The averages themselves are an exact science. How you want to look at them depends on how fair you want to judge something. If a running back has a 500 yard season one year, an 850 yard season the next, a 1400 yard season the next, his average season would be 916 yards a season. Let's say his offensive line was banged up the next year, and he followed that 1400 yard season up with a 650 yard season. You could say that is well below his average per season of 916, and blame it on the offensive line. I would look at his other 2 season of 850, and 500 and say that 650 isn't really that much different. Since he had 3 out of 4 seasons of 850 or less yards, I would say that would be the type of back he is, not the 1400 yard back he was 1 out of 4 seasons. Yes, it is a factual statement, but one that is skewed by his career high TD passes 2011. A total that was 65% higher than his previous career high. Even though it skews the numbers, I included them in the average, and Sanchez 2012 season was not much different from his career average. No QBs average is ever going to predict what his numbers will be the next year. QBs stats often fluctuate up and down every year. The fact that Mark's 2012 numbers were as close as they were to his average is very telling. Let me give you one more example. From 2005 to 2007, Tom Brady averaged 33 TDs a season. In 2009, he had 28 TDs. That is 5 less than what he averaged the previous 3 season. You would say that was way below his average. I take into account the fact that he threw 50 TDs in 2007, which was 52% more than the best of his previous 2 seasons. That skewed his average. His total of 28 is much closer to what he has produced each season throughout his career than the total of 50 he had one year. No one is diminishing the fact that injuries played a part in Mark's poor season. But it isn't the sole reason. The main reason is that Mark isn't a very good QB. He has shown that in his 4 seasons. Like I said before, every QB numbers will vary from their average every year. That is what makes it an average. Sanchez threw 79% more TDs in 2011 than he averaged the other 3 seasons. That skews things. Even with that much of an increase, he was still only 5.3 off his career average. That is not that much of a difference. His interceptions and completion percentage were nearly identical. Since a QBs numbers will always vary from his average, Mark's 2012 numbers are incredibly close. That tells me that even though we had injuries that certainly made a difference, it didn't make as much of a difference as you guys want to believe. I would say that you will learn that as you watch Mark some more, but I don't believe you will. If you haven't seen it by now, you probably never will. There will always be an excuse ready from the Sanchez fanboys.
It may not be worse, but it sure as hell wont be much better. Goodson might be an upgrade out of the backfield, but he's a huge question mark as a runner. He has durability issues and fumbling problems. He could be a gem, but at the same time he could be Joe McKnight 2.0. Colon isnt a huge upgrade... Slauson and Moore were serviceable, but not great. PFF graded both with positive grades. Moore had a 21 and Slauson a 2.5. Yeah Moore was on the decline, but his play still has to be replaced. Colon was cut from the Steelers, a team that has been shuffling around that OL for as long as I can remember. He once again has injury concerns, and is nothing more than a one or two year stop gap (assuming he can stay healthy). And although Keller was out for most of the season, he was Sanchez's favorite target. No upgrade there. Even if we go offensive heavy in the draft, they are still going to have to develop, adjust to the NFL and learn a brand new system. Say hypothetically we draft 3 offensive players in the first 4 rounds. Do you honestly think all of them will step in and be big contributors year one? We will be lucky if one of them can... So yes, like I said, I dont see this offense being much more talented that last year. Many of you Sanchez apologists believe that he can get better and that the franchise still believes in him... But if they still had hope in him, wouldnt they be doing everything in their power to significantly improve the offense, even with the cap restrictions, in order to save his career? Btw, I think the team is handling it the way it should- embracing rebuild mode and trying to just add some competition while trying to fix the cap.
