about it back in January rarely posts in here. Heard it plenty times. I even mentioned to you a post or two back. As for the other QBs... Really? You never seen me say Sanchez sucks? Or Orton sucks? The problem is, by your logic, is that if these guys suck, then that must mean Tebow is better than any of them. No he isn't. and if he wasn't such a flunkie in practice, he might actually beat one of those guys out in camp and convince a coach that he really is the best one they have. If all he does is go out there throwing dirt missiles, you won't find a lot of coaches out there looking at him to run their offense. That is the way it almost always works. Except Tebow DIDN'T "kill it." He was fine as a closer when defenses backed off, but was at the bottom if not close to it for the first 55 minutes. His completion percetage during the first 3 quarters was just above 30% and he strung together several three and out streaks, nearly breaking the streak record 3 times in his 11 starts. If not for the 4th quarter heroics, he wouldn't even be sitting anywhere near 46%. If not for a defense keeping teams to 15 points or less in 5 out of his 8 wins, he'd have been long forgotten like Orton with a career that had maybe 4 wins. He'd be like 4-12. Thank the heavens for running backs going out of bounds, or San Diego kickers missing OT FGs, huh? All these good things people talk about with "his" accomplishments, and yet, the NFL doens't seem all that impressed with it. That is because they aren't taking the win/loss record at face value. They are looking at WHY the record is what it is, and I truly believe the league sees it much the way I do, that many of those wins came in SPITE of his limitations. Nice run, but he needs more than just a little work on his mechanics. Right now he is so far behind the curve for a guy entering his 4th year, most teams probably see him as a bit too much work when they have a whole franchise to run. Let him develop in the CFL or Arena league for awhile and try to come back in a few years. IT HAS BEEN DONE. He did nothing to shy away from it either. Honestly, I think he enjoyed the attention since his high school days. He can't help it, he's a ham. But I also know he believes he is serving a higher power with his exposure and "platform." In many ways, he succeeded too. Seen an ad about how more people were googling John 3:16, and even a commercial was made about it reading that line from the bible. All well and good, and I'm not gonna criticize it one way or the other. However, an owner cutting him a 2 million dollar check really doesn't give a shit and cares about what he is gonna do for them on the field. I truly think the media exposure was the reason he chose New York over Jacksonville. I said at the time (before I came to this site) that the NY media would eat him alive. It did. I do think all this hooplah is what is killing his career. He was a project coming in. McDaniels said so. Urban Mayer said it would take him 3 years. But all that hooplah and circumstances in Denver forced him out there before he was really ready for it. It think if he wasn't rushed out there and got to quietly develop like just about every other project does, he'd be a lot further along. Instead, the hype machine went into overdrive and I think that annoyed his employers and potential employers to no end. I mean, come on. They spent the day celebrating his birthday on ESPN for crissakes!! That is a different story all together. The off field stuff doesn't concern me, though people seem to act like Tebow is the only "good guy" off the field. This whole notion that he is somehow special is what kind of annoys me, cuz there are countless players all over the league doing good things to the community and such, but don't get anywhere near the press for it. I get there are selfish pricks out there too. That is clear... ...and that is probably why few owners want to hand him a 2 million dollar paycheck. Just sayin'. If his real interrests are elsewhere, then that is fine. Go do that then. I know you won't see it that way, but many Tebon... errrr... I mean, Tebow fans have gotten REALLY nasty as well. The namecalling is merely a reflection on the hostilities I received from many of your bretheren. P.S. I would have given Remarker an A+ for the April Fools joke he said he was thinking about doing, by creating a Concerned_Citizen troll over there to freak out some of the members. I seriously spit my drink out on to my monitor. I'm actually disappointed he didn't go through with it.
Then he was a fool for believing so. The Jets had just given Sanchez a rediculous new contract. He was also coming off of two AFC Championship appearances. Some say he was carried there (funny how they deny Tebow got carried as well) but that was what he was up against with the New York choice. But then you have to consider Sanchez was Rex's guy, which was well known even before.... tatoogate. Then in the other corner, you had Jacksonville, and owner who clearly loved the idea of having him. Had a fanbase that loved him, which no doubt would have lobbied like crazy to get Tebow in there at starter... and his biggest competition would have been.... Blaine Gabbert. (Maybe Henne as well.) Jacksonville was also pretty much in full rebuild mode and much better position to add pieces more fitting to Tebow's game. 95% of us if put in Tebow's position would have considered both the above and concluded our chances would have been much better in Jacksonville. But again, Tebow chose the bright lights of New York, in his own words it had to do with his "platform" and now (I am 99.999% certain) regrets the decision.
