There weren't rumblings that BB's job was in jeopardy. BB and Pioli are both excellent talent evaluators. With the top draft picks on offense why hasn't TB turned them into elite superstars like the ones who play with Manning? Branch put up the same type of numbers w/ Sea as he did with NE They WERE upgrades over what the Patriots had and they helped make NE a better team in 2001 than they were in 2000. Haley's offensive style is different from Weis'. That's why they didn't get along towards the end of the season this year. You're comparing a M. Faulk w/ a rookie P. Manning with a veteran R. Moss w/ a 8-10 year veteran T. Brady. Yeah good comparison. The "crap" around Brady is perfect for the system NE runs. I'm not believing what I want to believe. I know that it was Kraft who made the deal. You are trying to argue an incorrect point.
You are smarter than that. I said rumblings, I didn't say Bob Kraft held a news conference to announce Belichcik was on the hot seat. use some common sense. Columnists and radio hosts have sources w/in the team. When you hear rumors on those shows and in columns they are usually true. Awesome, they loved Belichick so much that they went against his wishes. Got it Parcells lost his personnel power. Bobby Grier was fired in May of 2000, Bledsoe didn't get his new deal until 2001, BB had the power to get rid of Grier and bring in Pioli so I find it impossible to believe that Kraft wouldn't at least consult BB on signing Bledsoe.
There were rumblings, the Pats fan backed me up on it. Brady's job is to win, not make players pro bowl players and BB/Pioli drafted well early but their drafts overall in the last decade haven't been great. Hitting big on a QB in the 6th round made alot of those other decisions look better. They certainly aren't as efficient at drafting as Polian who built 2 different SB teams and a 3rd team to the title game. Branch was much more effective in NE w/ Brady. The #s may be similar(but worse) but in NE he had a QB who spread the ball out and he wasn't Brady's top option. They were hold the fort guys, veteran presence to help the team compete short term while they continued bringing in younger players. They were not expected to win a SB in 2001. I don't know enough about Haley's style to really comment but I do know they clashed. You are acting like it was no big deal having Faulk. Peyton threw 28 INts w/ dumping it off to Faulk 80+ times, imagine how many INts he would have had w/o him? It's perfect for Brady as he could take any players and win w/ them. he was on the doorstep of the SB w/ reche Caldwell and Jabar Gaffney as his WRs- you'd agree those guys aren't as good as Wayne and Garcon, right? I guess Kraft didn't like or respect Belichick to go and give Drew that insane contract while BB didn't want him to.
Then go to Google News Archive and find me a columnist that said BB was on the hot seat. The fact is he wasn't. But please proove me wrong. Kraft made the deal. It's a fact.. Deal with it. Kraft is the one that made that deal with Drew.
:rofl: You have a Pats fan to back you up. Just provide me with the column that said he was on the hot seat. So in other words, Brady can't make players elite superstars like Manning does. Thanks no one is disputing that Branch is better in the NE system than the one in Seattle, but he didn't put up awful numbers in Sea like you are insinuating. He put up very similar numbers. They were brought in because they were upgrades and they were expected to make the team better. Which they did. I am saying (and I need to be clear apparently) that IT IS NOT THE SAME TO COMPARE MANNING AS A ROOKIE W/ FAULK TO BRADY W/ MOSS WHEN THEY ARE BOTH IN THEIR PRIME. Get it now? They win because he's a good QB for that system and they bring in good players to play in that system. Both Robert Kraft and Jonathan Kraft loved BB. Robert Kraft made the BB deal. Both of those two statements are facts. Deal with it.
A pats fan living in the area reading the local papers and lisetning to the talk shos has no credibility I have tried to go into the archives of Boston papers but you have to pay for old articles. i'm not paying for something I already know is true. Brady makes players that shouldn't be in the league look like good players and he finds ways to win w/ them. You act like the 1st rd TEs were bad players? Their #s weren't as good as Tamme b/c they worked in 2-3 TEs and they split up those #s rather than one TE getting all the production. The NE system:lol: You would think this system has won w/o Brady. They were brought in as stopgap players, they did their jobs and a 1st year starting QB guided them to an unexpected SB. They win b/c of Brady and how great he is, Indy doesn't win b/c Peyton struggles in big games. How did the Krafts love him at the time if they knew he didn't want to sign Bledsoe and they did so anyway? You just aren't a fan of logic. At no point during the last 2 years were there any rumblings about rex's job, there may have been fan complaints but there were never rumblings about his job security unlike BB in 2001.
Unfortunately for you it's not true. You are wrong. Belchick was not on the hot seat. But keep using that prediction article as your proof. Manning turns 4th and 6th receivers into what you call top level talent. Brady is given 1st and 2nd round players and they don't turn into top level talent. Why not? The NE system makes QBs better. They weren't "stop gap". They were upgrades from what they had. Brady hasn't been great in big games since Weis and Vinatieri left. I know you struggle with facts. Do a little research on the Drew Bledsoe signing please. This isn't a topic that even needs to be debated. It's like debating if the Civil War happened. There weren't rumblings about BB's job security in 2001.
