Who Should Be The Opening Day Starter?

Discussion in 'New York Jets' started by PulseJet, Aug 22, 2017.

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Who should be the Jets Opening Day Starter?

  1. McCown

    20 vote(s)
    25.6%
  2. Hackenberg

    16 vote(s)
    20.5%
  3. Petty

    42 vote(s)
    53.8%
  1. jcass10

    jcass10 Well-Known Member

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    I largely agree with this. From a player development/tanking point of view, easy decision. Go with Hack. If he ends up being good, well thats awesome. If he continues to be awful, you can easily go into the offseason with a QB as your top option.

    But as a coach, I dont know how you can justify to the rest of the team starting Hack.
     
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  2. FJF

    FJF 2018 MVP Joe Namath Award Winner

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    That somewhere is San Diego, and he is showing that the patience would have been wasted
     
  3. 101GangGreen101

    101GangGreen101 2018 Thread of the Year Award Winner

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    Your argument is why I think the Jets need to play him. Otherwise, they'll continue to think he's the future or salvageable. The next Jets qb I want that qb to get all of the reps, all of the attention. Will this happen if Hack doesn't play?
     
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  4. BacktoQueens

    BacktoQueens Well-Known Member

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    You are missing his point.
    The Jets cannot let a 2nd round pick, who in your example was unable to win the starting job, deter them from drafting another QB.
    Hack could still compete with that QB the following year, and may the best man win.

    They cannot continue putting all their eggs in one QB basket for multiple years before repeating that same exercise again.......especially with 2nd and 4th round picks.
     
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  5. legler82

    legler82 Well-Known Member

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    More than likely this CS will be gone and this will be all moot as a new CS won't care about appeasing Hackenberg. But regardless of CS, if we draft a QB high in the first round next year, we will see ultimately see what we have in said QB because the investment warrants it. Hack may still get an opportunity to compete that first year but the writing will be on the wall. Furthermore, where the QB we draft is in terms of development would probably dictate his reps as rookie not his draft status or whether or not Hack is salvageable.
     
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  6. 101GangGreen101

    101GangGreen101 2018 Thread of the Year Award Winner

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    And the Jets just did this with Geno did they not? I don't think the Jets got an accurate reading of Hack when you are constantly switching lineman in and out and not allowing certain players to play.

    Not that I am making excuses for Hack, but I am sick of qb competitions that quite frankly don't lead to anything. The next qb needs to have all of the resources allocated to him. Hack and Petty need to be after thoughts or at best lower their expectations as being nothing more then a backup.
     
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  7. 101GangGreen101

    101GangGreen101 2018 Thread of the Year Award Winner

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    Fair, good response. The new cs will hopefully pick the new qb and work with that qb. Jets can't allocate the time to Hack, they need to allocate that time to the new qb. Hopefully the new hc knows what the qb does best and implements his strengths into the system.
     
  8. legler82

    legler82 Well-Known Member

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    As a general rule I'm all about earning playing time regardless of draft position. My one exception is a first round pick QB, especially one drafted high. Then and only then do I allow for the "see what you have..." argument. When you draft a QB high in the 1st round; you should in IMO do everything within reason to try to yield the most out of the investment. Hack, Petty, Geno, Clemens...etc. did not fall in that category, so they had/have to earn it.
     
  9. FJF

    FJF 2018 MVP Joe Namath Award Winner

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    The earn it method hasn't yielded much,not sure if going all in on one of them would have change things but maybe investing more time in to just one of them instead of the qb comp thing that just bears mediocrity would have gave us more. It's been a qb driven league for more than a while now, isn't about time the jets put all their resources into developing one, regardless of draft status? The way things have been I can't see where it would hurt.
     
  10. PulseJet

    PulseJet Well-Known Member

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    Kellen Clemens, a 10 year veteran. Had a pretty decent career as a backup....One of the more successful Jet QB draft pics. I guess I'm one of those fans bitching about Petty's reps. I have watched every Jet snap and read every report and it looks like he picking up the WC offense and improved alot, particularly of late. He shows flashes of being a very good QB who needs to develop consistency. He made maybe one poor throw last game, and about 20 good reads and throws.

    Given the Jets success at the position, they should leave no stone unturned. If there is even a 5 percent chance he can turn into a good starter, you need to play him this year instead of McCown, who provides nothing except as a mentor/cheerleader.

