The fact that Te'o is being questioned as a top ten talent is absurd. Have you seen him play this year or did you simply get on the bandwagon around Heisman time?
Eh for what it's worth, and not much at this time, several of the draft prospect boards have dropped him out of the top 10 for now, but most of those tend to be rather reactionary.
If the Jets can secure a legitimate NFL QB before the start of the draft I can see them taking a defensive player in round 1. If they can't they will need to draft as much offensive talent as they can find.
I never said Mercilus was a high pick, I said it could be someone the Jets could consider at their Mid rd 1 pick last year. Mercilus isn't a bad player, he has shown flashes this year, just like Coples. The player I really wanted was Hightower, and he has proven he's been a great addition to New England. I liked Mercilus and still do, but I never thought he was a top 10 talent. If you want to question me that's fine, but I'm going to question others & you when they can't support their opinion. I always support my POV with facts about the player. If you want to go head to head with my knowledge of the draft and it's process....I'm ready. I can't stand stupidity and a few of posts in this forum lately are just ridiculous. This is the NFL draft it's not an exact science, the way to make decisions is support it with a player's performance, background & intergrity. Te'o has proven he has excelled in all phases and is worthy of a Top 10 selection. What pisses me off, is the knee jerk reaction of average fans of one game played by Te'o. Bama was/is clearly the better team and Bama's O-Line dominated the Irish's front 7. I'm not a Notre Dame homer, I'm not even a Te'o fan, I just know a great football when I see one and what he has meant to Notre Dame's program. If you want to change the culture of your team/defense Te'o would be the perfect player. Te'o isn't the fastest player, but he can make all the plays sideline to sideline. Te'o has the best instincts I've seen in a long time, he can read and react extermely well which makes up for lack of speed. Not all of the best players in the draft are fast....football acumen comes into play.
Ah...the German connection Great player with a non-stop motor, a player that would be an excellent fit in Rex's defense. I doubt he would be available at #9, if he was, I'd draft him in a heartbeat. I've seen some predict Werner as high as #2, I think that is slightly wishful thinking. I think Cleveland might be a good fit. The only knock on Werner last year, he disappeared for a couple of games, but finished very strong.
+1 That is the problem with snap judgements, when the dust clears people will look at his entire body of work. Here's the proof, go back to the 1st post of this thread I started 11/5 and see how consistent I've been. Then, check the love of Te'o by others and how it has changed since one game last week.
I glad you're so sure, I only listed possibilities. Oakland is a wildcard, they certainly could use help at LB. This isn't Al's Raiders, the "Speed baby" mentality is over. Clevelands' Offense isn't too far away from being good, their defense needs a few more playmakers.I'd also like to see Cleveland get a Top Notch WR, but not in Rd 1. Detriot should probably go corner (Milliner) but if you want to change the culture in Detriot, Te'o would be a good start. Buffalo could reach for a QB, a O-Lineman like Eric Fisher, Marrone's backgound or Te'o. All of these teams are possibilities for Te'o.
Part of, if not all of the issue, is positional value. It's the same thing bogging down opinions on Warmack. In terms of talent they are easily amount the top 5 or at worst 10 of this draft. Sadly, their positions are seen by many as not that important and it knocks them way down in the ranks and opinions of others.
Unless T'eo bombs at the combine the only thing that might keep him out of a top 10 selection is the same thing that might keep Warmack from being a top 10 selection. Right or wrong, teams are generally reticent to draft a Guard or ILB in the top 10. Not saying it's right mind you, just a historical aspect of the draft. Of coure that doesn't mean it never happens, it does, just not with great frequency.
I'm kind of thinking that Oakland will go with one of 3 players with their pick, or they may surprise everyone and trade down since they're light on picks this year and there will be players on the board at that point that other teams want. But if they stay put I'd put the money on, in no particular order; Milner, T'eo or Star.
