It's never enough. The problem isn't our O as much as it is the fucking invisible pass D. Favre has done more than his fair share of winning games this year, but for most of the drama-queens that just won't be enough. He needs 100% completion ratings and he's only allowed to throw incomplete if a fucking meteor falls from the sky and changes the trajectory of the ball midflight. Mangini needs to be a Chess Grand Master otherwise all the improvements he's made in 3 years will be negated with one bad call. He's getting better but still makes mistakes, while our previous coach NEVER got better and only hired people even more inept than he was to manage things that required little more than unfolding his arms on the sideline, is defended to the death by some posters. If Leon Johnson doesn't run back a punt or kick return in the next two games, he's in danger of having the entire message board calling for his replacement by someone from the practice squad that's just getting over an injury from his breakout preseason 3rd quarter where he caught a remarkable 19 yard pass from Kellan Clemens. Vernon Gallstone is a beast.... Ratliff is the next Brett Favre......anythign else I've forgotten?
First off if we didn't have Farve this year we would not be close to wear we are now. Ratliff would not be bringing us to the playoffs in his first year so Brett has been nothing but a blessing. But one thing I did expect to see by now would be a deep ball completed down field for a touchdown. I was thinking Coles or Stuckey but no one has been able to stretch the field. And if they do throw it downfield it is 10 feet off and interecepted. I would like to see something atleast get close I don't get how Farve has miss thrown all over those passes so far. This has been a great turn around year and we should start giving Farve his credit he is a beast.
I'm not trying to open the Chad vs. Favre debate again but to sat we wouldn't be close to where we are now w/o Brett and w/ Chad is nonsense seeing what Chad has done w/ a far less talented team in Miami.
yes, go after TJ from Cinn. Great player and good guy. and always gives 100% even when the rest of the team has given up. But that doesn't help the jets this season.
Bingo! ...and its funny to see Junc jumping right in with Chad juice still dribbling off his chin! :rofl: Our receivers had a bad week last week, but a good one before that. Junc needs to turn to Chad right away. Nice move! :rofl2:
I can play this game too. Okay, here go. Let's see what Chad HASN'T "done" in Miami that led them to these wins and to where they are today. 3 examples of this of the top of my head that I can think of right now. Miami @ New England - Final 38-13 Miami. (Let me introduce you to...the Wildcat formation) Ronnie Brown: 4 rushing TD's, 1 passing TD. Chad 0 TD, 0 INT. Take away all those Ronnie Brown's TD's and you got Patriots winning 13-3. Seahawks @ Miami - Final 21-19 Miami. Ricky "Sticky" Williams: 1 rushing TD off the Wildcat. Ronnie Brown: 1 rushing TD off the Wildcat. Chad: 1 TD off Flea Flicker, 1 INT returned for a TD. Remove those 2 Wildcat TD's and Seahawks would've won 19-7. Oakland @ Miami - Final 17-15 Miami. Tedd Ginn on an endaround TD. Patrick Cobbs runs it in on an initial Wildcat formation, which got audibled. Chad: 0 TD's, 0 INT. By the way, I don't want to hear that Chad led them to a comback win when the Dolphins were down 15-14 with 4 mins left to go in the 4th. Remember...you don't believe it's a comeback unless it's by 14 points or more. :wink: All in all, you take away all that Ronnie Brown and Ricky "Sticky" Williams points and what they've done for their team and you've pretty much got what Chad would've produced for the Dolphins in those three games leading them to a 5-7 season right now. I toss them for losses, because this would mean the CS would be putting the offense on Chad's (limping) shoulders to win these games and...well, we all know how well he handles them. See, it's easy to pick, choose, remove outcomes, remove scores and second-guess plays all day long to fit my argument. It's easy and you can do it too. :grin:
1) Really? That's a ridiculous standard you've set, but to each his own i guess. Playing from behind is playing from behind....plain and simple. No QB would have more than 3 or 4 comeback wins by your standards. I can't think of too many games in which a team comes from 4th quarter deficit that large to get a victory. 2) He should be given some credit. Obviously the INT detracts from the entire scenario, but would you prefer that he didn't? How would Favre rate for you if he throws the pick 6 and then follows it up with a failed attempt to regain the lead? I'm interested to see how you'll put a negative spin on this one.... 3) The "excuse" as you put it is legit. If you'd seen more than a stat sheet on Favre's 500 career TDs, you'd know that he throws a ton of them into small windows. This was no exception, and the throw was on the money. The Coles TD at Tennessee is a perfect example. There were at least 3 defenders there but Favre stuck it in there. Why aren't you crying about that "bad decision"? 4) Everything's an excuse when it doesn't suit you, huh? Its as simple as that.....Baker doesn't slip, and the Jets are in FG range. You expect Favre to go out and throw for 300 yards and 3 TDs or its all on him. Those games don't happen every week. Brett made some throws in that game when they needed them. Its not his fault the receivers played so poorly. In fact, the Denver game was their worst overall performance since the Raiders game. Now stop your fuckin' whining. Everything on offense isn't Favre's fault.
