I have to agree with the Hunter analysis as well as the notion that not addressing one position deserves to get him fired. Re-watched some games from the second half of 2011 not too long ago and watched WFH, and saw a few decent things from him, even though he sucked. When I re-watched the Giants game this morning, I watched every one of Hunter's snaps. I knew the guy sucked, badly, but I was shocked to see how bad he looked. I didn't see a single good block from him, at any point in that entire half. He was on his face on the ground by himself in the middle of three different plays. Once he blocked Moore in the back for 3 full seconds before he realized what he was doing, it was like he had his eyes closed. Once he had a run blocking assignment, failed to chip the DE and then ran right by the safety that made the play on Greene. I mean RIGHT PAST HIM. It's like he was trying to be that bad. I don't even want him on the field as a swing man after setting that. He looked worse than a rookie. I don't know how good or bad Howard is, but there is no way he can play even close to as terribly as Hunter last weekend.
I'm just mad that it took the 2nd preseason game for them to realize that Hunter shouldn't be starting. Why not sign Kareem Mckenzie he could have been had for cheap.
Ummmm, no. His mistake has been over the last 3 or 4 seasons hes drafted zero depth on O line. And you know this dude. He also gave Hunter a guaranteed 2.5 million after one of the worst seasons ever by an O lineman. And if hes not the one making the personell decisions ( and i agree hes not) then he needs to fire those who are.
He didn't 'give him 2.5 million' he just chose not to cut him... because we didn't have many options. Yeah, sure, we should have more O-line depth. Or possibly more mid-level FAs. All five starting offensive linemen now are home grown. Also, we've drafted a lineman in 6 out of the last 7 seasons, 7 total. Three of them start.
Hahaha, you have a long line to wait on. I might be nothing but pulp by the time your number comes up.
This is a terrible analysis though. Both by Tannenbaum and by you. Wayne Hunter had demonstrated that he was way below replacement level value. He was over 30, a point at which bad NFL players don't get even the whifff of a roster spot any more. He was very overpaid making nearly 3x the vet minimum. If Wayne Hunter is not an auto-cut in February last season then that category of player does not exist. Tannenbaum broke every rule in the competitive GM's book to keep Hunter and he badly damaged the Jets 2012 chances as a result of those actions. This is misleading. An NFL lineman's career is short and brutal. If you look at 2007 on, 5 seasons of drafts before 2012, the Jets drafted 3 offensive linemen over that period and none before the 6th round. The Jets drafted 1 offensive lineman in the 6th round from 2009 to 2011. We're short depth on the line because the Jets have neglected the line when they looked to bring talent aboard since 2007. We haven't drafted an offensive lineman before the 6th round since 2006. The roster has turned almost completely over since then with only 5 players on the opening day roster in 2006 still on the team: Mangold, D'Brick, Moore, Thomas and ESmith. You have to think the reason that the Jets line has holes right now is that the Jets haven't spent any value on it in the draft since 2006.
Wayne Hunter was 29 when he was extended, and this is mid-life for [decent] linemen and Hunter didn't have a particularly active early career. They're not running backs. Usually decreases in speed are offset by experience and increases in strength. I don't remember what was on the market last offseason, but it's pretty reckless to 'auto-cut' a player without having a clue who is going to step in for him. The response I'm expecting here is people crying "well we should have had more depth!" Hunter WAS the depth. Woody retired. I was not arguing that great decisions were made. There was a mix of bad planning and bad luck. But there are a few issues with calling this some kind of GM catastrophe. First of all, 2011 Wayne Hunter is getting judged as 2012 Wayne Hunter. 2011 Wayne Hunter played poorly, but within the overall realm of other bad starting RTs. 2012 Wayne Hunter is not playing like a rosterable player. If the joke is that Vladimir Ducasse isn't actually an offensive lineman, then you're right, we drafted 1 from 2009 to 2011. And hole. Not holes. How many teams have 5 solid-or-better starting linemen? The skill positions command a lot of money, unless you constantly have mid-late rough draft success, which is tough, if you're paying to have a full line, it's gonna cost elsewhere. If we let Darrelle Revis walk after next season, we'd have plenty of money to bolster the O-Line. Is that what we want?