Tim picked the Jets because NY provided a bigger platform. If Tim truly thought he had a better shot at beating a 2-time AFCCG participant that led his team to beat Tom Brady and Peyton Manning in playoff road games and recently signed a large extension, then it makes Tim look like a fool and reinforces his lack of knowledge of the pro game. You aren't doing Tim any favors by trying to make excuses and cover for him...
If Tebow fans have their own forums, why bother with the message boards of existing fans? If Tebow lovers don't want to be mocked, insulted, etc, I don't understand why they seek it out. This is further proof that Tebow fans are fanatical and self righteous in a manner that suggests they like Timmy for lots of reasons unrelated to football.
You are very correct sir! He was given the impression that if there was a chance, he would get a shot at competing for the starting position. I believe Rex believed enough in the wild cat when the trade happened. But as you correctly pointed the wild cat imploded on itself.
Plus, they saw Tim practice. I bet there is a reason NFL contracts don't guarantee playing time...I bet it has something to do with the players' ability to earn their playing time. I know that is a crazy, hateful idea that must have only come to be after Tim was drafted and never, ever before. If it's not that, then it must be because everyone in the NFL is a jealous, hateful liar who only got involved with football in their youths to destroy Timmy's career. That doesn't sound crazy, right?
JK, I had a little rant there. The honest answer could also be that Tim was the second best option on the roster to run the wildcat. Jeremey Kerley threw for more yards than Tim and no one's season ended when Kerley ran it. No one in the Jets probably thought that would happen but then the season came and they learned what John Fox, Josh McDaniels, and John Elway and 38% of 180 NFL players already knew.
Pretty much. That would apply to just about everyone in the league. Show me what you got in practice, and we'll see about getting you into a game. He stinks it up all over the place in practice... and his zealots seem to think the coach should hand him a few free starts anyway. What other third string caliber passer gets that kind of a favor unless disaster strikes? One article in Denver said Tebow was actually the 4th best passer on the roster. That even Adam Weber showed signs of being a better passer. That was on a roster with Quinn and Orton too. Looking like a similar conclusion was drawn by the Jets coaching staff too. One good look at him in an OTA... Tebow is made a punt protector. Tebow would have probably gotten more plays as a RB, but he thinks he's a QB and eventually made that clear to Rex.
If you guys want to discuss Tebow that's fine. If this continues to be a back and forth shit show I'm going to close the thread.
It's obvious you aren't a Jets fan and weren't paying attention to the team during the 2011 season. But in a way I understand how you are looking at it because Sanchez was given a contract extension. On the surface it appeared that Tebow had no shot to be the QB, however, at the end of the 2011 season cracks in the relationship between Mark and the coaching staff began to show. It was quite obvious that Rex and Tanny were looking to bring in a QB to compete with Sanchez or replace him altogether if Peyton wanted to come here. The Sanchez contract extension was a hasty reaction to not signing Manning. But it was clear that Mark was being put on notice that his play in 2011 was unacceptable and if someone better came along then Sanchez could easily be replaced. When Rex met with Tebow he informed him that although Mark is the starter, if you outplay him then you will play. Tebow having played against Sanchez in 2011 and beating him knew full well how awful Sanchez ended the season. He knew that the fans started to turn on him and all he had to do was wait it out and eventually he would get his shot to start. The problem was he fell out of favor in training camp when the coaching staff realized he couldn't throw. Then the season began and we blew out Buffalo. Things were looking up again for Sanchez, while the plays that Sparano put in for Tebow did not work. The Buffalo game was fools gold because soon after that Sanchez went into the toilet and so did the entire team. When Sanchez finally played himself out of the starting QB spot, Tebow was hurt. The coaching staff did jerk Tebow around. The plays they ran for him were awful and he was put into the game at the wrong time over and over again. Rex and Sparano embarrassed him because the coaching staff did not properly prepare a package for him and used him when Sanchez actually was on a roll. Horrible timing all year long. I blame Rex and Sparano for that. Two clowns who had no clue how to run an offense. The "platform" was secondary. You don't get a platform if you aren't on the field. Eventually that runs out. He came to NY because he thought he could beat out Sanchez for the job, or at least wait him out until he stunk up the joint and Rex had no choice but to put him in. It did play out that way, but Tebow got hurt and McElroy stepped in and looked halfway decent. Rex had no choice but to start McElroy in that game.
