yes he did, watch the tape. every player drafted is talented but there are a million busts. If jackson and Johnson were good players they would have caught on w/ other teams and still be in the league. That was poor scouting and drafting by NE. So what happened to watson's speed? Brady has had less talent to work w/ from day 1. Go check the talent Brady had w/ his SB wins compared to what peyton had for his SB win. The good news for colts fans is polian wasn't that stupid. I'm pretty sure BB would have taken Leaf 1st if he had the choice. Nope, it's his way of deflecting. I have stated over and over how Manning and Brady make players around them better- that is not debateable but he has a hard team relaizing all the talent Peyton has had around him compared to Brady. Basically he thinks every time Indy wins it's b/c of peyton and when they lose it's b/c of everyone but Peyton and when NE wins it's b/c of Belichick not Brady.
No he didn't. Garcon was quiet outside of the big TD reception. Had Jackson or Johnson played with Manning it's likely they would not have turned out to be complete busts. Manning has turned players w/ less talent and skill into extremely productive players. Watson left NE and turned in his best season of his career w/ a rookie, an INT machine and a below avg QB throwing to him. Clearly he is a weapon in the passing game. Ty Law, Willie McGinest, Mike Vrabel, Troy Brown, Antowain Smith, Richard Seymour, Lawyer Milloy, Tedy Bruschi, Mike Compton, Kevin Faulk, Tebucky Jones, Anthony Pleasant, Joe Andruzzi, Damien Woody and the greatest kicker in NFL History Adam Vinatieri. Yeah, Brady was surrounded by plenty of talent. It's not my way of deflecting. It's my way of making a point that you say every other player on the Colts is the reason Manning is great. You may say "Manning makes his players better" but by your posts you clearly don't mean it.
Outside of the ONLY TD Indy scored and the big 3rd and 8 to set up the FG to make it a 1 pt game. besides that he didn nothing:lol: Of course b/c Manning makes players great- I guess that is why Jerome Pathon wasn't good and why he was better after he left Indy. Watson became a full time starter in Cle for an offense that targeted the TE. he lost 3 yards off of his average from the year before w/ Brady and 2 TDs despite playing less w/ Brady. You put Antowain Smith, Mike Compton, Tebucky Jones, Anthony Pleasant and Troy Brown in your list of talent?:lol: using that criteria Marshall Faulk Reggie Wayne Marvin Harrison Edge James Addai Clark Marcus Pollard Tarik Glenn Ken Dilger Jeff Saturday Adam Meadows Dominic rhodes Ryan Diem Qadry ismail Dwight Freeney Bob Sanders cato June Robert Mathis Gary Brackett Antoine Bethea and the greatest kicker in NFL History Adam Vinatieri. It's obvious who was surrounded by more talent. Great QBs make players around them better but Peyton is working w/ more talent and making more talented players better. he has had the edge in talent his entire career outsode of maybe 1-2 years.
Garcon didn't have a big day. A quick slant when Cro was playing off coverage isn't what I would call "beating Cromartie all night". Compton solidified that OL, Antowain Smith was a dominant inside runner who always picked up the critical yards, Troy Brown was a very good receiver, Anthony Pleasant had 6 sacks in 2001 and Tebucky Jones was a 1st round pick. Pathon wasn't better when he left Indy. You have a better chance to get a higher average when you catch fewer passes. TD's is a stat that doesn't show a true value of a receiver. Clearly he was a weapon that was not used in NE, but was used in Cleveland. Peyton makes his teammates better. Brady has been given weapons and none of them developed the way Manning's teammates have.
Cro was as responsible for that TD as Pool was and it was Indy's only TD. 5 recs for 112 yds and a TD is big and just b/c he "only" had 5 recs doesn't mean he wasn't open at other pooints in the game. he was the best player on the field for the Colts besides the QB, he did the most damage. Compton played 2 years w/ Brady. Antowain Smith was a pretty average runner. He was over 4 YPC just twice in his career- as a rookie and his first season in NE. he is the definition of average. Pleasant was a hold the fort guy at the end of his career. Troy brown was a nice player and coincidentally had his best year(and only 1,000 yd season) when Brady became the starter in 2001. Tebucky Jones was an average at best player, it's nice that he was a 1st rd pick but he didn't live up to being one. His yds per and TDs went up when he left Indy and he did it w/ Aaron Brooks at QB. Cleveland doesn't have any weapons on that offense, the QB doesn't temnd to have alot of time to throw and he throws short passes to his big TE. I'd love to see the target #s for Cleveland's receivers. Brady and pey5on make teammates better, Brady takes less and does more w/ them including winning SBs w/ average offensive talent around him.
No, I am jobless and homeless. Can you spare a dime? I love how people come after me- is murrell not doing the same thing?
If I wanted to come after you, I would have written a lot more with a lot more profanity and insults. Neither is evident in what I wrote. Please stop crying and put your defense shield down for a min. I think it's a totally reasonable question, that could possible answer the many more I have regarding some of the things you write. You write these incredibly long posts and not just in the beginning or end of the days, but scattered throughout. I am just trying to figure out how you have time for this debate, which is you verse everybody else (almost) on such a consistent basis.
why not ask murrell or the tons of other posters posting every day? I would love to tell you exactly what I do, it would be interesting and relevant to the board but I don't like to post too much personal info. Thanks for asking though.
I'm not asking where, I am asking what, But whatever. It's interesting though that you think most people on this board would even care, because nobody does. I ask you because you post just as many times, three to four times the length per post. I don't give a crap personally, and I am pretty much convinced you are either retired or are leeching the welfare system.