The team wants Sanchez to succeed not fail. The team also understands that Sanchez played well enough upto the NE game to keep his job. The team also knows the offensive issues where much bigger than Sanchez. Most rational objective people also realize the Jets offensive woes where mostly not on Sanchez especially the first 10 games. What kills me is people think that a JAG like Kolb, Garrard, Flynn, Campbell would have performed much better than Sanchez last year is delusional. The Jets will be better on offense for one good reason they can't really be anyworse. They just get healthy they are better. Every receiver let me say it again louder EVERY RECEIVER on the Jets was hurt last season. Pete Carroll MS troubles are about the Jets not Mark. That is the reality of the situation. Until that is fixed no QB will come in here and light it up. The Jets will be better from coaching, health and maturity. Last four games Mark played in he threw eight interceptions Seven in Two games he threw 10 in the previous 11. Fans just remember AZ and TN. He never recovered from the beating he took after the "Butt" fumble fair or not that destroyed him last year mentally. We will see if he rebounds.
Simple question..,lyou said draft heavy on offense? What holes are you trying to fill? Youhave at least 5 legit WRs,3backs, a QB,and an OL, thT only lacks depth, with...i might add, has Moore and Slauson, both on the unemployment line.,,and will re sign for the Vet minimum before the draft. The dirty word that no one os discussiong is COLLUSION. The owners have quietly decided to stop overpaying for non talent. Vollmer,unemployed,Freeny,unemployed,Abraham, unemployed, moore, unemployed,Slauson, unemployed,Aso,unemployed.,,,seeing a pattern here? You can field an expansion team this year that makes the playoffs, with 40 guys making Vet minimum. PS. Cumberland will yield more plays than Keller, this year.
I never suggested that averages predict exact figures for next year, but they can tell you whether Sanchez has had above or below average seasons compared with his average. You also have to keep in mind that average for Sanchez is doodoo for most other QBs in the league, which is why people think 2012 was the same as the other years when it was worse. Of course there are more factors involved than simply one person. So if Sanchez throws 26+ TDs next year, will you say 2011 AND 2013 skewed his average? Or will you say 2012 AND 2009 skewed the average because they were so bad? You have to realize his career is only 4 years deep. Each and every season weighs heavily on his average at this point. If he continues to stink it up, it will become more apparent, but he could just as easily have a bounce back season with a better offensive system and put up another 2011 like season where he's a top 10 TD guy again. We know he is capable, but he's gotta reduce turnovers at all costs. I don't understand how you can take his 32 total TDs (rushing included because he earned them), and just act like they had nothing to do with him. "It's a fluke!". Oh really? Despite the fact that only 1 WR that played with Sanchez in 2011, played a full (or near full) season with him in 2012. I'm agreeing that Sanchez ceiling is an average at best QB, but as a franchise we could have done a lot better providing him with weapons, and keeping those weapons consistent. Good defense plus average QB can get it done. Playmakers matter. I want him to succeed, obviously, for the sake of the team, but I'm not a fanboy. I stopped defending him midway through last season. I was just trying to clear up the misconceptions that the other guy was promoting as average that indeed had nothing to do with averages. Again, I have already stated that average for Sanchez is poor for most other QBs. We've seen flashes of him being very good, however, so I reserve full judgement until our offense as a whole gets fixed. It certainly wasn't just Sanchez, but yeah he was a big part of it.
How do you infer that the organization believes Mark is still the future? If a player that didnt turn the ball over as much as Mark did, we might have one a game or two more. With an average QB, we might be sitting at 9-7. Its not that difficult to understand. A QB that turns the ball over half as much as Mark does and we are a sitting at a better record. Btw, Jeremy Kerley was not hurt. Im pretty sure the only receivers that were hurt were Holmes, Keller and an extremely raw rookie in Hill. Its a shitty situation for any QB, no doubt, but he has to show some glimpses of hope and leadership. Mike Westhoff also stated that he thinks the team has to be built back up along with Sanchez in order for him to progress... IMO, the team is not being built back up to the point where Mark Sanchez will turn into a franchise QB. He's take too many steps back recently, I just dont think its possible, especially considering the team embracing rebuild mode. Also, you should look at fumbles... because he did have 8 of those also. In those first 10 games, he had at least 2 turnovers in 5 games. He only didnt turn the ball over in 2 out of those 10 games. Out of the entire season? Those two games where still the only ones he didnt turn the ball over. 10 out of 15 weeks he turned the ball over at least twice.
