Read what I said again. Even without Santonio and Sanchez contract, (so you can say I am looking a year ahead.) Jets will still be burdened with at least 6 guys making 10+M in the given fiscal year. (This is YOUR idea. Not mine. Ok? I've been saying these guys were overpaid for some time.) That is a good 60M of salary cap right there. If you add 14.5M for the rest 29 guys, then 2M for punters and whatnot, you get some 77M. You will have less than 40M to distribute among 15 starters. That is, WITHOUT Santonio and Sanchez contract, and without considering the dead money. If Jets restructure and move some of the money to the future? Jets will have slightly more for this year, but you bet Jets will have even less money for the rest in the coming years. The rest of the starter roster will get some 3.5~4.5M per head only if there is some left to share. That means, you cannot give out these stupid contracts just because you deem them that way. Even with 6 of these stupid contracts - that's, about 20M less, by the way - (I know you didn't bother checking the salary cap structure of other teams. You wouldn't spew out a stupidity of this magnitude if you did.) giving sensible salary to starters is near impossible. Go check other team's salary structure. For umpteenth time. I dare you to find a team with 6-7 10M guys on their roster except the Jets. This is why I have been advocating the idea to trade either Revis or Cro, or even both, provided Jets get a good enough of compensation out of it. Seeing that Revis will want exorbitant contract at some 14-15M, I find it rather sensible to move him than risking the future of the entire organization. If he doesn't get what he wants, he will walk anyway. He has behaved that way in the past, and I have absolutely no reason to believe he will change his tunes this time around. (Just what the hell are you thinking?) And as much as you don't want minimum wage players starting next year, I am even more sick and fed up with the Jets stuck in cap hell, and fielding borderline street free agent caliber players all over the roster because they have to give out these stupid money to select few players, leaving only peanuts on their hand to give out to the rest of the roster. P.S. And all right. The said player may be willing to restructure, as long as he does not take any pay cut along the way. I can give you that. Now, why will the team want to mortgage the future? Isn't what they have gone through the past two years enough of a learning experience? Not having an eye for a talent? Talent or not, 1. you do not give out stupid contract and 2. you can't keep on restructuring to get by the day. Period. Ok? Quite obviously, when they re-did the contracts and whatever from 2008 and on, they must have concluded the talent level, and the future performances were justified - no? Now, what kind of guarantee do we have to even think that will not happen with all six of the stupid contracts? Who is to say what happened in the past few years will not happen with the other six contracts?
Just keep him? Ok. We'll just keep revis. Easy as that. Why don't we give him $14M a yr for the next 7 and tuck him in at night. We're stacked as is.:breakdance: Except of course, when he thinks our offer is lowballed and decides to walk (that free agency thing), then we can't keep him and we don't get properly compensated. oh no's!
Revis is not going anywhere this year. If he does, Jets take on an additional $3mil cap hit, leaving us with $12mil of cap space. That's what I'm thinking. You're think our problems can be solved with $12mil in cap space and 20+ players to resign. If cut, Cro saves us $1.25mil (please don't infer I'm saying we cut him). Im not sure what it saves us if he's traded as I do not know his exact guarantee money distribution. My guess is, he might save around $7mil if traded. Problem is, Revis will leave next year and if we trade away Cro this year, we'll have nobody worthy of starting CB next year (I don't want Kyle "I wave my finger when the wide open receiver drops a pass" Wilson to be my #1). We'll lose Landry as well. Our secondary, by far the biggest strength of this team, will become the biggest weakness on a team that can't stop the run and don't have a starting caliber LB besides Harris. Im sort of split on Cro, but the only reason I'd be willing to part ways with Cro is if we extend