Wow I could not disagree more with this entire thing. First - Stanton: the only value Stanton brought to the Jets was having just another guy who once had some potential in to potentially allow that potential to suddenly blossom out of nowhere should something go severely wrong with Sanchez. The Jets clearly target players that either have a ton of talent and have had a good career on that talent thus far OR were considered to have had a ton of potential but failed to attain the level of play that the talent dictates - Stanton fits in perfectly with that MO. Realistically if Stanton ever took the field then the Jets are on borrowed time at that point. He could reasonably be expected to not mess it up, as would any other backup QB in the NFL, if only being required to run the show for a game or two. Over any extended period of time though and we're already talking about next years draft. Second - jumping on opportunities when they become available is not the same as panicing. If the Jets didn't have an established QB here and were going into the season with Stanton as their starter and exited the draft without a QB and THEN gone and acquired Tebow... then yes it would've been a desperation move that screamed "save the ticket sales" but the fact is no matter how popular the guy is he's not going to cause a massive spike in PSL sales when he'll be lucky to hit his 20 snap target each game. No one pays thousands of dollars for a bench warmer. Bigger picture Rex Ryan and Sparano have a vision for the offense that includes a role that they felt Tebow would be an upgrade at. Teams always want to get better in the spots where they really feel they can be top tier and this is certainly the case for the Jets with the run offense. Celebrity status or not Tebow provides a dynamic out of the QB position that very few QBs in the NFL provide without being considered completely elite in and of themselves (Vick, Newton). The ONLY reason Tebow is getting the attention that he's getting about potentially deseating Sanchez is because of who he is and what he believes in. It's all socially fueled. From a football standpoint - it's bullshit. If you want to look beyond the football as to why Sanchez won't be dethroned then simply follow the money. The Jets are handcuffed to Sanchez for the next two years. Sanchez has two years to fall on his face before his career and his position really come into jeapordy.
The same to you. I am not so in love with my take on the team of late that I prefer to adhere to it and give up hope, so when a reasonable person such as yourself has a different point of view, I pay attention. I am hoping to see something I missed that could change my view to a more positive one. Ftr I am hardly down on all the younger players. My favorite is Kerley, who imo showed much improvement and potential as the year went on. Wilkerson impressed also in holding down his starting job, although he did not get many positive calls, either. But it's a good start. The others, unfortunately, I have a more mixed view of. Wilson as a first round pick imo should be further along by now. He showed improvement over his rookie year, but his rookie year was pretty bad. McKnight looked good at times, but as you acknowledge was inconsistent, and hopefully will put that behind him. I have real concerns about Connor and Greene, though. Connor may well continue to improve, but he's not shown much. Greene has been out there a good deal by now, however, and he makes me nervous over his durability and what appears to be a lack of energy. I am concerned at this point that he will never be dependable, over time, as a productive every down back. His contributions seem better suited to being used in complementing a change of pace back to be used about as much as him. But... it is possible they will all show improvement this year, which will help a good deal. Assuming the combined emphasis on Ground and Pound, the lack so far this off season of any roster moves to bolster the running game, and the probability that no high draft pick will be used on a running back, the three RB's in the aforementioned will have to step it up a great deal for the Jets to have any chance of improving over last year. One last point - I agree with your point about the spotlight as long as trying to remain in the spotlight does not detract from good football strategy. WHere we disagree, apparently, is I do not believe the Tebow trade was part of an overall good football strategy.
I guess Rex really did change the culture if falling apart is 8-8. I haven't been around or remember any of the early 90s Jets, but I still remember plenty of losing and lost seasons and struggling to get wins. As bad as the 8-8 felt while losing 3 straight, there were 12 teams with a better record, 7 teams with the same record and 12 teams with a worse record. I guess we "fell apart" to middle of the pack.
The hot button issue really has two parts, since if Tebow replaces Sanchez, that's only the first part. The second part is what does that do to the team? Imo if Tebow starts, he is more likely to fail or be as mediocre as Sanchez than that he will be better. If he is merely mediocre, what is accomplished by changing Sanchez out for him? Nothing of substance. In the meanwhile the Jets will degrade Sanchez's value going forward, either by remaining on the roster, which will not make sense, or in a trade. And then there's his guaranteed payment in 2013 to deal with under the cap as well. Even if he outright fails, and is clearly worse than Sanchez, where does that leave the Jets? Put Sanchez back in? Trade Tebow for even less than the Jets spent on him? Get rid of both, under the cap? EVen if he is better, is that only marginally better or significantly better? Personally I think there is little if any chance that Tebow ever becomes a top tier Qb.
