i would rather woody be lying than woody be strong armed into a decision that only 1 guy in the organization believed in, that guy being a guy who had absolutely no clue about talent evaluation. any way you slice this situation its bad for jets fans and further proves our owner to be an idiot.
Yeah really, and this is what I was driving at once you get past the hearsay controversy. Unless Sundquist was lying or was totally misquoted, the statement is exactly as you describe. We get to choose either that Woody is a blatant liar, or that he is an idiot. I would prefer to think he's a liar, because the alternative is worse, but it is not good, either, for the team's owner to have a rep as a blatant liar. Another new low for this team.
More on this topic... http://www.metro.us/newyork/sports/...ohnson-s-tebow-claims-are-revisionist-history Now I guess everybody in the NFL is out to get the Jets along with the local media. Funny how things turn sometimes. One day, you can't "get enough Tebow". The next, you can't get "far enough away from Tebow". Time to admit that the Jets mishandled this entire Tebow thing and are still mishandling it. How much of this is a vengeful media really is a copout relative to how much of this PR damage is self-inflicted. This should be the question all JetNation should be asking itself. This drive to win the back pages is starting to backfire and I would imagine a bit of anominity would be welcome at this point. So, lets all pray that the Jets take a long look in the mirror.
Sometimes I wonder if other candidates who were interviewed feel the need to talk about what exactly went on in the interview with others. If this were any other no name player, people wouldn't give a shit if Woody said that. But, since it was Tebow, everyone is freaking out.
Unfortunately, that last quote wasn't from a candidate, but a rival NFL executive that went off the record. Now if there was a confidentiality clause signed by the prespective job candidates, there could be cause for legal remedies but as it is, there's nothing to keep candidates from talking about what went on during the interview.
Is a Cowboys fan really asking this? You have your own retard circus to enjoy at Valley Ranch. Stones and glass houses.
Wouldn't be the first time that this shitshow of an organization blamed a former employee for a monumentally bad personnel decision.
So you want our owner to not listen to our GM? You want Woody involved in who the Jets sign? I don't see the problem. Woody was probably concerned about everything that comes along with Tebow, but Tanny and Rex convinced him otherwise. There's no reason for Woody to lie about that, and it CERTAINLY doesn't make him look stupid for being convinced by his football people to sign a particular football player.
Ever heard of the expression "Monday morning quarterback"? Pretty much sums up the points I've made in this thread.
One of my main problems with this whole scenario is that the owner is saying to candidates that he needs to be coerced into his team's personnel moves. Woody Johnson is an awkward rich kid trying to find himself with a football franchise, but the fucking dude should have no say in personnel decisions as it is. He's not a football guy. If he isn't seeing results, he needs to find new football guys. He doesn't need to be in on the workings of the team. He's not qualified. The only way that Tebow should be a factor to Woody is as a marketing angle. And Tebow was a giant publicity buzz name. Woody needed to be talked into having a ton of free publicity? Give me a fucking break.
For me..it's not about whether Woody has blame or not for the Tebow ordeal.Of course he does...he has the final say on all matters. I just wanna see the evidence that Woody has some sort of backhanded plan to undermine the Jets franchise for the team's very own nightly segment on Entertainment tonight & that it was he who originally wanted Tebow. Where's the evidence? The dark siders can't provide it. I'm not buying a couple tongue in cheek quotes.
It's such a goofball argument to ask people why Woody would purposefully try to undermine the Jets. He's not trying to undermine the Jets. That's the side-effect of his incompetence.
If someone convinces you to agree with them, and you let them do what they have convinced you is right, then you bought into their reasoning, and share responsibility for the decision. If someone forced you to accept where they wanted to go, and you had no power to stop them, then you have no responsibility for the decision. If someone who reports to you makes a recommendation that you are not convinced by, but are also not convinced to oppose that recommendation, and you say I will let you do this but if you fail I will fire you, is still making a decision. Concededly that someone has not completely bought into the decision. But punting to your subordinate IS a decision. In short the way Woody looks stupid is in saying he "let" his subordinate make the decision, and is not responsible for what the subordinate decided. That sounds pretty stupid to me.