You are going to have to learn how to type, because its difficult trying to decipher your posts... What are the holes on offense? Hmmm... Who are those 5 legit WRs? Kerley? Yes. Holmes? Coming off of a major foot surgery, has major character concerns and most likely will be cut after this season. Hill? Terrible rookie season, extremely raw and coming off of surgery. Who else? no one. So since the team at this point has to look towards the future, yes there's a need here. If Hill doesnt work out, there could be a need for 2 receivers. This organization has to start trying to fill holes before they open up like the Steelers, Patriots, 49ers, Ravens ect. No more patch work. TE? Just lost your fan boys favorite target to the Dolphins leaving Jeff Cumberland as the #1 TE. An UDFA who cant block and is nothing more than a JAG. Our #2 TE is a former Rugby player... Yeah, I would say there's a hole there. OL? Mangold and Brick are great, but they are no longer spring chickens. Howard played well, but isnt a sure thing to improve. Ducasses showed improvement in a man blocking scheme, but still has a long ways to go, especially with another change in scheme. Colon is nothing more than a stop gap. He has injury problems and is still a question mark. Best case scenario, we need to draft a guard in the middle rounds. Worst case, we need two starting guards within a year. RB... Hmmm... So we sign a guy who has been Joe McKnight 2.0 his entire career and now its not a need? Ill say this once more, but if we somehow drafted Doug Martin last year, Mark Sanchez's career might look differently. Goodson is a solid signing with upside, but he in no way should change your approach in the draft. Joe McKnight will likely get cut. Powell is a decent #2 that isnt anything special and doesnt provide much in the passing game. We still dont have a #1 back. Whats a QB's best friend? A great run game. Just ask your buddy Mark. In conclusion- #1 TE, #1 RB, WR, G... and I havent even mentioned the QB position. Its laughable that you dont think the offense needs much, yet half of your argument is based on the fact that Sanchez isnt surrounded by talent. Make up you damn mind.
Mark's career average compared to other QBs average has nothing to do with judging his 2012 season compared to his previous 3. No one has ever said that 2012 wasn't a below average season for Sanchez. We just disagree that 2012 was so much different than previous seasons and blame it on injuries. The fact is, his 2012 season was not far off of what he averaged the previous seasons. And that includes the season in which he increased his career high of TDs 65%. With that included, he had 5 fewer TDs, 4 more fumbles and 1 more interception. Completion percentage was a difference of 0.8. Yes, all are below his career average, but not by much. Since you know that numbers will vary from an average regardless, I don't understand why you can't see how close his numbers really are to his career average. Since you would have 2 of each, we wouldn't know which seasons skewed which. The following years in the future would tell us. I'm going on what we already know. We have 1 season out of 4 with a respectable TD total. When 75% of his career is in the 12 to 17 TD range, and only 25% with 26 TDs, that tells me that 2011 was the aberration, not 2012. Didn't Sanchez only have 1 WR that played with him in 2010, play a full season with him in 2011? Wasn't the play calling awful in 2011? Wasn't the O-line awful in 2011? I'm not taking away his 26 TDs in 2011. I'm just taking into account that it was 65% higher than his career high in any of his previous seasons. It was 1 season out of 4. I can't tell you the exact reason for the increase in TDs. I do know Mark got a lot of easy TD throws to Plax in 2011. 3 came from 4 or less yards in the SD game alone. Playmakers matter, play calling matters, but you can still tell what kind of QB you have regardless. Wanting him to succeed and making excuses for why he hasn't are two different things. I want my QB to make the players around him better. I don't want a QB who needs a great team around him just to be an average QB. Sanchez is the latter.