Cromartie and Pool were both responsible for the TD, but Garcon wasn’t beating him all night. Compton was a huge signing that helped solidify that terrible OL A. Smith was instrumental in the Pats success in 2001. He didn’t have many breakaway runs, but was awesome in getting the yards he needed – especially in short yardage and goaline. Pleasant had a pretty good year in 2001. And you are undervaluing Troy Brown. Pathon was not better w/o Manning. In 2001 he was on pace for 117 receptions thru 3 games before getting injured. Even though it is unlikely he would have caught that many passes had he played the entire season, he was clearly better with Manning. Cleveland has one of the better young OL’s in the league. They have Joe Thomas, Eric Steinbach and Alex Mack. Their QBs aren’t getting killed and have time to throw. The Browns do have some weapons on offense. They have Peyton Hillis who is great out of the back field and two young receivers who may be really good as they get more time to work with McCoy (Robiskie and Massaquoi). Manning is given 1st round players like Harrison, Wayne, Edge and Clark and they turn into superstars. He’s given mid tier players and they end up becoming great/good players (Collie, Addai, Garcon, Stokley, Rhodes, Tamme). He plays with mediocre players and they become solid performers (Blair White, Jerome Pathon). Every player Manning gets he turns them into solid to top tier players. It’s not the other way around like you want to make it seem like. He loses Collie and Clark this year and without missing a step he turns Tamme and White into good players.
You got me, I am on welfare. Welfare also pays for my season tickets and paid for my road trips to NE and Pitt.:lol: I told you, I am homeless and jobless- I hope you can help me out.
Who was the best player on offense for the Colts against us(besides the QB)? The pats OL wasn't nearly as bad as people thought, it's amazing how the Ol instantly got better when Brady stepped on the fieldd and stopped holding onto the ball looking for big plays the way that statue Bledsoe did. Antowain Smith is the definition of average. He wasn't a difference maker, int he 2 games w/o Brady he averaged 2.5 YPC. Pleasant was a stopgap player, he had a decent year in 2001. I wouldn't name him as one of the most talented guys especially at that stage of his career. I think you are overvaluing Troy Brown, isn't it a coincindece that in year 9 he had his best season and that was the first season he played w/ Brady? I like Troy Brown, he's a guy every team would like to have- a welker type. Not great but a reliable option but he's not close to guys like Harrison, wayne or even Garcon. Through 3 games? seriously? through 3 games? Through 3 games this year sanchez was on pace for 32 TDs and 0 INTs Through 3 games this year randy Moss was on pace for 16 TDs His #s improved when he went to NO. The Browns don't have any weapons in the passing game. Mossaquoi has ability but w/ a young QB that is going to take time and that young QB targeted his big TE along w/ 2 other QBs who aren't good enough to really be playing in this league anymore. Mossaquoi had 36 recs, Watson 68. Harrison was on his way to stardom before Peyton took over. he turns all these players into stars yet when it matters most he can't win w/ them- why is that?
Just post on the topic. if you wnat to join in on the discussion and you have valid points please post them, if not move along and stop taking this thread off track. If you have personal questions please PM me and I'll be happy to answer.
Outside of one play where there was a blown coverage Garcon was quiet. And in the most important play of the game (the one where you blame Manning for the loss) Garcon was the primary target and was blanketed by Cro. The Pats OL was terrible prior to 2001. They had 3 new starters from 2000 to 2001 and there was a reason for that. Antowain Smith was crucial to their run in 2001. Pleasant was one of many talented, important pieces to that 2001 team that helped Brady win the SB. Troy Brown had a good year in 2000 w/ Bledsoe. Once he got an opportunity to play he produced. Brown is a player that every team would like. Welker is much better though and you way overrate Garcon. His numbers DID NOT improve going to NO. Clearly he was producing w/ Peyton. He had 2 HUGE games before getting hurt in week 3. He had 22 catches in the first 3 games. w/ a rookie QB and 2 other QBs who aren’t good enough to be playing in the league Watson caught more passes than he ever did in NE. Harrison made it to stardom b/c of Manning. If the Colts had drafted Leaf instead, Harrison would have never been a HOF’er.
In a low scoring game he scored the game's only TD and then set up a FG on a huge 3rd down play. They were calling he Pats OL terrible the first 2 weeks of 2001 too, it's amazing how much better an OL looks when a decisive QB is in the game rather than one that holds onto the ball too long. Antowain Smith could have easily been replaced in 2001. I arguably the biggest game of the reg season for NE in '01 Smith ran it 12 times for 28 yds(2.33 YPC) against us. if we win that game we win the div. They could have replaced him w/ any # of RBs Pleasant was one of many hold the fort guys BB and co. brought in to help NE become more competitive. The man played 15 years and put up good #s in just THREE of them, 2 of them came w/ Brady at QB including his BEST season. he averaged 3 recs, 35.9 yds, .13 TDs per game w/ Indy In No he averaged 2.7 recs, 37.4 yds, .2 TDs recs down slighly, yards and Tds up and he averaged 1.9 more yards per reception- he was better in NO. again, Watson was a dump off option. You claim they have other weapons, they weren't getting the ball to those other weapons- thye were using the big TE to dump passes to. Harrison was well on his way to being a star before peyton was even drafted. They both grew together and helped each other become great.
I can't believe what I'm reading sometimes Now Antowain Smith was a dominant inside runner? Come on Jamal Lewis in his prime was a dominant inside runner