So Woody isn't supposed to know about any innerworkings of the organization what so ever? Wasn't one of the original criticism for years about Woody that he didn't care about the franchise? You can't have it both ways. You are correct in saying that he isn't a football guy. But just like in any line of business...ownership is always involved in transactions whether it is their expertise or not. It is up to them to surround themselves w/ a braintrust that is able to articulate the facts to make the best decision moving forward. Unfortunately it sounds like in this case, the braintrust steered him in the wrong direction. "Forced" is definitely a strong word..but we aren't even sure if those were the exact words Woody told Sundquist. It's all Hearsay. Ownership HAS to be involved w/ major decisions. If they aren't there's no transparency, confusion & no chain of command.
I recall the statements made last summer by Woody, and that October interview. He didn't have to pile on the accolades if he did not share the view that those accolades were deserved. Woody elsewhere said he would not comment on this or that person until after the season. Instead he chose in the case of Tebow to sound like he was all on board having Tebow be on the Jets, and not just for this season. Add in the very important factor that the football fundamentals argued very much against bringing Tebow to the Jets. So, let's just say Woody really was not on board with the decision last winter. What was the basis of his not being on board? What is the evidence he did NOT want Tebow? I don't see anything at all in that regard.
Of course you are making a fair point that it is not enough to say Woody is either up to his eyeballs in running the team or should have no involvement. But it does seem to me that an owner can delegate certain things. Should delegate where the nature of the decision involves an area that the owner is not familiar with. Let's say you are the owner of a small to medium sized business that you developed, having expertise in some manufacturing process upon which your company's success was based. A rival appears to be violating some patents you own. Perhaps has stolen some trade secrets, obtained some customer lists, is attempting to hire your top operating officer who you have under contract. What do you do? Well, you hire a law firm, and not just any law firm, but one who has a proven track record in this kind of dispute. But neither do you let the law firm decide what to do. No, they make recommendations, which you go through and analyze. Ask for clarifications when you dont understand something. Have them explain it to you in a way you understand, and then compare your options. And... you may also bring in other parts of your company, like what does your marketing guy think? But if you chose to decide what course to take on a possible litigation be determined primarily by what your marketing guy says, well, the odds have just gone up that you will make the wrong decision.
It's hearsay. You could write 10,000 words on the definition of hearsay and none of them would make what Sundquist typed up not hearsay. Why would any sane person give the comments additional legs by responding to them? How could Woody possibly recover anything by potentially getting down in the mud with a third party over a conversation that likely can't be validated? Sundquist is a blogger and what he sells is the perception that he's on the inside of professional football and that he knows a lot of stuff that most people don't. This is true so don't crucify me for saying it. He also does know a lot of stuff that most people don't. The Woody comment was a throwaway in a bigger conversation that he was having with his fans. It was nice and juicy and I will guarantee you that it got his twitter page a lot of hits and probably his website also, which was prominently featured in all the stories about the comment also. Don't be naive while you are lecturing on the question of what Sundquist gained from making the comment. The media blowup on this was inevitable given that it touched on Tebow, on the Jets epic GM search and on Woody Johnson, who is currently a bit of a punching bag for the NY media.
So... what makes the Jets trading for a backup QB and gadget player for a 4th and 6th round pick such a "major" decision for the organization? A player that the coaching staff made it a point to hardly ever use? Marketability. Something outside the football operations of the team. Let me ask you something... how much did Mike Tannenbaum have to do with the marketing of the Jets? Aside from providing players and a manageable salary cap? Did Mike Tannenbaum really concern himself with ticket sales? Is that what people really think? Because Tebow provided no other benefit to the team, the CS made sure to prove that point to the guys upstairs. Why would Woody Johnson concern himself with such an ineffective football asset? Buzz. That's all it was. Stop fooling yourself, Kurt.
If you dont understand that there are different kinds of hearsay and that some are more persuasive as evidence than others, then I don't know what to say to you. Your implication, based on nothing other than pure speculation, that Sundquist made it up to get hits on his blog ignores the reality. If he made it up and that came out, his blog's cred would take such a hit it might never recover. As for the silence of the Jets on this, how about answering a negative story and explaining to us as Jet fans why they should not be concerned by the blog? Not that we would be obligated to accept the explanation, of course, but trying to improve the good will of the franchise is enough of a reason to answer it. Your posts are often negative when it comes to various subjects associated with the Jets. I assume no real homer here would consider you to be one of them. But when it comes to Woody Johnson, it would not be unfair to call you a homer. A Woody Homer.