I'm arguing that the decision to pick up his option and guarantee him this year, in 2012, was completely indefensible based on what he did last year. He was 30 this year. This isn't even a brainfart we're talking about, it's a full-bleed hemorrhage.
Br4dw4y5ux My exact sentiments. I remember hearing recently the Jets have had the fewest draft picks over the past 5 years than any team in the NFL.
I agree wholeheartedly. You don't give the worst starting RT in the league 2.5 million guaranteed in ANY universe.
It's not like they purposely gambled early rather than take somebody better. You can't predict the future. Some players look great in college but take a long time to adapt to the NFL. At the time, Gholston seemed like a great pick, as did Ducasse, who's starting to emerge. I don't think that the picks were denounced by the mock draft experts or anything. We have tons of scouts and talent evaluators. It's not like Tanny just looks at the guy and says he's good. If you're going to be hard on Tanny for Gholston and Ducasse, then you should be praising him for Mangold, Revis, Harris, and Ferguson. The truth is most late 2nd to 3rd round picks are projects and rarely capable of just jumping in and starting immediately. No training camp last year hurt Ducasse, but we're seeing him take big strides now. If he contributes this year, and ends up replacing Moore, it pays off.
Ducasse was never picked w/the intention that he would be a starter out of the gate. He is starting to emerge now in his 3rd season which is pretty much the smart football people expected from him. He was drafted too high perhaps but we'll have to see how his career turns out - he is just getting going.
I think cut / resign would have been better, but then again, we were already so thin at the position at the time, it would have been risky to let him go. We had nobody even close to taking his spot on the roster, very little affordable free agents available, and not exactly a great draft for tackles without trading the farm for Kalil. Decastro, Massie, people who we were criticized for not taking, are #2 on their depth charts. We need a difference maker now, not next year. Wayne Hunter did succeed in his role when he was a backup, he's just overpaid now. Yes it was a mistake, but I can see why it happened. This game will be a much better indicator of how the season will go, than the last 2 that's for sure. We'll see how Howard fairs, if he struggles, I think the FO will press harder for a trade.
Some folks want to trash Mr. T for one decision (re-signing WFH) but somehow they seem to conveniently forget that Mr. T has a pretty damn good record - he has drafted Brick, Mangold, Revis, Harris, Keller, Sanchez, Slauson, Greene, John Connor, Wilson, Wilkerson, Bilal Powell and now Coples.
You conveniently left off Vernon Gholston. lol The problem with measuring a GM by his draft choices is there is fair amount of luck involved both good and bad. If you are going to say Gholston was bad luck I could say Greene or other picks happened to be good luck and not directly attributed to any skill on the behalf of the GM. And for as many picks that have turned out good just as many have turned out bad but I really don't feel the need to itemize them.
Right, nobody would accuse the dark siders of forgetting vernon gholston, therefore he wouldn't be on the list of those who the dark siders conveniently forget. get it?
yes. bilal powell drafted in 2011 in the 4th Rd he has shown marked improvement and looks to now be clearly ahead of Mcknight. He has looked excellent in camp and is getting most of the 3rd down reps w/the 1s. Pretty damned good job this far for a 4th rd pick out of Louisville. But somehow you don't see dark siders mentioning that pick when they want to go on yet another idiotic fire Tanny tirade.
I hope like every other Jet fan that Powell does amount to something, but to include him NOW in a list of players to highlight Tanny's successes is premature and unwarranted. Why the Gannaway pick if Powell was expected to break out? And while this might not be the most popluar of opinions, Keller is extremely overrated. He has not come close to producing what you would want from someone u traded up into the first round to select. He is worthless in the running game, and not even in the top 10 of receiving threats in the league at the TE position.
