I'll go thru the rest of this later, but the bolded part is not true. A false statement by you. Please fix that or do some research. That deal was made by Robert Kraft.
On one hand you say the Krafts loved Belichick, if that was the case and BB told him he didn't feel comfortable w/ Bledsoe do you think he is giving Bledsoe the richest contract in the sport?
Okay, so I printed out that article. Read it with highlighter in my hand ready to highlight where it says there were very loud rumblings that he wouldn't survive the season and all I see is "and while there was still a little grumbling about whether belichick had the ability to be a successful head coach, for the most part things were pretty quiet". No where in that article does it say that Belichick's job was in jeopary or even allude to that being a possiblity. The FACT is that Kraft and his son loved Belichick. He wasn't going anywhere. Garcon beat Cromartie for one big play. That's it. You act like Tamme is a superstar that makes Manning better. He's not a scrub, but he's not putting up these numbers any where else and he's not a top 10 talent and isn't part of a top 10 receiving core. Hasselbeck is not a "good" QB anymore. He's serviceable and that's about it. Welker is the Pats best receiver. Those guys they brought in played major roles in winning the championship. Cassel can play in NE's system. that's the only time he's ever been successful. 3 AFCE teams won 9 or more games. It was much better than it was in 2007. Those great defenses carried the team in 3 Super Bowls - 2 of which the offense was completely non existant. Don't inlcude Faulk. Manning played with him for one year. NE invested top draft picks on the offense to play with Brady. Why didn't any of them ever become elite players like the ones that played with Manning? You seem to struggle with facts. It's not debateable about who made that deal with Bledsoe. It was Kraft who made that deal. If you want to continue to debate that, then fine. You'll be incorrect and will continue to spew misinformation like you have regarding Belichick's job security in 2001.
He loved belichick so much that he went against his wishes and signed Bledsoe to a mega deal? http://articles.sfgate.com/2001-09-06/sports/17618463_1_wild-cards-san-diego-ray-rhodes-denver That article doesn't discuss rumblings but rather the perception of BB pre-Brady. I'll have to check the game tape of that week 2 game. I am 100% posiitve there were rumblings about his job security at the time. I'll find articles. Tamme is a decent player, obviously Peyton makes him better but he had talent to work w/. This wasn't some bum off the streets. Hasselbeck was good for most of the years Branch was in Seattle. Some had big roles but they weren't brought in to win a championship, they were brought in to help stabalaize the Pats and help unsink that ship that was quickly sinking until Brady rescued them. How many playoff games has Cassel won in that system? The AFC East teams all played ridiculously easy schedules, that's what made our collapse so painful at the time. There's a reason Miami hasn't been a contender since that year despite having a better team in each of the last 2 years. Those "great" D's nearly blew 2 of those 3 SBs. If not for Brady they would have, then again if not for Brady they wouldn't have played in any of those SBs. We can't include Faulk but we can include Moss for Brady who played w/ him for 1 healthy year? Brady won w/ average talent around him, the one year he had Colt-like talent he led his team to 16-0 and another SB berth. Let's say Kraft made the deal, you say Kraft loved Belichick. if that is the case and BB didn't want to sign Bledsoe why would Kraft have done so? BB's hands are not clean in that deal, regardless of the fact he had no idea what he had in Brady until the 2001 TC we all know Bledsoe was not a good starting QB so it was an asinine decision that would have set the franchise back years if not for Brady emerging.