The kid has: No pass rush ability. No top end speed. No experience playing single gap. His skill set is limited to 3-4 inside LB. That means: -If you draft him and a season or two later change coaches and switch to a 3-4, he has no position. -you spent a top ten pick on a bottom value position, regardless of skill -he isn't going to do more than what you could get a half a round or two rounds later Go around the League and look at all the 3-4 defenses. I can't find a any ILB that were top 10 picks, not even Pat Willis and Ray Lewis. Both of whom not only are infinitely better athletes with equal leadership/instincts, but both have the versatility to play in any defensive front. Teo could be the greatest ILB in history, and his value is STILL not worth a top 10 pick. That he displayed classic ND overratedness in the bowl game is irrelevant. His limited skill set at a lesser importance position, however, is relevant.
Most teams don't expect their MLB to be a pass rusher, just a solid leader that makes plays and runs the defense. How you perceive value is different how I do and Gms and Scouts, the intangables of Te'o and his productivity at MLB can't be questioned. Don't think Rex is going to run a true 3-4, he has shown to use a hybrid defense and drafting Coples has shown he wants to run 4 man fronts. Many teams have drafted ILBs at the top of the draft. While I agree, it's usually not a position that Teams are usually willing to invest big money, they're some exceptions and Te'o' body of work fits into that rule. Safaties are usually in the same situation, thier value doesn't translate to be a high pick, but there are exceptions...the late Taylor & Berry are prime examples. Teo's entire body of work warrants a top pick in this draft and again I can't see him falling out of the top 10. I haven't seen a more instrictive player at his positon in a decade or more, which should calm the fears of top end speed. Te'o can play in either a 3-4 or 4-3, I think he could also play outside in a 4-3, although in the middle iis his position. Just some MLBs drafted the last 12 years: 2000 Lavarr Arrington #2 Brian Urlacher # 9 2001 Dan Morgan #11 2004 Jon Vilma #12 2006 AJ Hawk #5 Ernie Sims #9 2007 Patrick Willis #11 2009 Jerod Mayo #10 2010 Roland McClain # 8 I can't believe most scouts and GMs would have Te'O rated lower than most of these players. The Ray Lewis comment, if a team knew how he would have turned out, he would have been the top pick, not toward the end of Rd 1. Same with Willis, he should have been drafted sooner and #11 is just barely out of the top 10.
Every SINGLE LB you just mentioned with the exception of Rolando McClain was a 4-3 LB with greater athleticism than Teo. EVERY SINGLE ONE. And ironically enough, McClain has provided the least value in the pros. That is my point. You don't draft a system ILB in the top 10. Teo is not a 4-3 MLB. He is a 3-4 ILB. No amount of leadership or heart is going to make him the athlete that Arrington or Willis is. Find me the Parcells 3-4 ILBs drafted in the top 10. They don't exist.
What the fuck does Parcells 3-4ILB have to do with this topic?? I'm not saying Te'o is going to be a 3-4 ILB he could be, that's your opinion, I'm talking about MLBs and I mentioned Te'o could play in 4-3. This is not a NY Jet topic, it's Te'o's value in rd 1. Te'o is valued in the top 5 by most professional draft gurus, not that I always agree with them, but it's a fact. Mayo & Willis have played in 3-4s. You think Vilma had greater had greater athleticism than Te'o? Not too sure about that. We can agree to disagree, you were wrong about my POV on Mercilus, acting like I thought he was a top player in the draft. He had 6 sacks and numerous pressures as a PT player for the Texans, not bad for a rookie. Call me out if Te'o isn't a Top 10 pick, Ill make it a point to let you know if he is a top 10 pick, since you like to bring posts (Mercilus) form the past. If you're still around.
I could care less if he ends up a top 10 pick. I'm saying it's foolish to draft him there, but I'm sure some moron team will do it. Why do I keep discussing 3-4 ILB? BC THAT IS THE POSITION HE PLAYS. He is NOT a 4-3 MLB. And no, he isn't as athletic as anyone on that list. Vilma is a true sideline to sideline MLB and was one in college, and actually led his team as a sophomore to a title beatdown almost as bad as the one Teo received. But like Teo, Vilma is not versatile. And the Jets wasted a top ten pick on him as he was useless once they changed fronts. Look, you have the guy as your avatar. Clearly an unbiased discussion is not going to happen. I would prefer to not take a 3-4 ILB from a notoriously overrated program who got embarassed when he played elite talent, but that's just me.
