Clearly your love of nacho clouds your mind junc! If he led us in SD in 09 by passing for 93 yards and having a shitty game completion wise, you must admit that Jamarcus Russell or Tim Tebow would be just as effective as our Qb. If not for our d and run game we lose due to his lack of play! That's a fact! In Indy, we lose if Cromartie doesn't have that nice big return! Again nacho only contributed minimally when if he is a true franchise Qb we don't need extraordinary performances from our special teams and defense all the time! Again your are blaming the defense for something that you have no grounds to stand on. Nacho gave away the losing margin in the first half, and you assume that if the defense did give him the ball with two minutes left he would have led us to a game winning score. Really junc, really? You are biased and dreaming, while blame shifting!
A "good" game doesn't always mean 250+ yds and 3 TDs. He made plays to help us win, he avouided bad Tos. he only had 1 and the D got it right back, he converted on a bunch of huge 3rd downs and magaed the game well. he had a good game. this is what I mean about average fans, they just look at the boxscore. mark had a good game that day. Nowhere have I said we didn't win w/ D first but there have been a million D first teams fail to win in january b/c they don't get quality QB play. The Ravens have had great Ds for the last decade and finally got back to a SB this year. All those great TB Ds, the Bears of the 80s- these were TRULY GREAT D's not very good like ours. mark played a good game at SD despite the #s that say otherwise. We have been a D first team, when our D comes out and allows a 9 min TD drive where we get punched in the face w/ no resistance that will affect our team. The D cost us the 2010 title game. I don't assume we win if the D gets him the ball back but I know we would have had a chance which we didn't get b/c the D failed.
Again, you admitted the offense was culpable for the 2010 final game. so you can't simply say the D cost us the game. The O put up mimimal pts, and the TD the O let up turned out to be the game winning goal for Pitt. The O failed that day.
I'm by no means an average fan because I recognize that his numbers also say he sucked, I watched him play the game. If he converts a couple 3rd downs does that mean he played a good game? No, but to the fan that's clouded by our Qb's existence it is. To the above average fan who isn't clouded by nacho, if and when he does finally make a play, to finally contribute I say fuck it's about time you did something! His play is not what you want when chasing superbowls! But to the fan who loves the guy it's acceptable? Nachos position on the field is the most important, and the way he plays it, it's as if he is a nameless guy on punt coverages. At least so until he screws up, and the spotlight finds him due to his position! Mediocrity at the Qb position has won how many superbowls in 47 tries? And when mediocre Qb's were on the team when it won a Super Bowl, what aspects of the team propelled them to victory? I doubt the sun shinning on a dogs ass that day, got it done.
I never said the O doesn't get any blame, we lost as a team but the biggest culprit was the defense. The D let the game spiral out of control, the O and D got the game back under control and when the O got us w/in a score the D then failed again. The D gets the bulk of the blame. Again, not all good games come w/ good #s. He was better than rivers was that day but Rivers put up better #s. His yardage total is low b/c we got a double digit lead and ran the ball most of the 4th qtr, pass attemptes were similar for both QBs until we went up 10 in the 4th then it skewed in SDs favor. Mark has played very well in his postseason career, well enough where if you put him on NYG last year or Bal this year those teams still win SBs or you put Eli or Flacco on our team in '09 and '10 we still don't reach the SB.
The game spiraled out of control when he fumble leading to a 24 to 0 deficit, how do you figure? 17-0 deficit isn't spiraling, that's 3 scores not 4! That loss is on nacho in particular. How many 3 and outs did we have in the game? How many short drives? You realize that Big Ben scored 17 on our defense, while nacho managed a FG in the first half? Put nacho on either of the Super Bowl participants, and they aren't playing for the Super Bowl, division title, a bye week, or anything else playoff related, his play dictates that fact! Put either Super Bowl Qb on our team and we don't finish 6-10, we would have definitely challenged for a playoff spot, and there would have also never been something called a butt fumble! Either of those Qb's would elevate our offense and the players to heights that nacho couldn't dream of!!!!! Taco isn't in either Flacco or Kapernicks league, get real!
When you say things like, the 'D folded', the 'D cost us the game', the 'D failed' and the 'D is the reason we lost', without any mention of the O, it does imply you are giving the O a pass. and the D let up 17 pts...that's hardly letting game spiral out of control. The O let up the game winning points, and was incapable of putting up sufficient pts to win even against a prevent D. I'd say O gets equal blame at minimum. Stop spewing that bullshit w/o at least putting accountability on the O.
It's simple, if you are coaching little leaguers and multiple kids throughout the league play the same position as the kid on your team, lets say short stop. 10 teams In the league which means 10 starting SS including yours. 9 of those kids have higher batting averages, hit more home runs, drive in more runs, make more plays in the field, and have less defensive errors. So where does that put your SS in comparison to all others? Ok each game your team plays the other teams SS puts up better numbers, 3-4 with a homer, two RBI's, 7 putouts, and 1 error. Your SS goes0-3 with a walk, has 3 putouts and doesn't commit an error. Who had the better game? Our team won because their shortstop committed an error, and 2 batters later our clean up hitter hits a grand slam and we win by one! As much as you like to try to debunk stats, it's silly to profess them as unimportant! Actually it makes you look like you don't understand the game, more so than how much you think it elevates your football brain to call them unimportant! If rivers and nacho trade places that day, we win by a much bigger margin and our passing stats and points would have doubled!
