Fair enough. I watched every pass that Tebow attempted and threw this year, most of them, a number of times as I have the games right here on my PC. He accurately threw just about every "NFL pass" that QBs are supposed to make. He also threw quote a few passes into the dirt and was way off target on too many passes. That's why I say that he's inconsistent. BUT, he CAN pass. He hit crossing routes. He hit passing routes. He hit sluggos. He hit fades. He had deep outs. He hit some timing passes. He hit backs out of the backfield. He hit screens. He hit every kind of pass that a young QB is expected to hit, he just didn't do it all the time and when he farked up, they looked terrible. In my book, IF you can hit everything, just not consistently, that means that you can improve. All you have to do is become more consistent, as opposed to trying to do things that you've proven you can't do. If you will, it would be like me running a sub 4 minute mile. If I had 50 attempts and hit 4 mins 45% off the time, that is PROOF that I can do it. I just need to correct the mistakes that I made the other 55% of the time, and become more consistent. That's different from me NEVER running a 4 min mile. If I NEVER did it, then there's no indication that I ever could. See what I'm getting at ? Again, I don't know that Tebow WILL be a good/great QB. I just think he has amazing potential and that time will tell. Learning and experience will do nothing but help him improve.
OF COURSE we don't know what will actually happen, and OF COURSE we can't take what Ryan and the rest say as gospel. But... if you just wanted a conventional backup, the Jets should have stayed with Stanton. The logic of getting Tebow is you use him. And not just one play a game, either. Regarding your last sentence, it is difficult enough massaging your regular O to take into account the opponent each week. Trying to do that in the context of a weekly recalibration of the balance between two Qb's, and the kind of plays they are better at, starts sounding awfully complicated to me.
Anyone can hit any type of pass just not consistently. I can shoot NBA 3 pointers just not consistently but because I hit a couple that means I could improve and be a great NBA 3 point shooter? No. The mechanics and throwing ability of a good NFL QB is just not there. I love what Tebow will be able to do for us running the wildcat but if he was going to be our starting QB I would be very frightened.
You keep missing the point, and to such an extent one has to wonder if it is worth trying to get you to see it. His mechanics are off. With poor mechanics you can occasionally still make a good play. But you will lack consistency and consistent accuracy. Tebow has already been in the NFL two years, and knew he was eventually going to play in the NFL some time before that. Yet he has failed to change his mechanics into what is necessary to play NFL Qb at a consistent and effective level. John Elway is one of hte best Qb's to ever play the game. Anyone who's ever been to Denver knows his stature in that town, in that fanbase. Yet that was all overwhelmed by Tebow Fans. Elway got to see Tebow up close, and he decided to make a move that meant Tebow would be gone. That tells me a great deal. I trust Elway's judgment more than agenda driven Tebow Fans, or homer Jet fans, too, for that matter.
The way to make this work is to have Tebow in the huddle, with Sanchez, on most if not all offensive snaps. He will line up as H-back or tight end or quarterback. The defense won't know who will be the QB on any given play until they line up. And, didn't Sanchez show that he had great hands on Hard Knocks? He could run a pattern and catch the ball once in a blue moon. And if Sanchez goes down... I'd elevate McElroy to starter and keep Tebow doing the same.
You totally missed my point. I never said we would have been better last year if Tebow played over Sanchez. I'm pointing out that if he was on the roster we don't lose those two games. he provides us with another option and playing him in certain situations will definitely help us ... and I'd bet anyone on here that if they really do bring him in for 6-8 snaps per game, our offense scores more points in 2012 than they did in 2011 because he'll keep the chains moving.
I will grant you his throwing motion is ugly, and at times his accuracy is flat out bad. But we can probably think of other NFL quarterbacks that couldn't make all the throws that well (Chad?) or that had an ugly throwing motion (Kosar). I don't see why people think that Mark can improve (as he has) every year but Tebow can not. While the throwing motion is ugly, he's had 300 yard games against NFL defenses, it's not like the guy can't throw the ball at all. He threw the ball pretty well in this comeback vs the dolphins: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PKxQ3ZBQOMU&feature=related When he can't pass against two good corners, his running makes up for it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&feature=endscreen&v=8KR638W3tRc Against the Raiders, you can see how wide open some of his WR's as the raiders try to account for Tebow running (and how he successfully hit his open WR's) http://youtu.be/dut7UhIISBw?t=2m15s I think the guy is worth trying to develop. If his ceiling as a passer is to be as good as Mark is now, he will be unstoppable due to his running ability.
