I would say Manning/Brady/Brees throw more in there. While Tebow/Newton rush for more. Those would be the outliers. Should everyone else be punished for having a RB that can do the job or having a coach that believes in protecting the QB and using RB's for their job? I was just pointing out something that does skew the stats a lot. Crediting some QB's for red zone TD's when other QBs can bring their team there and then let the team finish it off. It hurts their efficiency, but in the end, they did their job, correct?
My apologies. I'm just laughing over the fact that you consider this: ... to be a "technical football post". You want to get into a discussion about the technical benefits of having Tebow under center ? That's quick and easy. Even without running the Option, it evens the odds for the offense and forces the defense to defend another person that they otherwise wouldn't in most cases. Say that the Jets have a 6 man Oline with a TE. They have a QB and a running back. That's 8. Say they also have 3 receivers. That's 11. With most QBs, the defense would have to cover the 3 receivers, the one TE and account for the RB. That's 5 people in total, leaving 6 defenders. You have 5 blockers left, that leaves the defense with a +1 advantage. Now, with Tebow being a serious threat to run, that +1 advantage is gone and the numbers are even. If you want, we can get into how the Read/Option puts the numbers even further into the favor of the offense.
My apologies, I should have been more clear. I agree with what you are saying about QBs that have effective RBs. These numbers are skewed a bit and do put them at a disadvantage, just as you explained. I was trying to point out that any "fix" to that must be sure not to penalize QBs who run the ball for TDs inside the 10, as opposed to passing the ball like other QBs do.
OMFG! You countered with that??? That's like a peewee league description of football. Thanks for the effort but maybe instead of counting the numbers of little men on the TV, you should stick to the lame stats the other guy has been posting.
Numbers are exactly what they are and tell the story relative to what values were recorded. It's when people present them in a misleading way that becomes the issue.
First, great job on the analysis whichfan... Second, your statement above about dual run/throw threat QB's will play out with RGIII and Luck going 1/2 in the draft. Luck is a young 'stand and throw' Payton Manning while RGIII is the dual threat you mention. It will be interesting to see which QB fairs better in 2012.
Yeah, it's peewee league. I dumbed it down enough so that you wouldn't get lost trying to follow it. But, guess what ? That is what the NFL is about. The numbers game. Think about this. Why do Defenses play zone ? It's so that they don't have a 1 on 1 matchup, but rather, have 2 on 1 because teams want numbers in their favor. Why do teams line up with unbalanced lines ? To have numbers in their favor if the other team doesn't adjust. Why do QBs even bother with the PAP ? To get the safeties and LBs to commit to the run, and to leave them with 1 on 1 coverage. Football is all about trying to get better matchups and make it so that you have the numerical advantage.
Have to think, at this point, it's skewing due to the small sample size. If not, watch out Oh, but wait, he plays for the Titans, so even if he is that good, it won't matter
Of course the numbers are insufficient. Tebow went 2 for 8 for 69 yards and 1 TD and had a 102.6 QBR. Tebow went 4 for 10 for 79 yards and 1 TD and had a 101.7 QBR. These are the type of numbers we are dealing with here.
I think dual QB's will always have a spot in the game, they always have. The new thing though, is these QB's are getting bigger. Look at Big Ben, Newton, and Tebow, bigger QB's who can run. However, Big Ben still has been plagued by injuries. Will Newton and Tebow be able to sustain all the running with the beating? If rules keep on going to protect QB's then maybe so.
If it were just numbers, you would be a college HC. Sadly, it's also about misdirection, timing, precision execution, gameflow and momentum. And if it's all the same to you, you can abandon the false pretenses about understanding the game and get as technical as you want. I doubt it will be much, but maybe you'll surprise me. Of course football is about matchups. The only reason Tebow was effective at all late in close games was that teams get too happy to protect the pass and they give him running lanes to game quick chunks of yards. He can create with his feet, and that's good, but without the ability to do that for an entire game, he's useless as a starter. Vick was faster than anyone on the field so he could get away with not being a good passer for years. Tebow is not that fast and in effect is concussion bait. Probably one of the reasons Elway couldn't wait to get rid of him. It's about much more than matchups. Just saying it's matchups is as lazy as posting a box score.
Ok whichfan, we get it. Tebow is Montana fused with Alstott. It's not a matter of if but when will he lead his team to the Super Bowl.
Just an FYI, misdirection is an attempt to make the numbers favorable to you You asked for "technical benefits of Tebow under center", I gave them. If you had a "traditional pocket passer" standing back there, it wouldn't matter if the running lanes were open, as the QB wouldn't be running. Then, when the defense does switch over to try and halt Tebow's running, that opens up the passing game, see the Pitt game.