OMG. Now you have resorted to using predictions as your basis to say Belichick's job was in jeopard?!? :lol::breakdance: Please let me know where/what the "rumblings" were from Week 2. I'll clue you in....There wasn't any. But please look for articles.. So far what you've posted has been terrible. Brady has had two FIRST Round TE's to work with. Why didn't they turn out to be half as good as Tamme? Okay....so Hasselbeck was good most of Branch's years in Sea. Branch's production didn't change NE 4 rec/gm 52 yds / gm .3 Tds/ Gm SEA 4 rec/gm 48 yds/ gm .3 TDs / Gm They were brought in to make the team better which they did. Cassell has had success only when playing in NE's system. The Dolphins weren't a 1-15 team in 2008 and the Jets weren't a 4-12 team in 2008. The division was better. The Pats didn't have to take FOUR cross country trips in 2007. Who cares really. The Matt Cassel led New England Patriots won 11 games. The Matt Cassell led 2007 Patriots would have had double digit wins as well. Those great D's are the only reason they were in those games. Right, because comparing Manning w/ Faulk during Manning's ROOKIE year is the same as comparing Brady in his 8th and 10th seasons with Moss is the same thing Brady and the Pats won w/ above average talent. Most players were top of the league players including the greatest kicker inthe NFL HIstory. They also had superior coaching. It's not "Lets say Kraft made the deal", it is a FACT that Kraft made the deal. It's also fact (not subjective by me like you are implying) that Kraft and his son LOVED Belichick in 2001 and had no intentions of removing him.
I think we all know I have a great memory, I know I heard/read about it at the time. There were rumblings, it's one of the reasons Mo lewis doesn't get all the credit b/c BB was going to be going to Brady soon for fear of losing his job. Who cares about individual #s? Brady spreads the ball out more than Manning. Branch's last season in NE: 78 recs, 998 yds, 5 TDs Branch's 1st season in Sea: 53, 725, 4 TDs Branch's last season in Sea: 45 recs, 437 yds, 2 TDs Branch w/ NE this year: 48, 706, 5 TDs Branch in 4 games w/ Sea this year: 8.6 Yds per Branch in 12 games w/ NE: 14,7 yds per Averages per game: NE: 4.1 recs, 54 yds, .3 TDs Sea: 3.7 recs, 46 yds, .3 TDs They were brough in as hold the fort guys, they got a SB run out of it b/c they struck gold w/ Brady. Cassel has only played in that system and how many championships has he won? how many playoff games? Those "great" D's were headed for more non-playoff seasons until Brady rescued them and had Brady not rescued them in those SBs they would have lost 3 of 4 instead of one of 4. So you don't think having a dynamic rusher and receiver out of the backfield would help a rookie QB? Peyton has had that great kicker since 2006, how come he has only one championship? So Kraft made the deal and loved Belichick. Why in the world would he make a ridiculous move like the Bledsoe signing if BB wasn't on board? BB was involved one way or the other. He had no idea what he had in Brady, if he did that deal never would have been made to sign Bledsoe.
There weren’t any rumblings. You have yet to provide me with any viable information to prove otherwise. I KNOW that Belichick’s job was not in jeopardy with NE. Brady spreads the ball around more than Manning. They just go to half backs and WR screens. The question that I have posed to you is that Brady has been given talented players who were drafted in the top rounds. Why haven’t they developed into top tier players like the ones that play with Manning have? It’s great that you can pick and choose the stats you want but here’s what it boils down to: From 2002-2005 NE 4 rec/gm 52 yds / gm .3 Tds/ Gm From 2006-2009 SEA 4 rec/gm 48 yds/ gm .3 TDs / Gm They were brought in to make the team better and they did. Cassell did not play in that system in 2009. How well did he do in 2009? They carried the team in 2 of those SBs while the offense sputtered along doing nothing all game long. Marshall Faulk w/ P. Manning in Manning rookie season IS NOT THE SAME as R. Moss w/ T. Brady while Brady was in his 8th and 10th seasons. How many championships does Brady have w/o Vinatieri? BB was not involved in the Bledsoe deal. Do some reading on the subject. It’s not debatable.
There were absolutely rumblings, I don't know where I heard/read it but I have been saying it for 10 years. I don't make things up. Bill Polian is a much better talent evaluator than BB/Pioli. I didn't pick and choose anything, I posted the avg. per game w/ each team which includes his rookie #s w/ NE where he wasn't a full time starter. Seattle gave up a 1st rd pick b/c they thought Branch was a #1 b/c of what they did w/ Brady. he was a colossal disappointment in Seattle. They were brought in to hold the fort until they could bring in better players. Todd Haley had his first job in Charlie Weis' offense under Bill parcells w/ us here. I don't know enough about Haley's offense to know how simialr they are but he was a disciple of weis. Marshall Faulk had 86 recs in 1998, you don't think he helped out peyton? He doesn't have any but he did have an undefeated season and another SB app. Imagine Manning trying to win a SB w/ Jabar Gaffney and reche Caldwell as his main weapons or w/ the crap around Brady this year? Your efuse to answer the question about BB and Bledsoe. If you think BB had nothin to do w/ it then you are just belieiving what you want to believe. That was a 10 year $100 mil deal that sets the franchise back 5 years if they didn't get lucky w/ Brady.