1-15 is FALLEN apart. As in broken. Falling apart is a term that describes a process. The Jets moved from two Champ Game appearances to a mediocre 8-8 record, out of the playoffs. They lost 5 of their last 8 while trying to make the playoffs. The season showed them heading in the wrong direction. Whatever they had going the prior two years, they had less of. Falling apart may be an overstatement if the argument is that a precipitous decline at this point is inevitable. But it is not unfair to the extent the argument is the Jets were heading in the wrong direction
The bolded part is the absolute truth and the reason why I believe Sanchez won't be swapped out for Tebow. If the Jets did the swap purely from a football standpoint and not due to injury or some other uncontrollable reason then that is exactly what will happen. There is absolutely no benefit to the Jets to use Tebow beyond a specialist role. Tabloids don't win Super Bowls. Sanchez can lead the Jets to a Super Bowl but the Jets need to stick beyond him even if things go south initially. They need to reinforce their full faith in him and give him the chance to continue growing.
I don't know how the Jets "reinforce their full faith in Sanchez" now. Yes, they can (and should) leave him in even if he initially goes south for some games or even the first 1/4 of the season. That would show support and Rex will most certainly do that. But they've already exhibited that they do not have "full faith" in him or they wouldn't have brought Ringling Bros to town. Yes, I do believe Sanchez is capable of leading the jets to a SB but only under ideal conditions (G&P is working, O-line holds up, no injuries, shut-down DEF, etc.). However if, after 4 games, we see a reincarnation of the same Sanchez of late last season, there's going to be a TON of pressure to do something. I'm not saying that Tebow will fare any better (BB has it right), but it's possible that a combination of Sanchez not looking good and Tebow looking good in Preseason and practice to warrant a change. And yes, this is a HUGE decision that (if it comes) will not be taken lightly by the coaching staff. Huge implications. But I'm trying to look at the positive side of this. Maybe we're l;ucky to have the Tebow option instead of basically no option at all or nowhere to turn. Stanton was not an option, IMO. And of course the slight chance exists, if this is what happens, that Tebow has developed more, carries the team as well or better than he did in those games in Denver, and we go on to Home Field PO Heaven and maybe the big dance on his God-Fearing back. Now that's a good problem to have.
I understand the logic of your point, but imo it leaves out much. What you are basically saying is you are counting on Sanchez to at least be adequate enough to keep his starting job. Tebow at most will be a change of pace Qb, but more likely will be used in an augmented Brad Smith type role. I suppose at this point that is the best we can realistically hope for. What you nonetheless leave out is: What the Jets gave up for Tebow. It was not the world, to be sure, but I don't see why they needed to give up anything for him, unless there is some benefit to changing up the O as indicated. Changing up the O. I see more downside to this than upside. The Jets are already going to be installing a new O. The emphasis for Sanchez should have been reading D's better. Instead he will have to learn plays run for Tebow, or get off the field if Tebow is behind center. There is too much risk of lack of continuity and support for Sanchez. Meanwhile I don't expect Tebow to be effective in this role. Tebow Fan Involvement. This is where those counting on Sanchez are whistling past the graveyard. Look what happened to Orton last year. I don't think Sanchez is mentally tougher than him. Orton had the after effect of the prior year's injury to deal with, and Sanchez should be healthy, but other than that, I don't see any real difference going forward. There is certainly a risk that the Tebow fans along with those already down on Sanchez will undermine him. The Locker Room. They may be making nice noises right now, but don't think for a minute this situation is not capable of being a problem again. Tebow's presence will imo make it more volatile.
What faith? They have no faith in him. They huddled at the end of last season to decide whether they would cut him or keep him, everybody reported that. Then they went after Peyton Manning hoping aginst hope that he would somehow sign with the Jets. When that didn't happen they gave Sanchez what turns out to be a one year extension and a few milliuon more in guaranteed money. Before the ink was dry on that they broght in Tebow and I wouldn't be surprised if they don't draft even another QB between the 3rd and 6th rounds too. Faith? There is no faith.
