no...nobody is comparing him to revis, and if they are they are stupid. he is not a consistent viable starter at the #2 spot. On a weekly basis, as a nickel corner I'm happy with him. Maybe a spot starter. But on a consistent basis he proves to get burned and badly any given week. He looks lost out there some games. At the end of the day he has not lived up to his draft status which is the brunt of the problem. If he was an Erik Lankster nobody would expect him to perform consistently.
Kyle Wilson didn't do bad today, Eric Smith on the other hand...he's really the only person in the secondary that has to go
He is burned on nearly every play. He is slow, weak in the run game, and part of his first round value was he was supposed to return punts, which he doesn't do.
I think he's done what is expected. He was brought in as a nickel corner but also Revis holdout backup. Well Revis is hurt and he's been playing the #2 quite fine. I have seen many other corners on many other teams been burnt more than him.
He is a FIRST ROUND PICK. Nobody drafts a guy they want to be a nickel corner in the first round. He was brought in to be an eventual starter and he has not proven he can do that week in and week out. If you are happy with him on a weekly basis and feel he has lived up to first round draft status then I don't know what more to say. Many corners on other teams aren't drafted in the first round. And if they are and they perform and develop like KW they are cut or bashed. If the Jets didn't invest a first round selection in him, I'd be fine with him.
I guess we agree to disagree. The only reason he isn't starting when the defensse is healthy is because we have two corners in the top 10 of the league right now. About 99% of other corners in the league wouldn't start for us. If you want to say picking a corner was the wrong move in the draft, I 100% agree. I disagree that Wilson isn't a decent/solid corner and I disagree if we were going corner in his draft that he wasn't the best corner.
correct me if I'm wrong but the jets re-signed Cro after Kyle Wilson's rookie year. Meaning they were not happy with where Kyle was at, hence the need to re-sign Cro. I promise you if Kyle flashed the ability of a 1st round pick Cro would have walked (which is no doubt why the Jets drafted Kyle to begin with). And don't say "then why did the jets go after Aso?". At that point they clearly felt Aso was an upgrade and since they didn't feel comfortable starting KW they might as well have gone after Aso given the money they were going to need to spend on Cro. The Jets didnt sit in the war room and say "we have 2 top 10 corners, one of which is an impending FA which we will let hit the market but will retain, but who cares fuck it lets draft a corner first round." no way, no how. Kyle was drafted to replace Cro so the Jets wouldn't have to invest that much $ at the CB position. And if KW even remotely showed he would be capable of taking on that role, Cro would be on another team today.
I think that's correct, and I don't think they initially drafted Wilson for that. That would mean the Jets FO had a plan a year or two something happened :wink:. They initially drafted him for Revis holdout backup and for a nickel corner after Peyton had fun picking apart the Jets. I also think they got Cro for lack of corner depth behind Wilson and Revis. Sure if Wilson popped up like Revis, they let Cro walk, but he was a bottom first pick and I think he's performing at that level for a CB. He is probably a bottom tier #1 corner in the league and a high end number #2 corner. Saw your edit: I think the idea was the Revis holdout and to have a counter to the league shifting to QBs lining up and having fun and their way with DBs. We missed on that as the main team in our league countered by going TE heavy and limiting the amount of corners we can put other there without getting the ball run down our throat.
so what you're saying is the Jets spent a 1st round pick on "holdout insurance" and a nickel corner? It has nothing to do w the fact that their #2 CB was an impending FA and would command top money? KW did not need to pop up and be even remotely like Revis. He needed to show he had the potential and ability to be a #2 CB on a weekly basis, which he has yet to show to this day.