Its not a fascination. Its just kind of looks like we spent twice the money to get a QB who is doing the same thing as Chad. Maybe doing it better maybe worse - thats debatable. Anyone who thinks throwing screen passes for TD's in the red zone is something only Favre can do...well? Or throwing 5 or 8 yards outs to a usually wide open Keller is something only Favre could do... Or handing the ball off to TJ, LW What exactly has Favre brought to the table for us? He reads the defense poorly, makes bad decisions when the game plan isn't dumbed down, cant move in the pocket. ETC.
You give all the credit to the phins running game when ours is way better. You dont take that away from favre? Ask fin fans and they will tell you to a man that Chad is the teams MVP.
I also mentioned Clemens but that gets ignored. The guy bashed our WRs, I defended them. We have an excellent starting duo, maybe some of it is their fault but favre deserves blame too for not getting it down the field. That's nonsense. The dolphins are good mostly b/c of Chad. How were the dolphins last year w/ Ronnie Brown healthy? How were they 2 years ago? Sure the backs get most of the credit for the Pats win and you can credit them for Seattle but he did lead them to the winning FG against Oak and if we are crediting those guys w/ certain wins then I guess Miami would have 3 wins right now instead of 7?
I cant even fathom people who rather have chad pennington than brett favre as your quaterback, or at least imply it. (love you chad but gotta be real) and to say youd rather have ANY other quaterback over brett favre (among those that were available) is also ridiculous. You also get the privilege to watch a hall of fame QB every sunday playing as a new york jet. quit your bitchin please. Hes giving us a good season too, not to mention.
In those 3 games, yes. Yes I do. You see it otherwise in those 3 games? I'd like to know where. The point here was that junc mentions what CHAD had done to get Miami to 7-5. When I look at those games in particular, I don't see Chad doing anything special, yet they won. Mostly on trickery plays, but they won regardless. I don't take that away from Chad or the Dolphins as a whole. But Junc has been notorious for coming on here and win or lose (exception of the NE game) and picking apart plays, outcomes, scoring, of the offense, especially when it comes to Favre (except the NE game, that's the 1 game I think he gave Brett any props really). It's just annoying. Also, I don't need to go really far to ask a fins fan whether Chad is MVP or not, I can pretty much assume how they feel going by the affection that's still being shown here for this Ex-Jet.
This is where you guys get crazy. I am notorious for being FAIR. I have been praising Favre the last month and I didn't criticize him at all for Sunday's loss even though he was awful. Again, how did Miami do w/ a BETTER Ronnie Brown last season? 2 years ago? Chad has made all the difference on that team. Miami hasn't been in serious postseason contention this late in a season since 2003. They haven't made the postseason since '01 and they have had more talented teams than they assembled this year but Chad has tied it all together. I am happy w/ Favre but that doesn't mean we would have sucked w/ Chad when Chad is 1 game behind us w/ half the talent.
Junc, I don't watch many Fins games, those are 3 off the top of my head that I actually watched. If I wanted to, I could go to NFL.com and read a Play-By-Play of all the Dolphins games and let you know all the games where a Chad TD or Chad comeback made the difference in the game, but instead, I think I'll go watch flies fuck. I forgot to mention two things in the OAK game, first was how Chad gave up a safety, second was how the Raiders would've STILL won that game 15-3. The 3 is from the Chad FG drive there towards the end. So right there, is Chad's due. If you see anything different, let me know.
That team would probably have 3-4 wins if Chad was still w/ the Jets. That's all you really need to know. Up until about 2-3 weeks ago Brown was averaging under 4 YPC. Chad has been the MVP of that team.
[QUOTE Apparently you didn't read my posts where I said I wouldn't say anything negative b/c he had been playing well until Sunday but no a 3 pt comeback is not a big deal especially when we wouldn't have needed the comeback if he didn't keep KC in the game. QUOTE] Uhm, whether or not you believe a comeback from 3 points down is a "big deal" is comptetely irrelevant. The bottom line is, it counts as a comeback for Brett Favre just as it counts as a comeback for every other quarerback in the NFL. As I said in my first post, I think the statistic is tremendously overvalued by fans and pundits, and in point of fact, I think the statistic is just about meaningless (For the very same reasons that I explained in my first post). However, just because the statistic is a meaningless one doesn't mean that you get to change the rules of how the statistic is applied based on whether or not you like the particular quarterback in question. I doubt very seriously that you would have said the same thing if we were talking about Chad Pennington's team coming back form 3 points down to win in the final minutes of regulation.
Looks like this is slowly turning into another "nyjunc (for all intents and purposes, Chad Pennington himself) vs. The rest of the civilized Jet fans on this message board" thread.