You are so ridiculous in these picked apart posts. Regardless, proves the point right here that you love fishing around and bringing it back up. Like you have mentioned in other places around this forum, you like picking fights with people for the joy of it. So, there again CC... your calling the kettle black. By your own admission. Wasn't blaming you at all. Just pointing out you have benefitted from it greatly by making sure all this ridiculous level Tebow hate keeps being spread. Tit for tat my friend. Tit for tat. If that is your argument, then we both are hypocrites. I am not going to stop someone for having an opinion. That is their right. And you are right... I will go to bat for my members. Honestly, you sound like a child tattling on his brother to his mother right here. You found your way to us no matter what the circumstance was in your bizarre quest to prove every Tebow fan wrong. The funny thing with you to me at least: is that you are always talking about how annoying Tebow fans are, but yet are always poking at them to go a few rounds and then bitch when people come back to counter strike your points. Either have fun debating back and forth or leave. My point... you spend all day saying the same thing you just said everyday. Give us something new here... because your points are getting old and rusty. We get it CC... Tim does need to work on his throwing motion. I do think Tim Tebow is much better then Kyle Orton. Orton didn't get the job done and was pulled and then replaced by Tim who jump started the team he was on to bring them to the playoffs. Orton is not near what Tim can do. If that was the case, Tim would still be riding the pony in Denver with Orton leading. Simple as that. That was proven. Moving on. Regarding Sanchez, he is his own worst nightmare. It didn't matter who was sitting behind him... Sanchez puts enough pressure on himself. Since Tim is currently ranked higher than Mark, since you like to go by stats all the time, there again my point that Tebow is currently better stands true. You are always arguing numbers and that is what the cold hard facts are. What else is there to say about that? I wish Mark stayed another year in college to develop so that he could have come out better mentally and physically. The kid ha it going for him and got to distracted himself. If your going to argue that Tim got swallowed up by NY, then the same stands for Mark. A win is a win! LOL You guys and all this crap... the kid won games. I love how all the talking heads can sit here and talk about how a ball is thrown. They yell it looks ugly. It's football. This is not the Lady's free skate at the olympics where artsy is part of winning. You put the ball in the endzone and win. The Broncos did that. It doesn't matter how he and his team got there. Thats what football is about. How many games this past post season came down to mere seconds? Several! You can play your heart out in the first quarter all you want, but these football games are being determined with seconds to go. Like I said, a win is a win. How many times did we all see games where one team was blowing the other team out of the water, only to beat in the last part of the game? Tebow is not the only QB or team to score the win in the last seconds. Tebow is not the only one in the league that takes a while to get into the game. There again, don't see you picking those teams or players apart every day regarding their mechanics or poor timing. I don't doubt any of what your saying here. If you would stop shouting at people and let them actually agree/disagree with you, you would notice that all these Tebow fans that you claim think none of this is true are saying otherwise. You read a few fan posts on ESPN and other sites that allow commenting and right away think every fan of Tebow's thinks none of what you just said. As you have mentioned, you have visited my site. Well, this exact topic that you mentioned has been and is being talked about. But sense you are so concerned about seeing your own name in blinking lights, you failed to notice that. Or maybe you did and still won't acknowledge that. And trust, even if Tim steps away from the NFL and goes elsewhere for a year or two to develop... I know he will come back and win big. For someone who doesn't give two whatevers about Tim's off the field activities, you do know a lot about them. Many athletes earn that extra buck by doing speaking engagements. Many football players have a similar packed schedule each off season and I have never seen it used against them. But for Tebow that is different? I find that funny. I will agree some better research should have gone into some of the appearances to avoid backlash that was not necessary: but could have, should have. I am not even going to get into that because it is not worth the argument over that situation. I will respectfully disagree with you on this completely. He would have gotten exposure wherever he went. NYC or not. The kid isn't even in NYC right now and still has the media falling him around. The New York media did not eat him. In fact he played them very well I may add. Not once did Tebow sink to other players' levels while they threw him under the bus. He spoke directly to the media and laid it out. If you think him ignoring the media meant them winning, I will again have to respectfully disagree. As a Tebow fan, even I didn't know ESPN celebrated his birthday and why I am a bite surprised is funny! Can't stand ESPN... they have become to gossipy for me to take anything serious. I tend to watch the NFL Network. I as well wish the media didn't latch on to him as fast as they did. I don't believe Tebow himself can be blamed for that. I think everyone around him knew the public would love him/hate him right away and ran with it. I don't think Tim is the 'only' good guy off the field. What ticks me off is that people assume his fans think he is the only other Christian player out there doing well. Hello, Drew Brees. Kurt Warner. I love those guys. The Texans really impress me in how they all seem to go out of their way to their fans. Once again if you see how the media follows him around you would understand he doesn't always want them there. At a recent speaking engagement the media ran to his event and his handlers basically told them to go elsewhere because it was a private charity event. Pretty much they bashed the kid for making sure the priority was on the charity and not them. Go figure. Once again CC, tit for tat. It's a two way street. Is that always the right? No. But nobody is perfect. Not you. Not I. I wouldn't be so quick to think all fans are exactly the same. I could easily make a quick judgement about this forum if I only stayed in this section. If I based what I see in this section as whole for all Jets fans, I would think your all a little too jacked up on hate for one guy who is a team member for the Jets. Other sections of this forum has great discussions without the some of the disgusting wordage used by some of the 'leaders' in this group. Ha! You make good fodder, what can I say?