The seat was getting warm which was why he was going to Brady soon whether Mo knocked out Drew or not. Name me the other QBs that have won big in that system? Brady IS that system. Stop gaps, guys expected to be there for a year or 2(as most were) to play until they got better players to replace them. He got NE to the doorstep of the SB w/ Reche Caldwell and Jabar Gaffmney as his main weapons in 2006 w/o Weis, he led a team to a SB and 18-0 in 2007. He's done better w/o Weis than Weis has w/o Brady. Why hasn't Manning been able to win more than one SB since they got AV in 2006? if Vinatieri was a main reason why is Manning 1 for 5 while Brady was 3 for 5? Yes there were rumblings. If not for Brady BB would be a DC somewhere today.
Um, no. If it's that important to you, knock yourself out. I don't think you can even access Globe and Herald articles from 10 years ago. I'm going on recollection here. I don't care if you don't believe it or think I'm wrong. After a 5-11 season and an 0-2 start, people started talking about how Belichick had failed in Cleveland and how he never won anything by himself, without Parcells. What possible reason would I have to make that up? What kind of monumental waste of time would it be to get involved in a disagreement on a rival board?
It didn't exist. There wasn't any talk about him losing his job or being on the hot seat. After going 0-2 everyone was talking about the Mo Lewis hit on Bledsoe and how Bledsoe almost died. Going into that game against the Jets everyone was talking about September 11th. There wasn't any talk about him losing his job. At least not within the organization which after all is all that matters. I've asked you guys to provide me with some Column that says he's on the hot seat and both of you have declined. I guess that really says something.
It wasn't warm. It wasn't anything. There have been an awful lot of QBs that seem to have quite a bit of success playing in that system. They were upgrades from what the Pats had the year before. They were brought in to make the team better. Brady hasn't done as well w/o Weis than he did w/ Weis. There weren't any rumblings. PLEASE PROOVE TO ME THAT THERE WERE. Show me something other than a "Prediction" article. You can't because there isn't any,.
I'm not going to read the whole thread, but I'm assuming you're debating the merits of two pussy-ass QB's who will dive to the turf if there's any remote possibility that they might actually take a hit. In that respect, I rate them as equals.
Washington acquired Jurgensen in 1964 in a trade for Norm Snead. Bill McPeak was the head coach in 1964 and 1965. He wasn't a good coach. The overall personnel was lacking, too. Otto Graham coached the team from 1966-68 with spotty results (17-22-3). Vince Lombardi took over in 1969 and whipped the team into shape. They went 7-5-2. He passed away after the season and the team went backwards in 1970 under Bill Austin. George Allen got the job in 1971 and then the team became good. Jurgensen was 37 years old and had numerous injuries. Newly acquired Billy Kilmer started 13 of the 14 games at QB for the Redskins that year. Jurgensen and Kilmer got along great (kind of like Mark Sanchez and Mark Brunell). 1972- Kilmer started 10 games, Jurgensen started 4 (team lost in the Super Bowl) 1973- Kilmer started 10 games, Jurgensen started 4 1974- Kilmer started 10 games, Jurgensen started 4 Yeah, in that way they are certainly not like Aaron Rodgers or Ben Roethlisberger.
Still don't believe it was Kraft that made the deal with Bledsoe? http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2001/03/07/sports/main276973.shtml
Dillholes on ESPN and hosts and callers in the sports radio world were saying that Belichick might not last long, but I doubt Belichick was in any trouble with the Patriots after the 0-2 start in 2001.
this isn't true at all. the only players on either offense that can be considered "top level talent" are wayne, clark and welker. wayne and clark are both 1st round draft picks while welker was undrafted.
How exactly do you know there was no talk w/in the organization? I don't make things up, I have a great memory. There were rumblings. The problem ios you are looking for a press conference from Kraft saying BB better win or else and that's not realistic so you hold to this notion there was no possible way they were disappointed in him. Interestingly none of those QBs have won playoff games(or meaningful college games) except Brady. I wonder why that is? It must be just a coincidence just like NE starting to win when he became the starter. Weis hasn't done well w/o Brady. Brady has done better w/o Weis than Weis has w/o Brady. How long do you expect a dynasty to last? They won 3 SBs in 4 years which is the best 4 year stretch in history- did you expect them to keep that up? It's hard to keep a dynasty going, look at the yanks in the '00s. As soon as you provide proof that there wasn't any talk w/in the organization b/c as we know you would know that. Once you do that I'll provide proof about the rumblings. That one quote taken out of context sure proves everything.:lol: I didn't say I didn't believe, I said if he loved BB why would he do this w/o BB being on board? You are blaming it all on Kraft and as usual whichever side you argue you never give any blame but I find it impossible to believe that Kraft would give up a 1st rd pick for BB then after his first season there would sign a player to a ridiculous contract that BB didn't want UNLESS Kraft wasn't happy w/ BB- that's the only possible explanation so either Kraft was souring on BB or BB approved of the move. They went 5-11 in 2000, they started 0-2 in 2001. That franchise was a sinking ship until coincidentally Brady became the starter and they started winning but it was all the grand plan of belichick b/c he is a genius.