Calling a team a "moron' is just foolish, I'm suppose to take you serious with "GoldenShowers" as your handle...juvenile. Having him my avatar has nothing to do with it. I don't have favorite team or specific players, I'm not a Tebow type nut. I called it the way I see it and have a good track record on this site. I have no dog in the fight for any College team which makes me neutral. Vilma wasn't a top 10 pick...#12, and he was a good fit in their 4-3, but was expendable when Mangini took over. You being a Cane fan I wouldn't expect you to dis Vilma. Since you like to bring up past posts, you should know I always support my POV. I wasn't thrilled with the Cople's pick and expalined why, but willing to see how he progresses.
Doesn't surprise me, like i said you're a juvenile troll. Ill give you a mulligan with that comment, one more and you're history. I've checked your post history, you argue with everyone (troll), incite the tebow forum, have benn banned by Mantana Soss ( who doesn't ban easily)...so put my reputation against mine here at TGG and you lose. Better watch your tone, or you can go play at JI. I suggest you put me on ignore, cause that is what I'm going to do with you.
You do realize his role on the team was not to rack up sacks but to be the guy around to stop any RB or target from getting in the open field? Judging an ILB on sacks is absolutely stupid....that's not their role, that's only a plus if they give you that. Te'o if not picked up can get sacks, he's just too far away and doesn't have breakout speed to be a 10+ sack guy...nor should he really be. And "Classic ND overratedness" is so lame and pathetic. ND got beat by a star powered team that had the experience on us in the big game. ND was caught with being undisciplined and if anything Coach Kelly needs to take a little blame for that. Te'O wasn't THAT BAD that people are making him out to be...just people expected him to be the 2nd coming of Mike Singletary or something on the field which he isn't so they had expectations ridiculously high. I also think judging players in blowouts, for better or for worse is the single biggest mistake a football fan can make. Whether they admit it or not, teams let up and lose focus in lobsided games on both sides. I sincerely doubt it was on Te'o's mind that he was playing for draft status and positioning in that title game but rather it was going to be his final collegiate game and he really had hopes of being crowned National Champs.
The reason he is being questioned is because the traditional run thumping MLB with great leadership/intangibles is no longer valued as highly as it once was due to the passing direction the league is going. Add in the fact that he looked pretty awful against an NFL-comparable team in Alabama. Yes, he looked good vs teams like Pitt, Michigan, Purdue, Mich St, BYU, Wake Forest, Boston College, Navy, etc., but when it came time to play with the big boys from the SEC, he looked like just another guy. Look at the LB's taken in top 10 the last few years. They're 3 down LB's with speed and coverage ability or top flight pass rushing OLB's. Luke Kuechly, Von Miller, Aldon Smith, Rolando McClain, Aaron Curry, Jerod Mayo, Keith Rivers. Patrick Willis was taken 11th and Lawrence Timmons taken 12th. Now you can say that some of those guys haven't panned out as planned like Curry and Rivers and even McClain, but the fact of the matter is that guys like Curry and Rivers were seen as 3 down LB's at the time who ran 4.5's at the combine and showed athleticism/fluidity. McClain is the only one that showed a lack of some athleticism and had a slower 40 in the 4.6's, but the fact that he excelled in the SEC against the best college competition and played for Nick Saban quelled some of those fears. I'm sorry but no objective person can tell me that Manti's skill set is worthy of going in the top 10. He's not a stud 3 down very athletic LB like Jerod Mayo or Patrick Willis or Timmons or Kuechly type of ILB. And he's not a pass rushing OLB like Miller or Smith. Manti falls more in the category of guys like Brandon Spikes, Pat Angerer, and Rey Maualuga. Lauded college LB's who were good vs the run and were leaders of their defenses in college but guys who are limited athletically and in terms of speed/coverage, and therefore fell in the draft. I'm not predicting Teo sliding to the 2nd or 3rd round, but I find it extremely hard to justify him going in the top 10 -- especially if you want us to use our top 10 pick on him. I hope you're right and he goes in the top 8 because that means an extra player will slip through the cracks to us at #9. I'm just not betting on it.