    Hopefully the discussion among the coaches is rather than who gives the Jets the best chance to win, whether the young QB's can implement the offense. I believe Petty has shown he can but he needs to prove it in a game.
     
    #30 PulseJet, Aug 22, 2017
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2017
  11. legler82

    legler82 Well-Known Member

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    Maybe I'm a [too?] fast and/or poor evaluator of talent, but I don't see flashes of a very good [starting] QB from Petty. I do see a quality back-up which was my ceiling for him coming out. I'm ready to move on from him as our future FQB but not as a Jet.

    The problem with the "...no stone unturned.../...5 percent chance..." strategy is time. Without building up some serious cache, no CS, especially in NY, can afford giving a 2nd, let alone a 4th, round QB that kind of opportunity without getting some serious returns in terms of wins out of it. The only kind of QB prospect that can buy a CS more time is one drafted high in the first and even that is not guaranteed. If the Bowles and Mac were serious about rebuilding, they would have drafted a QB in the first round in year 1 or 2. Because they didn't, they are crunch for time and pretty much stuck with having to play the guy that gives them the best chance to win as in the NFL, wins = more time for CS. None of this is fair but that's the way it works.
     
  12. slimjasi

    slimjasi Well-Known Member

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    I don't see the point in starting McCown. Never have. Unless, you are Todd Bowles, of course. And, therein lies the problem. We are trying to rebuild with a head coach who is trying to win as many games as possible to save his job.

    Now, as others have pointed out, McCown has a ridiculously poor record as a starter, so we may not be killing ourselves with meaningless wins after all. Still, it still makes infinitely more sense to play the kids.
     
  13. ColoradoContrails

    ColoradoContrails Well-Known Member

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    Along that line, the Jets have never taken a QB - except for Namath - and then built the team around his strengths. Frankly, I think that's why they rarely take one in the 1st round - and when they did, with Sanchez, they STILL didn't build the team around him. It's like, "If we take a QB in the 2nd or lower round, we don't have to cater to him, he has to learn to fit OUR system". And of course the Jet's "system" is "All "D", all the time". Or maybe they're terrified that if they draft a QB with their 1st pick they know they're going to screw him up, and then they'll be exposed for the offensive dunces they are. What's really scary is that they'll wind up in a spot to pick a great QB and actually pull the trigger, but Bowles will still be the HC and he'll completely fuck him up.

    Best case scenario: The Jets win no more than 3 games; Bowles is fired; Jets hire an offense-minded HC; Jets draft their FQB.
     
  14. PulseJet

    PulseJet Well-Known Member

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    I dont think winning with McCown buys them anything. In fact I think it proves to the fanbase they couldnt evaluate talent, draft properly or develop a QB. So it basically ushers them out the door for someone who could develop the QB. Their only chance at sticking is if Hack or Petty shows some flashes. At least enough to show they should be given another shot. I think Hack is a longshot this year (see this film review) and Petty is their best chance. But obviously Bowles disagrees!

    Also, I dont get this thought that there will even be a QB savior available in the 2018 draft. Darnold may not declare, there could be injuries (Rosen shoulder surgery), these guys can have a poor season like Hack at Penn St etc. This whole talk of tanking is insane.
     
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  15. ColoradoContrails

    ColoradoContrails Well-Known Member

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    I vote for Petty getting a real shot. McCown gives them nothing to build upon, even if he wins a few for them. If Petty wins a few, while it might damage their draft position, it might also show that he's capable of winning a lot more with the right pieces. I still don't think he's their FQB, but he might help carry them until they find one. If he flames out, then if Hack is ready, bring him in; if not, then bring in McCown, but at that point they'll know what they have.

    All that said, Bowles is NOT going to pick Petty. Here's what he said in theNY Post yesterday:

    After the loss to the Lions, Bowles did not sound like he was overly impressed with what Petty had done.

    “Well, he moved the ball, but again, we didn’t score any points,” Bowles said of Petty. “So, when you don’t score any points, then you can’t win ballgames. But he had some good throws and some good plays here and there.”


    To show how clueless - and close-minded - Bowles is, note that he completely discounts the two FGs that Petty enabled them to get. Last time I checked FGs = Points. But I guess an idiot "D"-obsessed coach wouldn't understand that.
     