Revis. Need one or the other and the way Cro played, we might as well let him finish his contract here at far less money than Revis. Minimum wage will bring u "borderline street FA caliber players all over the roster". To sign 20+ players with $15mil, you are looking at a long list of minimum wage players, something u n I don't want. The only possible solution is to restructure a few contracts. Moving $15 mil the next 2-3 years won't be as much of a burden in those years as accounting for the $15mil this year. Again, unless u have an elite QB, you have to sign star players at other positions to make up for it or go in to a full blown rebuild mode. If thats what you want, then its best to off load Revis, Cro, Santonio and maybe even Harris for picks. Jets aren't in rebuild mode. They might try to rebuild part of the offense, but not the entire team. We are in a mess because: 1. We restructured AND guaranteed a year for Pace and Scott 2. We extended Sanchez to a ridiculous deal he did not deserve, even at the time. 3. We should have cut ties with Holmes last year when we had a chance. Explanation 1. You never restructure AND guarantee base salaries to aging vets. 2. You never extend an average QB at the time to elite QB money. 3. If we had cut Holmes last year, we could have had almost $12mil extra in cap space (his savings in 2012 rolled in to 2013, and his entire 2013 cap hit savings). You see where I'm going? Restructuring contracts isn't what got us into this mess. Its restructuring aging vets while guaranteeing contracts. I want us to restructure non-aging players while not guaranteeing contracts. Those two players received guarantees because they took a paycut in 2011. Im not asking for paycuts. Paycut means you have to offer an incentive in return. There is a method to this madness and you will find out. If Jets don't restructure contracts this year, I will nominate myself for the "least knowledgeable poster of TGG, alltime" award. If they do, would u do the same? You seem confident.
Question, and didn't want to start a new thread. Revis has $9 Million in pro-rated option bonus that will be accelerated to the 2014 cap hit if he reports to the team this year. In addition, he is free to sign with any team that he likes. I believe this is pretty well talked about. If we were to resign him, and lets use the Nnamdi contract as a point of discussion. 5 year 60 million and for easy figuring, $12 Million per year, right? Does that mean that his cap hit in 2014 will be $21 Million?
On June 1st, if Revis is still with the team, the $9M remaining in pro-rated bonus money will be locked onto the 2014 cap. This assuming that the Jets and Revis do nothing to renegotiate the deal that changes the number of years. This assuming that Revis reports to the Jets in 2013 and does not give up his right to opt out of the last 3 years of the existing contract. If the Jets reworked the deal with Revis to add 5 years and $60 million to it from 2014 to 2018 then the cap hit for 2014 would likely be somewhere between $10.8M and $13.8M. This assuming at the low end that the Jets gave Revis a $40M bonus and a $1M salary for 2014 (prorated bonus = $49M/5 or $9.8M a year + $1M salary = $10.8M cap figure) and at the high end that the Jets gave Revis a $40M bonus and an average year of salary for the deal in 2014 (prorated bonus = $49M/5 or $9.8M a year + $4M salary = $13.8M cap figure.) If the Jets let Revis go in free agency and then re-signed him at 5 years and $60 million the cap hit for 2014 will necessarily be higher, since the Jets will have the full $9M dead money from the old deal on the cap as well as whatever the new contract creates. In that situation, and using the same parameters as above, Revis has a $18M cap figure at the low end and a $21M cap figure at the high end. The difference for the Jets is that the $9M in dead money all hits the cap in 2014 in that scenario and is not pro-rated onto future caps. It makes Revis cap hit higher for the year but lower in future seasons. My gut tells me that if Darrelle Revis is not signed by the end of camp that it will be very hard for the Jets to keep him. As he proves he can still play during the season his price will likely stabilize at what he believes the market maximum to be and then we'll all have to wait to see if that projection is correct or not after he hits the market.