I'd really rather not get involved here, and you guys are doing fine on your own, but that's a kind of asinine statement. Cassel wasn't great in '09 but he was a top-4 or 5 QB in the AFC this season. - 27 TD - 7 INT - 3,116 yards - 93.0 QB rating - Pro Bowl (as a replacement, yes, but he was still a Pro Bowler) And despite the first-round loss, he lead the Chiefs to a playoff berth and a division title when most pundits had them at around the 4 or 5 win mark in 2010. Cassel is also a very good running QB and makes a lot happen with his legs. If you think Cassel is no good, you must have a really harsh opinion of Sanchez!
He's talking about under Charlie Weis this past year in the "NE system". Let me ask you: Do you recall rumblings about BB's job security early in 2001?
There was absolutely "talk" about it, yes. Talk shows, columnists, etc. The Patriots had steadily declined under Pete Carroll and patience was running a bit thin. That said, I can't recall anything "official" from the team about it. But that shouldn't be surprising. The Patriots aren't forthcoming at all with matters that the team considers to be internal. Anyway, I personally think Cassel is not a scab of a QB at all. Keep in mind he played behind two Heisman winners at USC, and nearly started over Leinart at one point. Resume the debate. I'm enjoying it. :beer:
Thanks for your input. I wasn't talking about anything official from the team but there were rumblings that he better start winning or he wasn't long for the job. I also recall rumblings about Brady starting sooner rather than later before the Mo Lewis hit. Don't worry, this debate will never die.
You're DEFINITELY right about that. In "Education of a Coach," it talks about how Belichick was very disenchanted with Bledsoe and thought that he had been kind of shell-shocked by all the big hits he had taken. It annoyed BB that Bledsoe would hold the ball too long, waiting for a big play downfield, instead of taking whatever the opposing defense was giving him. Which, not coincidentally, describes Brady almost perfectly... force nothing, play smart, and don't give the game away. IIRC, Bledsoe's extension was mostly the result of Kraft and the holdover personnel guy (Bobby Grier) who awkwardly coexisted with Belichick and Pioli the first season BB was in NE. Grier was gone by '01, but Bledsoe already had his deal at that point. You've got to remember, along with Parcells, Bledsoe is the guy who put the Patriots back on the map after a decade of futility. It's an easy call in hindsight, but a lot of people around here, even after the Super Bowl against the Rams, wanted Bledsoe to get his job back for '02. Ironically Belichick had gone through a similar situation in Cleveland with Kosar and Testaverde. He wasn't going to make any decisions based on what fans - or his owner - wanted to see.
But how does the coach not give his approval on the Bledsoe deal? if BB didn't want him and they just hired BB how could they give Bledsoe that huge deal?
As a boss you can like an employee and still go against their wishes. It gets even easier when you have more money than God and an illusion as to your own genius. You might be familiar with that last part.
This isn't a normal boss-employee relationship. He just gave up a 1st rd pick and big $ to get Belichick and now he's going to tie his hands by forcing a QB on him? I find that impossible to believe. Can anyone just debate anymore? do we need the insults?
Look up the google newspaper archive and find me those columnists that made those comments. Really? You weren't talking about anything official from the team? Then why make the comments that his job was in jeopardy and that he wouldn't survive the season? I didn't realize that columnists and radio hosts made those decisions. Look up the google newspaper archive and find me those columnists that made those comments.
Whether you find it hard to believe or not is not the point. Kraft is the one who signed Bledsoe. Look it up.
There's a reason why Parcells (who had MUCH more clout than BB at that point) left NE to go to the Jets.