The way I see the acquisition is that it is backwards thinking rather than forwards thinking. The Jets falling in the running game last year wasn't because of the o-line / running back combo alone - it's also because of the loss of Brad Smith. Last year they removed an entire component of what was working about Schottenheimers shitty offense and allowed it to be exposed even more for what it really was - incompatible with Rex Ryan's vision and unimaginative. When drafting any player in any round the best case scenario is that you receive a productive player who gets on the field and contributes in some way. Obviously higher draft picks have higher expectations but by the time you get to the fourth round you're still expecting a contributor but more along the lines of the steady low end consistent contribution vs the every down 1st round contributor. By giving up a 4th rounder for a known commodity you know you're getting a player who can be put on the field and contribute something. As bad a thrower as Tebow is he's still a dangerous football player who can make good to great things happen. Imagine the Jets had drafted a guy in the 4th round who did EXACTLY what Tebow is supposed to do for the Jets... the only difference being that he's not Tim Tebow and doesn't have the following Tim Tebow has... I think Jets fans in general would be very pleased with that outcoming. That's the football logic behind the trade and the compensation for that trade. I don't think the Jets are necessarily changing up the O or forcing something different than what they already done. They're just going to do more of what Rex loved about the offense the two years we went to the AFCCG. Even better is that Rex can have much more faith in Sparano to actually execute his vision of the offense where as Schotty had his own agenda and was going to do things his way come hell or high water. Under the Rex Ryan regime this formula has been far more positive than negative and losing it only hurt the Jets last year. As far as fan contribution is concerned I believe it is incredibly overrated. If the Jets listened to the fans that much they would've picked Warren Sapp over Kyle Brady. Also - if you use this message board as a sample size for Jets fans then the majority of Jets fans see this deal as being atrocious. Why wouldn't that translate to the stadium? If anything I can see Sanchez receiving a massive ovation the first preseason game as the fans express their support for him rather than Tebow. Sure there are going to be some Tebow lovers but they are coming in from the outside - they are not built in. They won't overwhelm New York overnight ... certainly not while Sanchez has a firm grasp on the job which until he goes and totally shits the bed he will. I honestly don't know how Tebow will affect the locker room so I can't comment on that.
Tannenbaum is too cap savvy to risk the salary cap imploding with guaranteed money on a guy who they have no faith in. I honestly believe they saw Peyton Manning as just being too good to pass up on. He is the best quarterback of the last generation after all.
Here's the thing, and I'm saying this purely as a starving Jets fan. I don't give a damn about Mark feeling undermined. I don't care about Mark's feelings or if he's mentally tough enough to take this challenge. We're well beyond that now, and as Don says, they were looking at options as early as the tail end of last season and Mark already knows that. As a Jets fan wanting to win, what is going through Sanchez' mind is of little concern to me. I was freezing my nuts off sitting up there watching Neil O'Donnell throwing INTs before Mark was even born. Sanchez' feelings concern me not one iota. I know this is harsh. I know this is not well-received by Sanchez supporters. But this is the NFL. As a Jets fan, I want the best opportunity on the field that I can get to bring us to the Dance for a fucking change. If that turns out to be Mark and Tebow sits all season and wants out in December, so be it. But if it means sitting Sanchez after a reasonable period of losses and bringing in Tebow if he looks like a better fit, I'm all for it. What's a reasonable time period? I have no clue, but we'll know it when we see it.
Here's the problem I have with the entire Sanchez / Tebow debate... people are only framing it in Sanchez vs Tebow terms... why won't anyone acknowledge the possibility of Sanchez AND Tebow. Sure it's unconvential but I really believe that's what the Jets are thinking right now.
Ftr, on a personal level, I couldn't care less about Sanchez's feelings. My only concern is for the effect measures taken and not taken will have. The players are human beings. The Jets may not owe nicey nice behavior to Sanchez at this point, if they ever did. But neither does it make sense to take an approach that leads to some less desirable result. Just wanted to claer that up.