Really? I wouldn't say he lit it up his second year/beginning of his third year, but I wouldn't say he sucked. He was average and inconsistent, but he didn't suck like he did the majority of this year
I can definitely see how that can be perceived but I have never said the O didn't deserve any blame. I believe the D deserves the bulk b/c we were a D first team, you expect your best unit to play their best in the biggest games and they failed to do so. 17 isn't a huge amount but it was a 17-0 deficit and when we got it w/in 5 they again failed. The tone for the game was set on the opening drive. We had two 3 and out punts Big Ben faced our D, mark faced Pitt's D who played much better. mark on NYG '11 they win the SB, makr on Bal '12 they win the SB. The biggest difference btw NYG '11 and NYJ '10 in title games was the sanchez fumble which could easily have been called incomplete was ruled a fumble and Ahmad Bradshaw actually fumbled but they ruled it wasn't which would have ended the game w/ a chip shot FG for SF.
it depends, where are they accumulating those #s? if they are making plays w/ their team up or down 7 runs but failing to show late in close games then I'm not impressed. I'd rather have a guy struggle innings 1-6 then come up big innings 7-9 than the other way around.
Sanchez was progressing ok until the Ravens game early in '11. That's when he took the field for the first time in a completely hopeless game with very subpar talent all around him on offense. It was basically downhill from there. The Jets cut back his passes dramatically after that game and let him just try to manage the game for a 3 or 4 game span which he did acceptably but not much more that that. Then they opened things up again against the Patriots and let him start throwing the ball more again but he was really never the same player again after that brutal loss to the Ravens with a UDFA playing center opposite that great Ravens front seven. Sometimes a straw really does break the camel's back.
I always try to wonder if it was that Ravens game or not? His play the rest of the season was really up and down while the team tried to hide him. We tried to unleash him in the NYG game which brutally backfired and the MIA we saw this year's Sanchez. I
I disagree about unleashing him in the Giant game as we have discussed before. Circumstances dictated the skewed run/pass ratio and I thinm it dictated it throughout the season, we struggled to run for half the year and we fell behind early in games. keep in mind that last year 3 of our top receiving options coming itno the year were Plax, Mason and LT. 2 retired and Plax came back late b/c no one wanted him and barely contributed in Pitt plus we got Plax fresh out of 2 years in jail.
I like Idzik's statement. Let Mark compete for the job, we know this draft class sucks dong. If Mark beats out whoever they throw at him then he deserves to start this year. If not, we let the other veteran start and draft a QB in the draft the year after. Idzik has a pretty good plan for this team, he has a good drafting record and he says he wants to build this team through the draft. If this fanbase can be patient (which I don't think will be the case) then we could have a good team in a 2-3 years from now after some losing seasons unless Rex has them playing above their talent skill again.
They just need to make sure Mark isn't 'competing' against Kellen Clemmens, Mark Brunell, or Tim Tebow. None of those guys were viable starters, and none of them pushed or challenged Mark for his job. I'd like to start this season with a different QB as the incumbent starter, and let Sanchez try to work out of the backup spot rather than other way around. The fan base won't be patient. A bad season this year would send us further down the spiral, with probably all coaches being fired, and most players no longer guaranteed money let go. New coaches will want new personell for new schemes, and the futile cycle continues. I'd like to avoid that for once, and stay the course while we search for the long term QB answer and rebuild the O.
It's time to move on. Sanchez just can't hack it. No matter who's worked with him and who he's played with, he still can't get it through his damn head to protect the football and not make stupid throws. No matter how you feel about Schottenheimer and/or Sparano, they still are NFL coaches who most certainly have tried to get this through his freaking head. "Hey Mark, how about throwing it away next time? Schottenheimer gave him a damn color-coded wristband to help him "make the right decision" for shit's sake! How pathetic is this? No MORE excuses, my god. I'm not hanging onto less than 10 games of his 60+ game career anymore to think he's good. He's a bad NFL QB. I've said this before but if you take the time to watch the game film on him, you will realize how many opportunities he's let go by the wayside in these 4 years. He completely misses open recievers and/or forces into coverage. It's a re-occuring theme. You will go crazy seeing these. Enough with the talent excuses too. If he was any good, he would rise above this. I'm not talking about rising above to an MVP level year either, I'm talking about rising above to at least the 20th best QB. Is that too much to ask? Of course he could use more talent to become good. But you could say this about 50 or so NFL QBs, starters or backups. That's what Sanchez is - he's a NFL career backup. He's David Carr, He's Matt Leinart, He's Brady Quinn, He's Chad Henne..... similar skill-sets.. Anyone of those guys would've had similar - if not better results with the Jets, their D and running games in 2009 and 2010 as well. It's the sad truth..
BrowningNagle brings up a good point. I can't remember the last time Sanchez just threw the ball out of bounds...
No, that makes you an average fan. He was asked to let them run, and run, and run some more...and make clutch plays in clutch spots....which is what he did especially in that SD game, the Indy game, and in NE. That why he was mishandled. Ground and pound is a good philosophy, but the Jets have always done it backwards. Except on the Favre /Seattle game where they should have run often, almost always. You play conventional offense early so your young QB develops, then you push the other team around when they are tired, and youre fresh. The play calling under Schotty was retarded 75 percent of the time. Sparano was just as bad. Really good in spots, but not consistent or smart. Going back to the Favre example Schotty always tried to be too cute times two. Deny it. That's part of the problem with the Sanchez retrograde.