*eye roll* The Jags stink. I wouldn't want to be placed there if I had the chance/choice. The owner is such a joke. I don't even know if he knows what football actually is.
THIS! I wish the injury hadn't happened because they would have had to play Tebow. But it did. I really hope the GM can get Rex and Co. back in a good spot. My Dad has been following the Jets since Namath and every year I hope they win the SB so Dad gets to see them win again. :smile: I really wished the Tebow thing worked out for them. But everyone saw it a mile away it wasn't going to work out.
Tim came to New York because the bigger city was a better place to promote his brand. Tim may have also thought he could start but that had more to do with his parents and fans constantly filling his head with the idea that he deserves a starting job regardless of merit. The plays only looked terrible because Tim was running them. Plenty of long gains and TDs have come from runs up the middle and play action. There was nothing inherently shitty about the plays except for the guy taking the snaps. You can't call exotic pass plays with multiple routes for Tim or you get what you saw against the Lions in 2011 or Mark Sanchez for the whole year.
I am going to have to disagree. Everyone knew Tim was going to run up the middle. You could call the play right when he stepped on the field. With everyone knowing that no other route was going to be taken, there was no way for the ball to get moved down the field.
That is so far out of bounds as to what is going on, I wouldn't know where to start. Never once did I "bitch" about people making a counter point. I just find some of your guys's takes hilarious is all, and think they deserve to be called out. I really don't care what you believe about me on the personal stuff. You are obviously gonna believe what you want. I just don't get why instead of countering points, you guys gotta call names and question peoples motives, which has been done by your ilk from day one. Either: 1. Agree with what is written 2. Disagree. or 3. Go pound sand!!! Not sure why you are complaining about my comments. It isn't as if your comments on a daily basis are new stuff. Something like, "poor Timmy, getting a raw deal." "haters" "46% completion doesn't matter" ...and sometimes funny ones like the one in my sig. Back on Topic for football, cuz this personal crap is getting old. Who cares? NONE of the above pass the eye test. Stats can be spun in any direction, but they don't prove who is better than who. Why? Just because one had better blockers and/or receivers makes him a better QB with all else being equal? Yep. games were won with him in the game. If it were simple as that, then you'd think Orton was actually a better QB since he actually had a pretty stellar record in Chicago. The Jets made the AFC Championship game TWICE in his first 3 seasons. So does that same logic apply to Sanchez as you are giving Tebow? Record wise, Sanchez is better. Sure, a win is a win. That isn't the point though. Moving forward a team has to evaluate how games were won. The inevitable question always will come up, "how does one go about winning?" Then they look at the tapes and see Tebow stink it up for most of the day, see the defense carry him, and then watch the game get won on some lucky break, which wouldn't have mattered without a defense holding their end of the bargain pretty much the ENTIRE game. It IS different. Most of those other guys do have the speaking engagments, but most of them have done pretty well earning their job. Most of them ARE stars in this league. Tebow? Well, many people aren't even sure if he is a QB. He is a DEEPLY flawed passer, and that doesn't look like it has improved much.... if at all. It is one reason he didn't get any game time at regular QB, and I believe it is one of the glaring reasons teams aren't exactly tripping over themselves with glee over getting Tebow. If he were so great and teams though he might be, they'd be trading first rounders for him like they did with guys like Kolb, or Palmer. Check out the deal for Matt Cassell a few years back. Jay Cutler? So why is he spending so much time giving speeches and appearances? Time is running out on improving his skillset. NFL will only wait so long as every year more new young studs are coming through the college ranks. So THAT is where my criticism is and why it is different. There will be plenty of time for celebrity appearances AFTER he salvages his career. Why no love for Tebow from the league if he deserved even HALF the credit you guys seem to think he deserves for what happened in 2011? Where would he have had the bigger platform? New York or Jacksonville? Cuz I think you are kidding yourself if you think it would be the same. Sure, ESPN would have been drooling over him no matter where. But everybody knows New York will always have the bigger spotlight in general. Besides, Tebow himself said it gave a bigger platform. This is why he chose them. http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...-bottom-with-their-tebow-birthday-celebration Yep, I kinda wish ESPN would rename themselves to TTSPN and get it over with. People always assume I hate the guy because of his religious beliefs.... even though it is impossible to find ONE post of me criticizing that. I can't tell you how many times a Teboner called me some sort of a religious bigot after blasting Tebow for his passing ability. It kind of gave me an idea.... Thinking about marketing Concerned Citizen halloween costumes. Guaranteed to scare any Tebow Fanatic. Skip Bayless would love it.