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  16. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    We'll have to agree to disagree.

    What is this year? It's a rebuilding year. It's THE perfect time to play a young QB and go all in on developing him. They have the whole year. Once the Jets determined that this was going to be a rebuilding year, they should have gone all in to surround him with weapons and a strong OL. The problem was they had little or no cap space for this year, and it wasn't a good draft for OL. Also, they knew that Hack was still a project. They could have decided to go with Petty, but evidently, they've already given up on him.

    Are you serious? Your "If the Bowles and Mac..." statement makes zero sense. One, the way Woody set up the org chart, Bowles and Mac were set in opposition from the get go. Unless Bowles had been told by Woody and his boss (Mac) that the Jets were going to be rebuilding and his job was to develop the young players, his job was to win as many games as possible. If he had been told up front that the Jets were going to be rebuilding in 2015, he may never have taken the job. Because Mac and Bowles are peers, Mac could never order Bowles to do anything.

    It's Mac's job to assess the talent, set a course, and build the team. If he thought the Jets could build a consistent winner with the roster they had in 2015 and by adding Fitz, he's dumb and should be fired today. Before they were even hired, Woody said that he was fed up with the Jets not making the playoffs and the mandate for the team, and then Bowles and Mac when they were hired, was to make the playoffs ASAP. Thus, a rebuild/youth movement was out of the question at that time.

    As for drafting a QB in the 1st round in 2015, that's easy for you to say, but whom would you have had Mac take? Winston and Mariota were the consensus top two QBs. I believe that Mac inquired about trading up for Mariota, but the Titans said that they weren't trading the pick, or it would have cost a ton of high picks, and for a team that had a mandate to make the playoffs, one can't trade away a bunch of top picks. If the Jets hadn't won a meaningless game against the Titans in 2014, they could have had Mariota. Would you have had Mac make a colossal reach for Garrett Grayson or Sean Mannion, or Petty in the 1st round?

    In the 2016 draft, there was still no talk of a complete rebuild or youth movement, so the same thing applies. He couldn't spend a bunch of picks to move up. Even if he could, imo Jared Goff would have been an awful pick. I really liked Wentz, but Jets fans would have rioted if Mac had traded up for him (assuming that Philly would have even been willing to deal the pick). Would you have had him take Paxton Lynch, yet another spread QB who wasn't used to making reads, going through his progressions, etc., and can't even unseat Siemian in Denver? Would you have had him take Hack in the first round, or maybe made a colossal reach and taken Jacoby Brissett or Cody Kessler?

    Guy, you're a MUCH smarter , more knowledgeable poster, and better poster than this. You can't just throw out general statements like that.

    Mac did the best he could with the mandate he had from Woody, and with the QBs that were available in those drafts. It's ridiculous to claim otherwise.
     
    #36 NCJetsfan, Aug 22, 2017
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2017
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  17. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    In addition, Petty's throw to Leggett should have been a TD. It was a great throw.

    Bowles is a moron. If he isn't fired following this season, regardless of what happens, I'm done with this joke of a team.
     
  18. legler82

    legler82 Well-Known Member

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    Call it "tanking" call it "stinking" whatever you want; we are not going to win many games.
     
  19. ColoradoContrails

    ColoradoContrails Well-Known Member

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    The problem is, we haven't actually heard Woody, Macc, or Bowles say this. True, the moves they've made IMPLY this, but I find it very strange that they haven't actually admitted it. Maybe that's because they can't, afraid they'll drive ticket holders away. But maybe it's because they really aren't all on the same page. Macc probably sees it as a rebuilding year, but I doubt that the guy who fills out the line up does, and I think Woody just wants to win, and has no clue how to go about it, willing to sacrifice long term success for short term meaningless wins. I don't think Woody has the stomach for watching a whole season of games like the Lions game, nor do most fans, so as the losses mount, he's going to give Bowles the mandate to "play the guys who give us the best chance to win (now)". I hope I'm wrong, and that they go with Petty, or Hack, and let them learn on the job. Either they'll get better as the season progresses, or they won't. but in any case the Jets will have a much better idea of what to do going forward.
     
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  20. SOJAZ

    SOJAZ Well-Known Member

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    Couldn't agree more... I voted for Petty because hack is not ready and may not be for another year and McClown is just that ....
     

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