Whether or not you consider the transaction as a new contract or an extension, it is a new contract. You can't redistribute the $9 Million, and therefore can't use your equations. The $9 Million is already payed and considered. (I don't believe the NFL does addendum's, but would be interested in a link if so) Therefore, his hit will be significantly higher than $13 Million. Also, the Jets may consider 2 players for after post-June 1st players if released or traded prior to June 1st (this is important for roster bonuses). In this case, it doesn't matter when we release or trade Revis he will be considered on the roster after June 1st. I bring this up to confirm assumptions that Revis will be a June 1st player regardless, and his 2014 hit will not affect our cap space this year. (see link below, even though it is about Sanchez). http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/12/19/making-sense-of-the-sanchez-cap-hit/
You can definitely pro-rate bonus monies over the remaining years of the contract, whenever they were paid and however long the term of the contract becomes. Darrelle Revis currently has $12 million in cap charges related to bonuses that are going to be prorated over whatever length his contract runs. At the moment the contract length is 4 more seasons and so the bonus hits the cap $3M a year over those 4 seasons. As soon as his contract is voided to just next season the remaining bonus will fall on the cap, in this case it will be the 2014 cap since his contract cannot void until the clause in which he does not withhold his services is fulfilled and technically that will not happen until his final obligation of 2013 has passed without him withholding his services. If Revis and the Jets work out a contract extension that adds years and more bonus money to the contract then all the bonus monies, including those already paid but not accounted for under the cap will be lumped together and then prorated as normal.
Of course you can pro-rate bonus money over the course of a contract. Revis signed a 6 Year contract with an $18 Million dollar option bonus. If you add more years you are making a new contract, or a second contract. If Revis signs a new contract, the stipulations of the previous contract are null and void. How can you just take money from 1 contract and add it to another? In addition, there is a maximum length you can prorate a bonus. I thought it was 5 years, but I guess it is 6 years. We are talking about 2014 and moving forward correct? So we are only talking about $9 Million, and not the $3 Million for this year.
His original contract was 7 years and the option bonus paid was $18 million but that bonus was paid in 2011 after the first year of the deal had already passed. He's already played 2 of the years in which the bonus applied (2011 and 2012) and has 4 of the years remaining (2013, 2014, 2015 and 2016) although the contract is voidable at his option after 2013 if he has not held out on the Jets by the end of the 2013 season. If he signs an extension to his existing contract it is exactly that, an extension. The cap ramifications of the contract will incorporate parts of the old and the new but the bonus money that has already been paid but not accounted for under the cap is going to have to hit the cap over the new period of the contract as it always does. New bonus money will be added as well and prorated over the term also. The only way the remaining bonus money on Revis current contract hits the cap all at once is if the contract ends. That can happen by the Jets cutting or trading Revis. It can happen by Revis voiding the contract and leaving as a free agent. If he later re-signed with the Jets it wouldn't change the cap ramifications caused by his previous contract being voided. Those would be separate from whatever the new deal he signed with the Jets did to the cap. Edit: There is another way all the remaining bonus money could hit the cap at once, either this year or in 2014. The Jets and Revis could tear up the old contract and make a new one instead of extending Revis existing deal. The Jets don't have the cap room to do this so it seems much more likely that any agreement that the two sides reached would be an extension of the existing deal that allowed the $12 million remaining un-prorated bonus monies to be pro-rated from 2013 to the end of the deal.
1. Effectively making it a 6 year $18 Million dollar option bonus for purpose of discussion. (Why didn't they just offer him an extension) 2. I will do some research, but I don't believe this is correct. If I had to wing it, I would say that a contract is a set of stipulations, and an extension would rewrite the contract, making it a new contract in the NFL. Obviously the term is considered an extension, but I believe it is just slang for a new contract. Again, I don't believe you can pro-rate bonuses for longer than 5 years. I will also research that, as it is obviously 6 years in this scenario. 3. I don't have any disagreement with this, and haven't debated this point at all.
I have said this before too. Show me the Darelle Revis on either of the two SB teams this year. Last year? You can't because he is head and shoulders better than anything that was there. Point is, a Darelle Revis is not an essential requirement for SB contention. What is required is talent and depth across the board. Or maybe a sick ridiculous super QB. Great to have an all time great player. But they do not guarantee any kind of ultimate success. They do however, translate into assets you can obtain because somebody who already has a near great team thinks this is the final piece.