My point is there were games were Sanchez sucked where you could argue that Tebow gets us more points. There were several games were Sanchez didn't suck that we might have scored less points if we pulled him for the option. If Shillings stays healthy and we improve the OL we will score more points in 12 than we did in 11. The argument that a gimmick O run for 6 to 8 plays a year will outscore a crappy O run by a bad QB isn't really the point. The question is how do we get to a SB. I suggest a better O run by a better throwing QB is the way. Tebow isn't in the same league as Sanchez when it comes to throwing the ball. Because he isn't I don't think taking out Sanchez for Tebow improves our ability to score.
I just wanna make one thing straight for EVERYBODY that keeps saying Tebow is gonna run the wildcat. the "wildcat" is when a RB or WR lines up at QB. Tebow is a QB so its not the wildcat, its just a shotgun snap really....
That is incorrect. Read this. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wildcat_formation They say Tebow is going to run the wildcat because that's what Sparano and Rex have said they want to use him in.
I haven't missed the point at all as I've said that he still needs to work on his mechanics. Apparently, you believe that at any given point in development, a QB throws the ball the same way every time. This is evident by you saying that his mechanics are off. YES, sometimes his mechanics are off. Other times, they are just fine. That's a question of CONSISTENCY. He needs to repeat the "good" mechanics that he has at times. If you will, it's like watching a pitcher who pitches really well at times, and other times, not so well. You'll see that his mechanics change from pitch to pitch (and I'm not talking about the subtle difference between ball placement or whether he's throwing a slider or a fastball.) Rather, his shoulder might drop, he might come further over the top, his stride might be different, yada, yada, yada. It's the same way with a batter. It's the same way with a golfer. You have to learn good mechanics to be sure, BUT, then you have to repeat those mechanics until you become consistent with them. You have to burn them into your muscle memory. You have to make it second nature so that you don't have to think about it, you just do it. That comes with experience and repetition.
Elway also has his vision, i.e. "conventional wisdom", of what a QB should be, i.e. a traditional pocket passer. Tebow doesn't fit that mold right now, and Elway had a chance to get Peyton freaking Manning. If someone like Elway had been the VP of the Broncs back in '83 and someone of Peyton Manning's talent had been available, then John Elway wouldn't have lasted long as the Bronco's QB.
the problem with this logic is that great athletes have shown to be suspect in their ability to evaluate talent or coach talent. Michael Jordan drafted Kwame Brown with the number one pick in the draft. clearly his ability to play doesn't translate to an ability to evaluate, so the "Elway was a great player so I will trust his judgement" position isn't infallible.
Mmmmm, probably not. Elway was as highly touted as they come, and even if the Broncos had a chance to get the 1983 equivalent of Peyton Manning - a Hall of Fame player on the back nine - there's no way they would have done it. They essentially gave up two first round picks for him. Manning gave Elway the perfect out. Like having something come up for work some night when you're supposed to see your in-laws or hang out with your wife's friends. He clearly did not believe in Tebow, and the Manning soap opera was his perfect chance to get out of it.
I agree that Elway didn't believe in Tebow, but, the real question is why. Did he think that Tebow would never be a good NFL QB ? Or, did he think that to get to the SB, you HAVE to be a "traditional pocket passer" ? Or did he think that while Tebow could become a good QB, Peyton Manning gave Denver the chance to win the SB right now ? You know, short term versus long term vision ?
We are not merely talking about drafting someone, and I am frankly surprised you would think such an analogy is applicable here. This is not merely Elway's assessment of someone as a draft pick. Elway has seen Tebow up close for two years. He has seen what he can do and what he can't do. And as GM for the Broncos he traded away a former number one pick for a 4th and sixth, and even paid half the money paid him this year just to get rid of him. Yes he was making room for Peyton Manning, but he's also paying Manning a ton of money and taking a real chance on Manning. This could blow up in Elway's face big time. If he thought Tebow could develop, or more to the point was a reasonable prospect for adequate development, the smart move would have been to pass on Manning. But Elway obviously did not think Tebow had a reasonable chance of developing into the kind of Qb the NFL demands for winning with consistency. He saw what everyone else saw, a player who surprised some at first with his ability to take off, but who played some horrid games down the stretch, mixing in a great effort at Pitt, only to suck against NE. That's a lot more than guessing on some draft pick. As you well know.
