You are so sadly incorrect. I go against simple minded folks such as yourself who don't bother to look at all the factors that go into having a good offense. There are plenty of guys in this thread who talk against him reasonably that you will never see me take issue with. I have my issues with him which people who actually bother to read and understand can see. You are blinded by your need to hate which makes most of your commentary nothing but drivel.
The proof being how close we came to winning that Steelers game. Starting off slow can sometimes put you in a hole you can't climb out of - no matter how clutch your QB is late in games.
I also am not free of criticism of BS. I just think if Rex and Mike thought there was someone who would be better in the OC position, they would have gotten him by now. Like I said in year one, maybe not, but in three years? No way. Your bolded part is another key issue. On the face of it one has to concede it would be ridiculous to assert the ONLY problem on the whole F'ing O is BS. Any rational discussion HAS to be about relative deficiencies. Yet it is rare to see any flamers aimed at BS acknowledge that he might not be the only problem. Rarely you do see BS flamers take account of Sanchez still developing, and ftr I do think BS has to be held in part accountable for Sanchez's development. But at this point, two years into their working together, two years into Ryan being HC, to say this would be a top five O if only we could see the last of Schotty is without basis. I frankly think it is laughable. One last point - it is true that some people are fired because it is impossible to work any longer with them. The implicit assumption is that there has to be someone better out there to replace them. But for someone with more marginal issues, in a specialized field of endeavor, when there's some learning curve and a limited amount of time before the season starts to bring in a new system? That is clearly not the same. The notion that BS should be given great credit for "getting" the team to two successive Champ Games is one I don't happen to agree with, but there is a related point I do. And that is that if you get rid of him you'd better be sure that his replacement does not in effect screw with the formula that got you this far.
against Indy Sanchez was high and wild all first half- was that Brian's fault? against NE we got it going early 2nd qtr, sometimes teams feel each other out to start the game. In Pitt the D allowed the Pitt O to control the ball all 1st half. I agree it's a concern w/ the slow starts but I'm not worried about that, I think as mark continues to mature we'll see those problems take care of themselves.
Maybe Rex likes having snacks with Shottenheimers son? Maybe Rex doesn't think O is that important since he seems to think he can stop any O anyway? He's a defensive guy who may simply not give a shit about the O and might just think on the margin it doesn't matter? Rex is known to have a bit of an ego and it's all about his D.
Like I said, he has issues and some people can state them without just spewing hate from all directions. I have no problem with people pointing out actual issues. If you through even the last 5 pages of this thread you will see there is tons of blind hate. You will see two guys in complete agreement that he is the worst thing to ever happen to the jets but their reasoning will be completely contradictory. People with no clue like that annoy me. People who see specific flaws, like first quarter scoring, red zone efficiency, etc, and can articulate reasons why he struggles there are well within their right to criticize. Some of that I may disagree with, like I know I think 1st quarter scoring is supremely overrated, but can still appreciate why someone would find that issue important. Me finding it overrated does not mean I'm cool with never scoring in the 1st quarter. It just means I don't see it as a deal breaker especially when the overall results the last few years have been better than pretty much any era in Jets history.
It's all premature to me. Hasn't BS been under an extended contract the last year or two? Doesn't it end after this year? I felt like BS did a good job with Favre more or less until the late collapse...but I assume there isn't a lot of coaching Favre to be done. You give him a play and he chucks it where he wants, what are you going to say to the guy? Before Favre he didn't have the weapons and didn't look good. Now he has the weapons but has had to baby Sanchez along. This year is the telling year. If he keeps babying him that's a BS/Rex/FO problem. But you're supposed to fire the coach when things aren't working. Since I have no interest in firing Rex, I fire BS. If he doesn't baby Sanchez this year but it doesn't result in production, then either Sanchez wasn't ready or BS isn't capable or some combination. Since it won't be time to dump Sanchez I would dump BS in either scenario. This is the year for BS to put up or go away. Not last year, not next year. If he can't produce satisfactory results, he has to go. A better option will present itself, or at least a comparable option who would have more upside just for the unknown factor. I assume play-calling will progress, but the FO needs to be ready to abort ship on BS if not.
Shotty does some strange shit. Makes some bad play calls during games but most of the time Sanchez is just in accurate and messes shit up. He needs to get more accurate if he's going to take the step into the top Qb's.