Yeah, basically. I mean the Jets showed 0 planning for their WR leaving, their OL leaving, the S and DL position, I highly doubt they were prepared for the CB scenario but missed everything else. I think the Jets reacted to what Peyton Manning did to them and drafted secondary even when it wasn't a need. Kind of like the Mike Nugent draft. We overreacted to waht ended our season. I think Wilson is a solid corner, now, but he had his struggles his first year. He is playing fine as a #2 corner now.
they may not have seen equivalent talent in the first round to fill those positions at the time....i didnt hate the KW pick at the time. I thought it was a good move and a smart one. It turned out not to work out the way they had hoped. We'll see how the Jets feel. I have a feeling if they feel that KW is viable, that they will trade Cro this offseason while his value is high. and i agree, our FO has shown to be completely inefficient and unable to execute any of their plans through scouting, roster management, and even cap management.
Trading Cro is risky with Revis on potential holdout this offseason. I mean I would love additional draft picks, but would rather try to shop Revis than Cro to be honest. Our pass defense really hasn't dropped and Cro will be much cheaper than Revis. And yea, FO hasn't had a vision. We have been one step behind at addressing problems. If you look at the best teams, they draft the position and fix it before it ever becomes a problem or weakness. We wait until it becomes a glaring issue, then rush to fix it.
Cro will net 1.25 MM in cap total cap savings after dead money if cut, whereas Revis would count $3MM against the cap if cut after dead money. I'm obviously not suggesting we cut either player but just providing the figures. I think Cro's value will never be higher and given we can save even something toward the cap at the same time, I think trading him makes the most sense. I'm not sure if the cap savings would be even higher if he were traded. We can trade Cro at his peak value and keep Revis. FO needs a total revamp.
Well my thinking is in the future, Cro will cost less, much less, than Revis if Revis wants to follow his idea of being paid like a QB.
which is fair...and trading revis SHOULD be on the table. I'm not meaning to discount it as an idea, bc it's worth considering IMO. The only question I have is, is Revis' value at it's highest coming off a knee tear? Will get we top return for him or would we be better suited waiting? If that's the case, does it make sense to trade Cro, who will literally never be more valuable then he is today? And by trading Cro, will that allow us to pay Revis more if needed? BC I think we both agree Revis >>>>>>> Cro.
True on Cro's value. And i'm thinking the way players in sports are coming back from ACLs/MCLs, that Revis value might not be as hurt as expected. Cro's trade value might be more now via draft picks, but Revis' value is money saved in the future. Both should be looked to be shopped, and trading one of them could help this team a lot . Oh and yes Revis >>>>>> Cro, but the impact Revis has a on a game vs Cro is not even close to Revis' domination of the position compared to Cro's
I agree on the ACL/MCL advancements. But let's remember this - AP came off an ACL/MCL tear and people had serious questions. He came back to be a total monster, but if the Vikings had traded AP prior to this season, they'd kick themselves because they would have not gotten back what he really is worth. Teams will hesitate to trade what we will want for Revis, even though chances are good that he will be fine. I think they should shop him though, so once he makes insane demands the Jets can point to what other teams would offer for him in a trade. I do think the Jets should pull the trigger on a trade involving Cro, however.
Yeah, they definitely need to test the waters on both Cro and Revis. My thinking is just that while Revis is great, the impact he has on a game vs AP is greatly different. CBs are a low impact position and if we developing a pass rush, which it looks like we might be, then Revis' value drops ever so slightly and the money saved between a Cro and Revis could be used in a more impactful and helpful way to the team. Granted, if the right offer is not there for Revis, 100% keep him. Don't trade him just to trade him.
Fair enough. An argument could be made that a CB who can shut down half the field in today's NFL is almost as valuable however I do 100% see your point. What would you consider fair value for Revis? I'd say a first and third this year and a conditional 1st in 2014. As for Cro I'd say given how he's emerged in Revis's absence a 1st/2nd this year and conditional 2nd in 2014.
Yeah I get your point on Revis too. I would love to see him stay because, man we could have the best corner ever be on the Jets. But on the other hand, can a CB who shuts down his field 80% of time and extra cap room be as valuable as someone who does in 99% of the time? It's a decision the FO has to make. Those both sound reasonable. If you get anything more for either you, you pull the trigger. If you can pull multiple 1st for Revis, you pull the trigger.