The thing about Revis that makes you wonder is Rex's contention that he frees up several other players to do other things because he can lock down the #1 WR on his own. That's always been an interesting concept for me in the equation. The problem though is that we all know what Rex does when he wants to put pressure on the opposing QB. He rushes 6 or 7 guys on an overload blitz with at least a couple of guys coming from outside the tackles. So Revis gives him the ability to do these overload blitzes with a DB or two in on the fun. Wouldn't it be better to have the great ROLB or RDE and rushing just 5 guys to get the pressure instead? Doesn't having Revis make it harder for the Jets to go find and then pay the great three down pass-rusher who would allow them to just run a normal pass rush instead of a horde of maniacs when they need pressure? Doesn't that great pass-rusher have more overall value in the defense than any CB possibly could since he's a primary against the run, sealing the outside also? Doesn't that guy play closer to the ball and get into more plays as a result? In short, isn't Terrell Suggs more valuable than Darrelle Revis in the big picture and shouldn't the Jets be doing everything they can to find Terrell Suggs to build the defense around instead of relying on a guy who is only going to cover one guy to open up other opportunities?
Not to mention the whole Deion Sanders issue to consider. Look at the Falcons. They got rid of Sanders and they were just as good without him as with him..... (for the humor impaired, this is a joke) But in all seriousness, I agree abyzmul. Trading Revis is rapidly becoming the only good option the Jets have in no small part because Rex's unorthodox back-to-front system just doesn't work. Building DL back is far superior all things being equal. There is just no way for the Jets to collect the picks and fit the necessary players under the cap if they try to sign Revis long term.
I would argue that almost any GREAT defender does this or something like what you're mentioning at the top. LT commanded enough respect that when you rushed the QB he had to often be double teamed. A super stud DT can collapse a pocket and allow a whole defense to gang sack the QB. Basically, any great defender will either shut down part of the field, draw double teams, disrupt offenses, intimidate, etc. So while Rex isn't wrong, we don't NEED to have Revis to do this. What we need is a great defender. No small task, granted, but something that any team that has super bowl hopes must have, right? But a great player that doesn't destroy your cap situation. If we were in a position to afford Revis I would sign him, but we aren't. If we could sign him and trade Cromartie to free cap space I would consider it, but I don't think that works. So there you have it.... Revis can't stay on this roster unless he can play three or four positions as well as he plays CB.
http://nfllabor.files.wordpress.com/2010/01/collective-bargaining-agreement-2011-2020.pdf A signing bonus can only be pro-rated over a 5 year period. Therefore the proration calculation on nyjetscap.com (no disrespect, and I appreciate all their work). $18 Million divided by 5 is $3.6 Million. Revis now has accrued $7.2 Million of the $18 Million leaving $10.8 Million in unrealized cap hit. If you consider $3.6 Million for this year, the accelerated 2014 cap hit, if Revis excercises his option to void the remaining years, to $7.2 Million. If three years are remaining, as in this case, a player may redistribute reporting, and other roster category bonuses over the remaining years of an extended contract. (is a signing bonus considered a roster bonus or other categories) If a player is an signed to an extended contract, the organization may pro rate NEW signing bonus money over existing years and extended years to a maximum of 5 years. Of course all legalise is open for interpretation, and this is just my interpretation of the rule. I do believe it is pretty cut and dry however.
Cro proved he can do the same thing, at half the price Dollars per impact play is the equation...Revis may be a HoF CB, but he's not worth 16 mil, even if he thinks so.
Good find on the terms of the new CBA. The Revis deal was signed before June 25, 2011 so it has the old rules applied to it. That means the prorating is over the life of the existing deal, so $3M a year that will accelerate when the deal is voided. It does look like the new agreement bars prorating of old money over the term of new extensions, however I read that to mean that if the Jets and Revis worked out an extension right now the old money would continue to prorate over the term of the old deal while the new money would prorate over the term of the old deal plus whatever years were added on, that number not to exceed 5 years. It is possible that when the extension was done the bonus would all accelerate immediately however that is not explicit in the terms above. Another new feature that pops up is that years in a voidable contract that are solely under the player's control may no longer be prorated against. So if the Jets and Revis signed the deal that they signed in 2011 under the new CBA the entire $18M option bonus would have been prorated against just 3 seasons at $6M a season. Revis has sole control over the voiding of the existing contract.