I posted pretty much this point yesterday and last week, as did some others including Alio. I agree, BS has much on the line this year, and not just for playcalling but also for his own responsibility in Sanchez's development. But it is also true that up until now it has been ridiculous to see all the blame heaped on him for the faults of the O. To my mind he has not been bad enough to single out for general responsibility. Like UKK said, there have been plausible critiques presented that focused on aspects of BS's performance. But imo they do not add up to saying the Jets would have been better with any number of other OC's in the job.
What constitutes satisfactory results? The O getting a lead in the AFC finals only to have the D carved up like a holiday turkey 2 years ago? A complete collapse by the D in the AFC finals for a full half of football? Lets face it the fan base is playing weakest link and the blame shifts from Sanchez to Shotzi depending on the particular game. The reality is the Jets have a good not elite D, a good not elite running attack and a young inconsistent qb. There are lots of aspects of this team that have to improve to really take the next step. The offensive production being one of them.
I'm not ready to say that either. I may be ready to say that after this year. I hope we're not having the discussion. I will say that it's an impossible situation to fire the OC if we make another solid but ultimately unsuccessful playoff run, so he has all of the protection in the world since that is fairly likely once again. If he gets canned he'll surely deserve it.
As a fan since the mid 60's I can't think of a Jets coach or executive who was canned that didn't deserve it.
I'd throw out Al Groh for arguments sake. I was a little young to really take the whole year in like I do now but he probably could have been given more than a year.
What makes you think Callahan would make a "simpler, less complex" system? And who says the positional coaches aren't part of the supposed problem? Your logic is ridiculously flawed. And without Schottenheimer's offense the Jets don't make it either. To say otherwise is what is laughable. Unless you can somehow provide proof of who would have had a rookie with a single year of college experience get us there. Could we have scored more? Sure. 12 teams scored more than us offensively last year. Could we have scored less? Yeah. Because 19 teams scored less. For the mathematically challenged, that makes our offense higher than average in terms of points scored. I guess that's all thanks to the defense though, correct? And that's exactly it. When people are rational, you can have a discussion. I have problems with Schottenheimer as a coach, no question. He makes play calls that I am dumbfounded by. He gets way too cute. The motions, and the wildcat drive me insane. But I can discuss those things like an adult. I can also see that Schottenheimer isn't the worst offensive coordinator in the world. Hell, he's not even the worst OC of the Jets of the past 10 years. Very mature. Something is laughable. It's not the guy speaking to you. I'm with you. If we don't score in the 1Q and neither does the other team, I feel like our team has done its job. Would I like to score? Sure. I'd like to score 60 every game too. I'll settle for winning.
Simple minded? Right. You don't know what factors I've looked at, so spare me your BS analysis. I guarantee you my reading comprehension and IQ are higher than yours, Ace. Hate? So typical of you mindless homers to accuse someone who disagrees with you. You make it personal. It's people like you who make Jets sites distasteful. FTR I don't "hate" BS. I liked BS at first and defended him against early criticism, and still give him credit when and where credit is due. I liked his old man. Even with his dismal record in the playoffs, I would have hired Marty at that point in time when he was available and the Jets were looking for a HC, simply because I thought he would make the team better and more respected. At that point in time, I would have been happy to have a team that wasn't a joke every season and was at least in the hunt and competitive. Now, that isn't enough. You don't even know how to punctuate correctly, so so much for your reading comprehension skills.
You accuse others of making it personal, yet call people "mindless homers"? It's people like yourself who make places distasteful. And claiming your IQ is higher than someone else on an internet message board is probably the funniest thing I've read this week. Grow up there buddy.
You show your ignorance with your comments. BS's system is considered to be a complex system. I didn't say that Callahan would definitely make a "simpler, less complex" system. I said he could. As for the position coaches, if you knew anything, you'd know that Callahan is recognized as one of the best, if not THE best OL coach in the game. Ellard is also recognized as a great WR coach. I didn't defend the QB coach, in fact, I stated that might be a change that needed to be made. I suppose the offense's failings are all about the TE and RB coach. Right. You are so quick to defend BS and/or youkilledkenny that you don't even carefully read or understand what I have written in this thread or my position. You wouldn't know sound logic if it bit you in the ass. Those stats mean little. Of the 19 teams who scored less, what was their offensive talent like? How many serious injuries did they incur to key players? What is their OL like, is it one of the top 5 in the NFL? Did they have an excellent D to help them out? There's no way to prove any of this point even if you could put BS as the OC of each of those 19 clubs under the exact same circumstances, and give each of those 19 OCs a chance to see what they could do with the Jets' offense under the same circumstances. I didn't say he was the worst in the world or even the worst Jets' OC of the past 10 years. That is your strawman.