Couple of things here, first the fact that Sanchez had 10 Int's going into December is not a good thing - it's not something to hold up as a counter-weight to how badly he played in 4 games in December. Secondly, that's a very selective reading of how badly Sanchez has played since the midpoint of 2011. To be equally selective I could point out that from the beginning of December 2011 to the beginning of December 2012 Mark Sanchez threw 17 Int's in 16 starts. He then threw 8 Int's in December of 2012. The Butt Fumble was very unfortunate for Sanchez and the Jets. It perfectly encapsulated a QB who was not mentally prepared to be on the field, did not execute well after the mental lapse occurred and as a result turned the ball over at an inopportune moment. The beating that Sanchez took in the media and in popular culture for the play was a normal outcome of looking like an idiot on the field when the public perception of you was that you were not that smart with the football to begin with. It really is not fair at this point but life is not fair. Sanchez had opportunities with the Jets and just fumbled them away. It's hard to recover from that. We have fresh eyes on the situation at this point and for that we should be thankful. John Idzik has no investment in Mark Sanchez at all and so if Sanchez is still here at the start of camp at least we'll know that he's not there because somebody is too embarrassed to cut him. I do think keeping him around is a real disservice to Rex though. It's like keeping a bottle of bourbon in the cupboard when somebody who is known to be too fond of the stuff is living with you.
I'm right with you. I had a lot of typos in my post, glad you understood it. I can't multi-task too well.
wait wait wait wait wait!!!!! did hobbes who has been singing mark suffered because he didnt have any weapons just say that we dont have any needs on offense? did i read that right? have i lost my mind? didnt he just say a few days ago that mark was on target but the receivers couldnt get separation or ran the wrong routes, which one it is i am sure he doesnt know...
When Rex starts Sanchez this season , and he will. I hope that the boos from Metlife are so loud on the first offensive play that Mark has to call a timeout. Then after the 3 and out Mark is known for, the crowd just leaves and goes home. It will take something this epic for Woody to realize Rex and Mark are fucking disasters that he has to get rid of.
Another thought on Mark since we seem to be stuck with him.... 90% of a QB's success starts between the ears with confidence and mental frame of mind. In 2012 he came in with high expectations based on him leading the NFL in red-zone efficiency and TDs. 2012 was supposed to be some kind of break out year for him, high expectation. 2013? Not so much. Instead of playing the savior roll where he was supposed to carry the team, he'll be playing the huge underdog role shocking the world if he throws more TDs than INTs. Having the 'savior role' lifted from his shoulders may mean something.
Apparently... Best part is, is that he probably wont respond to the post. You know how he doesnt respond to posts if the make a fool out of him... So in his mind, the injury to Holmes was the only thing hindering Sanchez last year from a depth chart perspective. Because apparently the Jets dont have needs at TE (and are in the same position as last year right now), WR because we apparently have 5 legit receivers who were all on the team last year (Holmes and Hill were only ones injured and Hill was an extremely raw rookie who you couldnt expect much from), RB and OL. So please Hobbes, choose one of the other- the Jets have many needs on offense OR never again use the argument that Sanchez was held back last year because of who was around him. You are just running in circles at this point. Your argument is severely flawed. Im not sure whether to call you a Sanchez apologist, or a Jets homer.
Or... His confidence is shot due to the last year and a half of poor play. Like you said, 90% of a QB's success starts between his ears with confidence and mental frame of mind... The person I saw on the field last year had no confidence and no leadership abilities. In NY, that is a very hard thing to regain. He may improve his footwork and mechanics with better coaching, but Im not sure if mentally he can come back.
thats just mindblowing.... i know he is a big it was the coaching guy... he thinks morningwood will be the savior but i do remember him saying mark had no weapons when junc was on that kick... i wonder where junc is these days... watch this... herm edwards sucks, and so does mark sanchez 4.. 3... 2....1...
Mark Sanchez could have Brandon Marshall and Andrew Johnson at WR, it would not matter, the guy is total dog shit. He would find a way to fumble away the game, and the season, and bring down the rest of the players around him. He is a disgrace to football and should never play again. If he is cut June 1st, as I hope he will be, no NFL team will pick him up, because he is dog shit.
